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The Black Company - hoping it would be better
#1
Posted 26 April 2006 - 01:34 PM
Having read some discussions about the work of Glen Cook on this site and also on the recommendations of a mate in Canada, I finally got round to checking out some of Glen Cooks work. Perhaps optimistically I ordered the first three volumes via amazon and thought that, with something like another six books to digest after these three, I could have a nice reading stack to get me through to the next Erikson installment.
I'm half-way through the second book of these three and far from certain that it's worth the effort of continuation. As interesting as a concise, lean, first-person narrative is as a vehicle for fantasy, the books don't come close to cutting the mustard. Characterisation is piss-poor, too many characters acting in either entirely predictable stereotypical ways or in a manner that makes no sense whatsoever. World building? You gotta be kidding. Info dumping? Oh yeah, pages of it. Fleshed-out and logical magic systems? Nope. Rather lots of twirly-fingers-flash-of-light stuff. And my god, so repetitive... Card game. Batter the rebels. Mock fight between One-eye and Goblin. Kill a Taken. Take a new Taken. Rebels fight back. Repeat.
In short, very disappointing thus far, perhaps because I've grown bloated and spoiled by some of the great fantasy fare that's coming out these days. Does anyone have a passionate defense of this series that is likely to make me keep reading? I think I'm hoping someone will say "yeah the first two books are dross but book three onwards are great" otherwise the charity shop is going to get three new books to sell.
I'm half-way through the second book of these three and far from certain that it's worth the effort of continuation. As interesting as a concise, lean, first-person narrative is as a vehicle for fantasy, the books don't come close to cutting the mustard. Characterisation is piss-poor, too many characters acting in either entirely predictable stereotypical ways or in a manner that makes no sense whatsoever. World building? You gotta be kidding. Info dumping? Oh yeah, pages of it. Fleshed-out and logical magic systems? Nope. Rather lots of twirly-fingers-flash-of-light stuff. And my god, so repetitive... Card game. Batter the rebels. Mock fight between One-eye and Goblin. Kill a Taken. Take a new Taken. Rebels fight back. Repeat.
In short, very disappointing thus far, perhaps because I've grown bloated and spoiled by some of the great fantasy fare that's coming out these days. Does anyone have a passionate defense of this series that is likely to make me keep reading? I think I'm hoping someone will say "yeah the first two books are dross but book three onwards are great" otherwise the charity shop is going to get three new books to sell.
#2
Posted 26 April 2006 - 02:06 PM
IMO the second and third books are weak, but from then on, the story rises again - if you like mixed mythology-based, sweeping tales.
Also, take into account that these are not exactly new novels...
- Characterisation: hmm, I would say that there are not more stereotypical characters, than in an average fantasy novel. And besides, how many other novels feature average mercenaries selling themselves to the Dark Side as protagonists?
- World building: ok, he does not go in Tolkienesque depths, so what? It still works, imo.
- Magic: the system is not bad imo. The "ordinary" wizards have access only to minor spells, the really powerful spells belong to half-immortal Taken. So what? This is not a magic-centered world. As for repetition, I felt it no more than while reading Quick Ben or Tayschrenn using magic...
In short, it is a quite good low-magic, dark fantasy setting.
Also, take into account that these are not exactly new novels...
- Characterisation: hmm, I would say that there are not more stereotypical characters, than in an average fantasy novel. And besides, how many other novels feature average mercenaries selling themselves to the Dark Side as protagonists?
- World building: ok, he does not go in Tolkienesque depths, so what? It still works, imo.
- Magic: the system is not bad imo. The "ordinary" wizards have access only to minor spells, the really powerful spells belong to half-immortal Taken. So what? This is not a magic-centered world. As for repetition, I felt it no more than while reading Quick Ben or Tayschrenn using magic...
In short, it is a quite good low-magic, dark fantasy setting.
