[Dolorous Menhir]

cauthon;151805 said:

I am wondering ... I think WJ is older than Dujek, as he once commanded Dujek when the latter was young. It would be strange for a commander to be even younger than a trooper, no?

As for Scillara, you can still not show anything at 4 months. so there's some time to play with there.

Don't think so, Dujek is meant to be 79 as of GotM, and I doubt Whiskeyjack is past 80.

Plus younger men command older ones all the time. For example, Paran was made captain of the Bridgeburners in what, his early 20s or even younger. He would've been much younger than all the BB's except Sorry. Age doesn't have to progress as you go up the chain of command.

[Mentalist]

I didn't read all of the thread, so i dunno if anyone mentioned htis before, but it's an idea that's been in my head for a while.
Its about MT. i was thinking about how major stuff in MT is related to the death of the Azath House, and knowing how SE loves the notion of convergences, i tried to place this on a timeline and try to make it correspond with a fundamental event in a diff. part of the world.
What do you think about this--the death of the Azath house and the emergence of the Death Hold on Lether coincided with... the Itko Kan massacre of 1661?
p.s., also i haven't re-read MoI in a while, but is there actual proof that Callows was destroyed by the Edur? I, for one always assumed that it was the stromriders that we keep hearing about..

[mmdw45]

cauthon;151805 said:

I am wondering ... I think WJ is older than Dujek, as he once commanded Dujek when the latter was young. It would be strange for a commander to be even younger than a trooper, no?

Can't be so if Fiddler's memory is trustworthy. Whiskeyjack was still an apprentice when Dunsparrow was born, and Fiddler calculates Dunsparrow's likely age in BH as late twenties, so Whiskeyjack died at around age fifty at the very most.

-Max

[mmdw45]

kud13;192195 said:

p.s., also i haven't re-read MoI in a while, but is there actual proof that Callows was destroyed by the Edur? I, for one always assumed that it was the stromriders that we keep hearing about..

The Edur are not named, but K'rul (who should know) says that these murderers from the sea are looking for "a worthy challenge, no less." He also calls them "deliverers of midnight tides," IIRC. Sounds like the Tiste Edur to me.

-Max

[Dolorous Menhir]

mmdw45;192235 said:

Can't be so if Fiddler's memory is trustworthy. Whiskeyjack was still an apprentice when Dunsparrow was born, and Fiddler calculates Dunsparrow's likely age in BH as late twenties, so Whiskeyjack died at around age fifty at the very most.

-Max

Best not to think about Dunsparrow's age. It doesn't make any sense at all. Fiddler and Whiskeyjack have been Malazan soldiers for a lot more than 20-odd years.

[mmdw45]

Dolorous Menhir;192239 said:

Best not to think about Dunsparrow's age. It doesn't make any sense at all. Fiddler and Whiskeyjack have been Malazan soldiers for a lot more than 20-odd years.

Hence the qualifier about Fiddler's memory. Certainly, prior to reading that bit about Dunsparrow, my impression was that Fiddler et al. had been soldiers for decades and decades (Fiddler naming Braven Tooth, Whiskeyjack being Dujek's "oldest friend") but then again there are other things that made it seem a bit more recent (Bridgeburners' creation having been during an abortive uprising in Seven Cities, while the initial few decades of the empire were spent conquering Quon Tali; Quick Ben's sister does not seem to be an old woman; Lostara Yil's first encounter with QB when he still had a rep as a High Priest of Shadow implies he was not a long-time squad mage, and she's not all that old). It's possible that the Malazan Empire as we know it is not all that much older than Laseen's reign; Moranth munitions have only been in use for the past 10-15 years. The balance of evidence suggests to me that Whiskeyjack, Fiddler, et al. are old for soldiers but still only 45-50 years old.

-Max
Who used to like Laseen a lot more. Now I hope she rots, quickly. I'm sick of her incompetence.

[Dolorous Menhir]

Personally, I think a huge deal of confusion around Malazan ages would be removed if the GotM age of the Empire (~100 years) was revised downwards, a lot. But that's one piece of GotM info that definitely does not seem to be a GotMism.

[Deragoth]

Ellestra;111235 said:

TBH took more then 3-4 months - Scillara went from not showing (probably 2-3 months along) to giving birth and then some stuff happened later so is more like around 7 months.

Basing the timeline of this would be sketchy.

