[VigoTheCarpathian]

I hate love in fantasy...not all of it, just the most obvious, and most stupid aspects that sometimes worm into fantasy. Irreconcilable, forbidden love of the kind that drives the plot, and that provides motivation and/or hackneyed thoughts and dialogue.

Mr. Goodkind, with Richard just holding on for Kahlan, and needing Kahlan, and carving things for Kahlan, and taking Kahlan back after she knocked boots with someone else (she thought).

Another example would be Tomas in the Feist books: just so in love with the elvish queen that he had to become a bad ass, and reclaim her, and flout convention, etc.

Don't have any other examples off the top of my head, but I'm sure I've blocked out several others just to keep me from retching.

[McLovin]

Probably the worst example of the whole unrequited love bit (though not romantic) was Caramon pining for his brother Raistlin in the Dragonlance books (the first six of them, anyway)...jeez, no wonder he hates you, you big whiny puke...

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Longhorn, is that a picture of Zod or Terry Goodkind?

[Morgoth]

they're one and the same, didn't you know?

[bwgan]

I am so glad someone asked that question (he's really the baddie from Superman isn't he? :confused: ) but he is sporting such a good yeard!:outta:

[Astra]

I am reading through this topic, and I start to wonder....all the valid points, you say here, are the reasons why people don't like Fantasy. The question is why the heck to even bother to read Fantasy then?

[Whelp]

It is the cruel, masochistic streak in us

[Morgoth]

because many authors don't really use the stereotypes, or in some cases they intentionaly play with them.. GRRM, SE, Bakker, Mieville are all good examples of this I think

[McLovin]

bwgan said:

I am so glad someone asked that question (he's really the baddie from Superman isn't he? :confused: ) but he is sporting such a good yeard!:outta:

COME TO ME, FANS OF ERIKSON! KNEEL BEFORE GOODKIND!!!!

MWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!

[bwgan]

Please don't...I am a sensitive soul and that really...is...frightening...:eek:

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

astra_lestat said:

I am reading through this topic, and I start to wonder....all the valid points, you say here, are the reasons why people don't like Fantasy. The question is why the heck to even bother to read Fantasy then?

I ask myself that sometimes. The answer is, even if you have to wade through the crap of 20 bad authors, when you find a good one, it's amazing. I was about to give up on fantasy for awhile when I stumbled onto SE. I enjoy it so much it makes it worth it that I had to be sucjected to the likes of Goodkind before I found him. Now, I don't know where to turn until the next SE book comes out. Any suggestions?

[Astra]

astra_lestat said:

So far, I didn't like when Robin Hobb allowed this pirate to get away with the rape of a woman. This was so ****ing frustrating. I could not believe she could write it at all. What a sort of example is it for youngsters? You can do it and not be punished if you are smart? Has she gone through the process herself, so she wrote about it? No idea.

Someone has given me a bad rep for this post
I don't give a **** about the rep. However, I am very curious why you said: So wrong?
if you go here, post 24 http://www.malazanempire.com/forums/showth...p?t=4862&page=3

you will see, that Hobb is one of my favorite writers. What I said about this particular episode, doesn't make her a bad writer at all. Could you please explain to me why do you think I am "so wrong"? Maybe I misundertood something, I will only be happy if you convince me otherwise.
Thank you in advance

[Aimless]

You don't even have to be particularly smart. The truth is, rapists DO get away with rape. It shouldn't be seen as an example for youngsters because youngsters have no business reading Hobb anyway Ò.Ó


EDIT:But I have no idea why your secret admirer objected to that post though

[Abyss]

I would say the trop of 'evil and/or tragically misunderstood beings/demons/elves/angels/devils/zombies/mormons/transexuals locked away behind a dimensional barrier chaffing to break out again and conquer/rape/pillage/war/kill/destroy/retake/reconquer/etc' has been utterly done to death and beyond.

The 'commoner grows up to be a prince/king/champion/CEO/etc' one is a classic, and it can be done semi-originally, but often is not.

- Abyss, future messiah.

[Werthead]

raymondluxuryyacht said:

I ask myself that sometimes. The answer is, even if you have to wade through the crap of 20 bad authors, when you find a good one, it's amazing. I was about to give up on fantasy for awhile when I stumbled onto SE. I enjoy it so much it makes it worth it that I had to be sucjected to the likes of Goodkind before I found him. Now, I don't know where to turn until the next SE book comes out. Any suggestions?

In no particular order: Scott Lynch, R. Scott Bakker, George RR Martin, Jack Vance, JV Jones, Neil Gaiman, Terry Pratchett, Robert Rankin, Christopher Priest, or Guy Gavriel Kay.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

Abyss said:

I would say the trop of 'evil and/or tragically misunderstood beings/demons/elves/angels/devils/zombies/mormons/transexuals locked away behind a dimensional barrier chaffing to break out again and conquer/rape/pillage/war/kill/destroy/retake/reconquer/etc' has been utterly done to death and beyond.

The 'commoner grows up to be a prince/king/champion/CEO/etc' one is a classic, and it can be done semi-originally, but often is not.

- Abyss, future messiah.

I agree with both of these. Don't these evil beings have anything better to do in their own dimension? Also pretty tired of the rags to riches/immense power storyline. Been done to death, plus, does anyone else find it vaguely creepy how many adult books are written about the exploits of young boys? I understand the whole rite of passage/coming of age thing, but still. Oh, and still laughing about throwing mormons in there.