[Nimander Golit]

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 06:03 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 05:43 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 05:33 PM, said:

Shit. I am starting to get a Tennes vs Gait vibe from Nimander and Kara.


Nimander has a point though. The original train deserves a second look. I'm not reading much into that original vote and build up on Karatalid but Hentos Ilms presence did push shit the other way like it or not.
I am interested in voting Karatallid or Eldat for information.

Hentos being a possible symp makes sense.


Vote Karatallid

What. And...what?

I'm all for getting information, but this seems a lot like you're trying to make me into another 'easy target'. That way you don't have to actually think for yourself or do any kind of work. pshh

You conveniently didn't do shit on day one, and now you're acting all high and mighty calling out us that did? Fuck that.

vote Silchas Ruin

That OMGUS though...

It might be omgus...true...but simply stating it and ignoring everything he said is not acceptable either if u ask me.

[Silchas Ruin]

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 06:24 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 06:03 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 05:43 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 05:33 PM, said:

Shit. I am starting to get a Tennes vs Gait vibe from Nimander and Kara.


Nimander has a point though. The original train deserves a second look. I'm not reading much into that original vote and build up on Karatalid but Hentos Ilms presence did push shit the other way like it or not.
I am interested in voting Karatallid or Eldat for information.

Hentos being a possible symp makes sense.


Vote Karatallid

What. And...what?

I'm all for getting information, but this seems a lot like you're trying to make me into another 'easy target'. That way you don't have to actually think for yourself or do any kind of work. pshh

You conveniently didn't do shit on day one, and now you're acting all high and mighty calling out us that did? Fuck that.

vote Silchas Ruin

That OMGUS though...

It might be omgus...true...but simply stating it and ignoring everything he said is not acceptable either if u ask me.

I get to ignore it.

That vote of mine has nothing to do with feelings or what you think is acceptable.

Don't fucken expect me to spew forth walls of inane drivel on why looking at the fucken train again makes sense.
IF you have a counter opinion to my conclusion lets hear it. Eldat or Karatalid make sense for me.

Tell me why I should change my mind?

I'll fucken wait.

[Karosis]

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 05:43 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 05:33 PM, said:

Shit. I am starting to get a Tennes vs Gait vibe from Nimander and Kara.


Nimander has a point though. The original train deserves a second look. I'm not reading much into that original vote and build up on Karatalid but Hentos Ilms presence did push shit the other way like it or not.
I am interested in voting Karatallid or Eldat for information.

Hentos being a possible symp makes sense.


Vote Karatallid

What. And...what?

I'm all for getting information, but this seems a lot like you're trying to make me into another 'easy target'. That way you don't have to actually think for yourself or do any kind of work. pshh

You conveniently didn't do shit on day one, and now you're acting all high and mighty calling out us that did? Fuck that.

vote Silchas Ruin

Curious. That's the second time you vote same way as Hentos.

[Nimander Golit]

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 07:39 PM, said:

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 06:24 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 06:03 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 05:43 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 05:33 PM, said:

Shit. I am starting to get a Tennes vs Gait vibe from Nimander and Kara.


Nimander has a point though. The original train deserves a second look. I'm not reading much into that original vote and build up on Karatalid but Hentos Ilms presence did push shit the other way like it or not.
I am interested in voting Karatallid or Eldat for information.

Hentos being a possible symp makes sense.


Vote Karatallid

What. And...what?

I'm all for getting information, but this seems a lot like you're trying to make me into another 'easy target'. That way you don't have to actually think for yourself or do any kind of work. pshh

You conveniently didn't do shit on day one, and now you're acting all high and mighty calling out us that did? Fuck that.

vote Silchas Ruin

That OMGUS though...

It might be omgus...true...but simply stating it and ignoring everything he said is not acceptable either if u ask me.

I get to ignore it.

That vote of mine has nothing to do with feelings or what you think is acceptable.

Don't fucken expect me to spew forth walls of inane drivel on why looking at the fucken train again makes sense.
IF you have a counter opinion to my conclusion lets hear it. Eldat or Karatalid make sense for me.

Tell me why I should change my mind?

I'll fucken wait.

I’m asking you to at least address his claims on you before claiming OMGUS.

ILL FUCKEN WAIT.

[Nimander Golit]

You don’t get a fucken free ride simply because you voted someone.

[Silchas Ruin]

Go to bed Nimander,

I'm not gonna address shitty claims I have no stock in. There's nothing to address.