#3 Guest_Fool_*
Posted 26 April 2006 - 02:37 PM
I liked books 4-9 a lot more than the first 3. More interesting characters (Lady and Croaker especially), better world building, and generally a little less pulp and more substance. Also liked his use of catch phrases. The first time you read "water sleeps" you're like huh? By the end of the book you want to put on little devil horns every time it comes up. A bit clumsy but it works.
But then i really like the grunt characters, especially after reading a lot of vietnam war fiction and autobiographies. I wouldnt mind having a whole book of goblin and one-eye fighting. So if you really dont like them, you might want to call it quits now.
But then i really like the grunt characters, especially after reading a lot of vietnam war fiction and autobiographies. I wouldnt mind having a whole book of goblin and one-eye fighting. So if you really dont like them, you might want to call it quits now.
#4
Posted 26 April 2006 - 05:00 PM
I've grabbed most of the series from second hand stores, so with little expectation or expenditure, i havn't been dissappointed.
It's not SE, GRRM or similar caliber, but good enough to keep me picking up the novels as i find them. And I did buy two from amazon when i didn't spot them used after a while.
They won't occupy a space of honour on my bookshelf after i'm done the series, but i will read them all.
- Abyss, wants his own flying whale.
It's not SE, GRRM or similar caliber, but good enough to keep me picking up the novels as i find them. And I did buy two from amazon when i didn't spot them used after a while.
They won't occupy a space of honour on my bookshelf after i'm done the series, but i will read them all.
- Abyss, wants his own flying whale.
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#5
Posted 04 May 2006 - 10:34 PM
The BC novels are bare-bones gritty military fantasy and never tried to be anything else. It seems to me that you either love them or hate them with little or no middle-ground. I love them myself; the bleak feel of the company, the character and city names, the under-described world. I was on a Glen Cook kick before my current Jack Vance marathon, so the books are still fresh in my mind. Ah, Glen Cook and Jack Vance, my two favorite writers, largely ignored for the most part. A sad state of affairs.
"The commodore says you're a fucking asshole."
#6
Posted 05 May 2006 - 02:03 PM
I dunno - i'd say i'm pretty squarely in the middle-ground, myself. Like them, don't love them, read them, but not tempted to re-read anytime soon.
- Abyss, stuck in the middle with you...
- Abyss, stuck in the middle with you...
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#7
Posted 05 May 2006 - 02:49 PM
It is nice to read fantasy that's under 400 pages, every once in a while. Aside from MBOTF and ASOIAF, I'm really tired of the 800+ page multi-volume epic fantasy series.
OK, I think I got it, but just in case, can you say the whole thing over again? I wasn't really listening.
#8
Posted 05 May 2006 - 11:04 PM
For me the most difficult book was the first one.It took me a while to figure out what is going on. Book 7 is also a bit odd. The rest are very good IMHO.
Only Two Things Are Infinite, The Universe and Human Stupidity, and I'm Not Sure About The Former.
Albert Einstein
Albert Einstein
#9
Posted 08 May 2006 - 04:28 PM
The original three BC novels are the books that brought me back to fantasy. It proved to me that someone could spin well-written fantasy without just moving around Tolkien's furniture. I enjoyed the bare bones writing style, sometimes an economy of words is welcome. We don't always need the depth of detail of Martin or Erikson, Cook just puts the accelerator to the floor and rarely lets up. And Croaker's narration just sold it all so well.
"I can see my days of not taking you seriously are coming to a middle." - Mal Reynolds
#10 Guest_Swordbearer_*
Posted 12 May 2006 - 08:56 PM
I Liked them. I prefered his others set in Kavelin and Al Remish about Bragi Ragnarson, Haakon Blackfang, Micah al Rahmi, Haroun bin Youseff, Mocker. Varthlokur and a bunch of others First book was titled The fire in His Hands #2 With mercey toward None. and more allso.
#11 Guest_Binadas_*
Posted 20 May 2006 - 03:27 PM
IMHO The Black Company and Dread Empire books are well worth the read. At the time I read them there was little else in fantasy that was so dark, gritty ot human. I suspect as SE tells us these books were the muse for alot of the great stuff we read today.
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