[JPK]

Andorion, on 09 June 2019 - 09:24 AM, said:

JPK, on 09 June 2019 - 06:41 AM, said:

Andorion, on 05 June 2019 - 01:32 PM, said:

Finished Transformation by Carol Berg. This is really good stuff. Enjoyed it.

Holy crap, someone else finally found Berg! I really need to reread The Rai-Kirah trilogy, it's been like 15 years since I read them. The good news though, is that she has a bunch of other works that are pretty much all as strong as Transformation or even better (I'd skip her Bridge to D'Arnath series though, it's her early work and not nearly up to par). The covers for her novels eventually get better too.

I really loved the book. I will be continuing this trilogy, I also want to read the Flesh and Bone books and the Collegia Magica series.

You'll want to add Song of the Beast to your list as well.

[QuickTidal]

Bail out! Bail out!

I stopped reading Michelle West's THE HIDDEN CITY at page 300.

Fuuuuuuuuuuuck. What I initially thought was a Tad Williams-esque attention to setting the scene with details...turned into the slog of fucking slogs. 300 pages and what happened was the following:

spoilered for anyone who cares enough to not want it spoiled...but seriously the little that happens is so minimal that it doesn't matter

Spoiler

Rath, dissident of a Great House (whose sister runs that house now), lives on his own and on the down low and explores the undercity (the Hidden city of the title) to find and sell artifacts. There is exactly one scene with this activity, and it's pointless and boring. The rest of the 300 pages are devoted to him and the female protagonist Jewel (Jay) who is a street urchin he takes in who has some sort of prophetic magic powers...but it's never explained...and she comes of a caste of other types of magic users (mageborn) but they are never explained...and they take in other street urchins one or two at a time...none of whom have much of a personality beyond "tough street urchin" or "not-tough street urchin protected by tough street urchin". That's. Fucking. It. In 300 pages. I'm not kidding...it's:

Rath finds ten year old urchin Jay, takes her reluctantly in, she's ill and he gets her well, she prophecies that he will be followed and he is, so he trusts her now...they move to a big basement of a tenement. He gets the locks changed by a friend....this scene takes 10 pages. TEN pages to get the locks changed. He tells her not to leave. She leaves. Finds two more urchins. They need help and clothes. She brings them home. Rath freaks out. They leave. One comes back and tells the other is getting beaten by a gang. They all go and Rath kills the gang. They go home and all live in the basement. Rinse and repeat with new urchins.

It's so mind-numbing to me that the only thing that occurs in 300 pages is the taking in of urchins by a grumpy old fucker, and a bunch of inner monologues and ONE scene in the so-called Hidden city. No mention of the demons supposedly threatening (from the back cover), and no main antagonist of any kind yet.

I'm also astonished that someone who is so flowery with her words...can't write a teenager or in Jewel's case a child's voice to save her life. Every single urchin from the ages of 10 to 16 all sound like 35 year old adults. At NO point does any one of them sound like a youth. I mean, FFS if I didn't know Jay was 10...I'd assume from her dialogue that she was a middle aged adult.

At around page 200 I thought I might put it down and pick it back up later, but I stuck with it for another 100 pages...and it's just not worth it. This book is a lot of nothing. I've looked at other reviews and apparently the themes and actions of the book I mentioned above...continue for the other 500 pages of the book...and I looked at reviews of the second book (which I stupidly bought too) and it sounds like even more of the same.

Fucking fuck this book.

-----------------------

On a brighter note, I needed a light and tidy fantasy palate cleanser, so I picked up WINTER WITCH by Elaine Cunningham from my ToRead pile and it's doing quite nicely. No nonsense classic fantasy in a D&D setting (Pathfinder Tales).

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 10 June 2019 - 01:06 PM

[Zeto Demerzel]

QuickTidal, on 10 June 2019 - 01:01 PM, said:

Bail out! Bail out!

I stopped reading Michelle West's THE HIDDEN CITY at page 300.

Maybe I'm being harsh but my takeaway from Sun Sword book 1 was, basically, "long-winded and boring". So this doesn't surprise me.

Just finished:
DG - That one took me about six months to get through. There ends my first Malazan re-read
Children of Time - Loved the ending but struggled to get through much of the book. Didn't much care for the Portia PoV chapters and found it hard to buy their evolution-on-steroids (I hope that's not a spoiler).

In progress:
The Unifying Force (NJO 22/21/19 [depending on how you count 'em]) - a third through and it's alright so far.
Wax and Wayne 2 - Shadows of Self - a third through again and it's been a bit slower than book 1 but still good fun.