[Nimander Golit]

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 08:33 PM, said:

Go to bed Nimander,

I'm not gonna address shitty claims I have no stock in. There's nothing to address.

It’s a principal, I’m not the one who OMGUS voted you.

I AM however the one asking you to answer the claims made, however frivolous you might find them.

If you are going to ignore it all I have no choice but to vote you too.

Edit - phone typo

This post has been edited by Nimander Golit: 17 June 2020 - 08:41 PM

[Silchas Ruin]

It saddens me for Town that I need to spell this shit out.

"Work" does not equal clarity.

Its fucking Day 2. Dont act like theres a treasure trove of shit to sift through, there isn't.

I'm beelining for a vote that tells me the most about the voting on day 1. That's all there is as far as I'm concerned.
That wont be made clearer the more we gab about it.

If you can point to the trains and name another vote that offers more info do so.

[Hentos Ilm]

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 09:17 AM, said:

Ok doing a proper read of the game so far.

Hentos Ilm, on 16 June 2020 - 04:59 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 June 2020 - 09:20 PM, said:

Hmm

Vote Karatallid

For their friendly interaction so far. Lovely quoting of each other and an "I see you" vote from the symp Eldat.

Do you really think there are that many amateurs in this game?

Vote Atrahal

Your behavior is, itself, symp-like, but more in the "cause general chaos" sense than sidling up to a master.

Hentos Suddenly jumps in and attacks Atrahal for making (what I consider) standard pokes.
What I didn't like is the fact that Hentos doenst even consider the fact that Atrahal could be correct and blatantly defends Kara and Eldat.
Seems like a forced and out of the blue attack to me.

The hypocrisy of this accusation is rather interesting.
Hentos also seems to then be fixated on symping. The very thing he is accusing Atrahal of being.
Which in of itself is very symp like behaviour because you cause confusion when you use it as an excuse for erratic play and cant "prove" someone is a symp by lynching them.
You need to find their master...SO... who was Atrahal symping here?
No one that I can see, and clearly no one Hentos can see because thats not his argument, he took the easy route by simply shouting "SYMP"
How convenient.


But the most damning thing he apparently thinks Atrahal is a symp...yet proceeds to vote the SYMP. How does that help?

So if Hentos is a symp here (which I think is likely). My bet is he is protecting either Kara or Eldat.

Vote Karatallid

Or maybe you don't like me voting for Silchas and you are the real symp... see how dumb this logic train goes? We got a vote on Atrahal. It was about as good as any Day 1 case will go. Use the info from the train, the voters, the non-voters, etc. Don't go chasing rabbits down one hole after another.

[Hentos Ilm]

Trake, on 17 June 2020 - 12:28 PM, said:

Well I’m up and my head hurts. I think the pileup on Atrahal was a bit strange with no one really looking into other lynches.

Day 1. I don't think it's that strange at all.

[Hentos Ilm]

Desra, on 17 June 2020 - 02:29 PM, said:

Yes.

I stand by my cool your jets.

It was, what 2 hours into day 2, Hentos has added zero of worthy note in my memory (on phone reread later) and he decided to start up a low poster hunt.
Let's break down what happened yesterday and last night a little bit before just lumping on an easy low poster hunt no?

You're annoying me Elvis, you being deliberately obtuse. Now maybe it is just for the value of annoying me or maybe you have a deeper motive, you were part of the scrutiny yesterday as well

I'll play Mafia my way, you play it yours. I vote for low posters without reason to do otherwise. It got some discussion going at least, no?

[Hentos Ilm]

Trake, on 17 June 2020 - 03:03 PM, said:

Hentos Ilm, on 17 June 2020 - 01:34 AM, said:

Karosis, on 16 June 2020 - 02:01 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 June 2020 - 09:20 PM, said:

Hmm

Vote Karatallid

For their friendly interaction so far. Lovely quoting of each other and an "I see you" vote from the symp Eldat.

A signal vote? from a symp? in a 6 votes to lynch situation?

Ionno what you're smoking, but the golden rule is "symps never vote scum"

vote Atrahal

I agree with Karosis here.

Trake, on 16 June 2020 - 02:24 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 15 June 2020 - 04:15 PM, said:

Checking in.