[wintermute]

Besides, I think the big issue is how long things have been going on before the series starts. Where did we get 100 years? I have assumed at least 150 based on Tattersail saying in GotM that she was 218 years old, and had been Mock's lover before Kellanved's takeover. I got the impression she wasn't very old when that happened. However, that could be pretty offbase.

[Dolorous Menhir]

It's based on the GotM prologue:

Quote

96th year of the Malazan Empire
The Last Year of Emperor Kellanved's Reign

Plus roughly nine years of Laseen as of GotM, and you get the approximately 100 years commonly referenced on the forums.

[Khadgar]

Another thing I haven't seen mentioned is the possibility that the Malazan standard year is much shorter than an "earth year". When you consider that, the biblically long lifespans for people like Braven Tooth, the Crust brothers, Laseen, etc all make more sense.

Then again, it may just be that Erikson isn't quite as anal about his timeline as we are. God knows that writing 7 epic novels with a dozen storylines in under ten years is an incredible feat, things are bound to get muddled.

[Warqueen]

considering that even when dead these poeple keep coming back I think the matter of age doesn't really matter...how many years the empire has been around maybe but other than that I gave up on the age of anyone...I guess it's enough that they are there and part of the present thread...::confused:
oh..by the way..someone explain "ascending" to me...what is the aim here...do they become Gods-demi-gods-angels in waiting??? there seems to be different levels to it but I'm not sure what the end point is...:angel:

[bhok'arala]

hmmmm... Ascendancy...
I suppose it could be as simple as having heightened awareness/senses or could be as devastating as Caladon Brood's damned hammer. Even the ascendants themselves can't even explain the question you're asking so i won't even try. besides, my head hurts already. in the case of ganoes, though, his ascendancy has creates many subtle ripplings without him even knowing but when he wants to, he can raise tsumanis as with the case of sanctioning High House Chains allowing the Crippled God as a player.

[Silander]

Hmm interesting point about Fiddler. How old is he? I got the impression that Whiskey jack was a 'second wave' of party adventurers with Dancer and Kellenved before they created the Empire.
It's mentioned that Fiddler and WJ have known each other for yonks and as MMdw mentioned Dunsparrow doesn't seem that old, course that doesn't mean much in the Malazan world.
In BH I got the impression WJ had known fiddler by that name for a long time. But I could have sworn that Fiddler only picked up his first Fiddle in Raraku and WJ didn't show much sign of recognition at all in that scene. I think it's in DHG, any one re-reading DHG wanna clarify that? It's the scene where they re-count how QB and Kalam lead the soldiers into the desert so becoming Bridgeburners.

[Salt-Man Z]

That's in MoI, where WJ tells the tale to Rake. In HoC, Fiddler ("Strings") says that he was named by WJ. (He also mentions that WJ was named by Braven Tooth. That sure caught me off-guard on my reread.)

[Aptorian]

Salt-Man Z;321932 said:

That's in MoI, where WJ tells the tale to Rake. In HoC, Fiddler ("Strings") says that he was named by WJ. (He also mentions that WJ was named by Braven Tooth. That sure caught me off-guard on my reread.)

All the more interesting for Fiddler claiming in BH that him naming Braven Tooth was what started the naming trend.

[Salt-Man Z]

IIRC, Fid hinted at that during the conversation in HoC, but didn't explicitly say so.

[Aptorian]

It's in BH where they meet in Malaz City... I'm pretty sure of it.

[OtataralDragon]

Nope, not BH. That encounter only has a brief reference to Braven Tooth smiling "the smile that gave him his name." Which doesn't entirely mesh with Fiddler's thoughts in HoC...

HoC, chapter 5, p. 301-02 pb:

String was silent for a long moment. Braven Tooth - he was dumbfounded. The bastard was grizzled back when... when the whole naming thing began. It had been Braven who'd started it. Braven who'd named most of the Bridgeburners. Whiskeyjack, Trotts, Mallet, Hedge, Blend, Picker, Toes... Fiddler himself had avided a new name all through his basic training; it had been Whiskeyjack who'd named him, on that first ride through Raraku. [....]

Smiles spoke. "So who named Braven Tooth, Sergeant?"

I did, after the bastard left one of his in my shoulder the night of the brawl. The brawl we all denied happening. Gods, so many years ago, now...

[Salt-Man Z]

Yeah, that's the passage. (Rep for you!) I guess it was explicitly stated, just not out loud.