[Macros]

I kind of agree with you on Children of time, but given their shorter life span the, actual time expended and the "science" factor involved in the premeditated accelerant I let it slide

[Zeto Demerzel]

Macros, on 11 June 2019 - 06:33 AM, said:

I kind of agree with you on Children of time, but given their shorter life span the, actual time expended and the "science" factor involved in the premeditated accelerant I let it slide

Fair enough. Didn't hate the book or anything but the start of every new Portia PoV just seemed to jar my sense of immersion a bit with yet another gigantic leap in tech level/knowledge.

[Macros]

I agree with you on the tech jump, the time run on was not really highlighted in the PoV shifts as it was with the ship

[worry]

Finished The Vagrant. Initially I was put off a bit by Newman's coy narrative style. The protagonist is a mysterious, silent, lone wolf figure like out of a Western, and Newman has to dance around his POV to maintain that mystery. That kind of thing works a lot better in film and TV (and maybe anime -- this isn't too far removed from some I've seen) than it does in writing for me.

But I say initially because as the Vagrant becomes somewhat less of a lone wolf and interacts w/ people -- and also as you progress through the flashback chapters -- he's filled in in some surprising and wonderful ways. It's possible the problem was me all along, but I did a 180 on this and found the book -- and the Vagrant himself -- ultimately very inviting.

I can say similar things about the world-building -- not my cup of tea in writing, better on screen, initially turned off, but soon winning me over -- or the writing -- which can be downright Hemingway-ish in its terseness, lending at first to the coyness, but eventually becoming so welcome and effective as the book and its characters gain purpose. Ultimately I really liked it and am excited about what comes next. Even got the short stories.

[Cyphon]

worry, on 12 June 2019 - 05:46 AM, said:

Finished The Vagrant. snip.

I really loved the change in style of this book, very unusual for me and really enjoyed it. Haven't finished the final book of the trilogy yet but it's on the TRP.

Reading Katherine Arden's The Bear and a the nightingale at the moment. I didn't know it was based in Russia but it was overly appropriate after finishing a biography of Catherine the Great. Lovely prose and the story is put together but it does feel very familar tropes with

Spoiler

old magic gods versus jesus with no magic power as a result of belief and the developing sexual tension between the protag and antag

How much I like out may well depend on how well its executed.

[Abyss]

THE HOD KING.... still coming and going for me. Where I disliked the frivolity of bk 1 SENLIN ASCENDS and really enjoyed when bk 2 ARM OF THE SPHINX got serious with its setting and characters, bk 3 is jumping back and forth between both spaces for me. There's a lot to like here but the pacing... characters undertaking missions they declare as massively important only to meander around waiting for things to happen... is semi-not working for me.

It's making it take longer than it might because i keep jumping out of the book to listen/read other things, then come back, but other things in the TRPzilla keep calling to me.

[Tiste Simeon]

Starting the Earbook of RF Kuang's THE POPPY WAR; I have heard good things but don't know much about it. Looking forward to this one.

[pat5150]

Tiste Simeon, on 12 June 2019 - 03:21 PM, said:

Starting the Earbook of RF Kuang's THE POPPY WAR; I have heard good things but don't know much about it. Looking forward to this one.

Though this novel had potential and it turned out to be a compelling read, it suffers from too many flaws, chief among them the lack of engaging characters, to be a truly captivating book.

[Macros]

I was on the pile of did not like at all on the Poppy War, always interested to see how people react to books I don't like.

[amphibian]

worry, on 12 June 2019 - 05:46 AM, said:

Finished The Vagrant. Initially I was put off a bit by Newman's coy narrative style. The protagonist is a mysterious, silent, lone wolf figure like out of a Western, and Newman has to dance around his POV to maintain that mystery. That kind of thing works a lot better in film and TV (and maybe anime -- this isn't too far removed from some I've seen) than it does in writing for me.

But I say initially because as the Vagrant becomes somewhat less of a lone wolf and interacts w/ people -- and also as you progress through the flashback chapters -- he's filled in in some surprising and wonderful ways. It's possible the problem was me all along, but I did a 180 on this and found the book -- and the Vagrant himself -- ultimately very inviting.

I can say similar things about the world-building -- not my cup of tea in writing, better on screen, initially turned off, but soon winning me over -- or the writing -- which can be downright Hemingway-ish in its terseness, lending at first to the coyness, but eventually becoming so welcome and effective as the book and its characters gain purpose. Ultimately I really liked it and am excited about what comes next. Even got the short stories.

The writing style really connected with me because it starts off with the cool, disaffected images and then when we get into the book, we realize that the characters are often painfully awkward or just wrapped up in being themselves, while trying their best to get by.

The goat's bumbling confidence gives such a contrast to the fearful aloofness of the Vagrant and that contrasting continues in the other Newman books.

I quite liked how the series evolved and ended. I think you'll like it too.

[Tiste Simeon]

Hmm interesting Pat & Macros we shall have to see. About an hour in and I am enjoying it so far. There seems to be a rich history behind it (presumably taken straight from China) and Rin is a likeable/interesting character.

[Chance]

Finished up The Stone in the Skull by Elizabeth Bear it was kind of slow for a while and I was pretty disappointed by it at one point but then the last half got things together and finished in a pretty interesting place. Hum not going to go for The Red-Stained Wings the next book next but might well read it at some point. Started Django Wexlers Ship of Smoke and Steel just for test.

This post has been edited by Chance: 12 June 2019 - 05:45 PM

[pat5150]

Just finished Peter McLean's soon-to-be-released Priest of Lies and it was pretty good. If you like your grimdark gritty and bloody, this one's for you!

You can read my review here.

[Dadding]

Picked up & finished the FIFTH SEASON after hearing good things from this thread. I enjoyed it a lot, finished it in a week which is pretty speedy for me. Some assorted thoughts:

Spoiler

I really wasn't expecting to like this as much as I did. After disliking Sanderson's Mistborn and Abercrombie's First Law, I was pretty much resigned to not enjoying most mainstream, highly-praised Fantasy. And I've heard nothing but praise for Jemisin's Fifth Season. In this case it was deserved.
I'm glad that right off the bat Jemisin decides not to treat the reader like an idiot. There's no hint of Robert Jordan here - i.e. explain everything remotely mysterious a few times until we get it. It takes pretty much the whole book to puzzle out Guardians & Obelisks & Stone Eaters, and there's still a lot more to learn at the end of the book. Orogeny less so, but I realize I'm an outlier on the bell curve for preference on how much explanation is required in Fantasy.
Lots of other good parts. The three of them being the same person was obvious from the get-go, but there were some other genuine surprises down the line like Binof making a come-back, too. I think one of my favourite themes to explore in Fantasy is the vilification of Others - whatever that Other may be. Farseer does it great with The Wit, and Jemisin does it equally well with orogeny. I'm equally a fan of (post)apocalyptic literature, when it's done right. From the Epic of Gilgamesh & the biblical flood to La Fin Du monde & modern day zombie stories, I think this book adds positively to that pile of literature. And I'm always a fan of giving characters the world and then taking it away from them. There's an Erikson quote out there about the worst fate for humans is starting a breath with love and ending it with sorrow and I'm a strong believer that that makes the most compelling Fantasy, and by extension, literature, out there.
I still don't know how I feel about a few things. Some of the language choices, especially the exclamations were a bit clunky. Rusting and Earth and the like. They're appropriate given the universe, but they always feel a little bit awkward. I've yet to decide if those choices are ever good or bad. Even with Erikson, his made-up exclamation are a bit of a stretch sometimes. But they're at least tempered by humour, like Togg's Teats. Then there was a graphic sex scene or two. Which on principle I'm usually not a fan of. Not that sex is bad, or because I'm a prude, but because they rarely ever add anything important. Here I don't think that's the case. At least some of them were important to describing the clinical, matter-of-fact nature of the relationship between Syenite & Alabaster. They still felt a bit gratuitious, but I'm willing to let it slide.
By and large the writing was good. Beyond a few phrases that gave me distinct young adult post-apocalyptic Hunger Games/Maze Runner/Whatever the new flavour vibes. I particularly liked the bit where Damaya was trying to trap her fellow students to get back at them for their bullying, it felt like the style went intentionally young-adulty, with gossip and secret plans and scheming and (pre?)-teenagers being teenagers. But then there was a jolt back to reality as these things led to very real, very adult consequences.

[pat5150]

Go get yourself The Obelisk Gate and The Stone Sky, which are both even better reads!

[Abyss]

pat5150, on 12 June 2019 - 11:21 PM, said:

Go get yourself The Obelisk Gate and The Stone Sky, which are both even better reads!

Seconded.

[Tiste Simeon]

Abyss, on 13 June 2019 - 12:43 AM, said:

pat5150, on 12 June 2019 - 11:21 PM, said:

Go get yourself The Obelisk Gate and The Stone Sky, which are both even better reads!

Seconded.

Thirdeded