I’m not into the lame cases du jour. After last game I’d like to not let low coasters get by too long. Nimander signed on to say he’s sick, but Silchas hasn’t posted anything more than a check in. I’d like to hear more from him.

vote Silchas

Also agree with Trake. Low-posters cause the game to stall out in the worst way (and I was an offender yesterday but will try to be more available going forward). Nimander is on the verge of a modkill so the next lowest poster other than me is Silchas. For now

Vote Silchas Ruin

This is the most unoriginal post so far. String together a couple of unrelated replies with an agreement and a vote? Now I do stand by my opinions that low posters are useless and that scum are usually hiding in that pool. But with the lynch to look at, there are other reasons other than coasting to look at. Where did Silchas go before timeout? He just added some post padding fluff and an inclination to vote for Atrahal. That looks like trying to blend in.

Call it low effort, call it unoriginal. Right before this post of yours that I quoted PS showed we had 20 hours. In 16 hours we had less than one page of posts and exactly 3 votes. I'm quite satisfied with my decision to vote Silchas at that time.

[Hentos Ilm]

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 03:32 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 02:53 PM, said:

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 12:20 PM, said:

Karatallid, on 17 June 2020 - 11:33 AM, said:

How did I go full attack mode? I'm honestly curious how you came to that conclusion. I voted for Atrahal but so did others, and it was a valid lynch IMO considering the weird behavior it was prompted by. You might disagree, but at least explain why you disagree. Don't just make stuff up to sound like you know what you're doing.
(oh no a smiley face, how dangerous!)

Meant Hentos and Karososis.

my point still stands.

Im on meds and be mixing up my names.

Okay fair enough, but my question still stands - generally in mafia you want to actually back up accusations, otherwise you might aswell be scum for how much good it does.



Just attacking people and making up stuff because you're scared of being attacked yourself is just lame.

I stand by the Atrahal lynch, as I think it was warranted at the time. There's a difference between claiming the lynch was wrong in hindsight, and actually making an observation based on how people was acting and what they said before the lynch.

You said Atrahal was making standard pokes which I agree with, but then he acted weirdly IMO by backtracking as soon as some pressure happened. I wouldn't personally vote on someone just because they prodded, and didn't this time either.


The karosis angle interests me, since Emurlahnis had a vote for him also. If we look at this post for instance:

Karosis, on 16 June 2020 - 02:01 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 June 2020 - 09:20 PM, said:

Hmm

Vote Karatallid

For their friendly interaction so far. Lovely quoting of each other and an "I see you" vote from the symp Eldat.

A signal vote? from a symp? in a 6 votes to lynch situation?

Ionno what you're smoking, but the golden rule is "symps never vote scum"

vote Atrahal

He was definitely being a bit aggressive with something that I personally saw as prodding and joke voting initially. Makes you wonder if it's a possible scum strategy, like fake symping but with the purpose to secure one lynch and a possible target (me) in the future?

Well yea unfortunately for you my vote has more to do with the actions of others than you directly, but when I saw your posts afterward when catching up I felt it also fit to how scum would handle it if I where in your shoes.


The fact remains that Atrahal made a very standard sort of case pointing at you and Eldat.
Some people seemed to JUMP at this. its a clear possibility of it being an early aggressive derailment attempt on the votes on you.
They derailed it by attacking a very weak argument without ever bothering to look at Atrahals side of it.
After all atrahals argument wasn't not completely invalid. Yet he was basically steamrolled.

With how easily and quickly I see the train on atrahal build after the votes on you all I can conclude is that there is something here.
I would be remiss to ignore it. And the rest of town should be too.


The very fact that Hentos called Atrahal a symp and then voted him for being one is screaming scum.
IF so...what was Hentos protecting? and why vote for a symp If they truly think atrahal was one?
It literally gets you nowhere voting for a symp.

Re-read what I wrote. I said that it was symp-like behavior with no obvious target he was protecting (i.e. sewing general chaos). That's worth a vote on day 1.

[Hentos Ilm]

Ryadd Eleis, on 17 June 2020 - 04:06 PM, said:

Hentos Ilm, on 16 June 2020 - 04:59 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 June 2020 - 09:20 PM, said:

Hmm Vote KaratallidFor their friendly interaction so far. Lovely quoting of each other and an "I see you" vote from the symp Eldat.

Do you really think there are that many amateurs in this game?Vote AtrahalYour behavior is, itself, symp-like, but more in the "cause general chaos" sense than sidling up to a master.

Having read up I think that this,

Hentos Ilm, on 17 June 2020 - 01:34 AM, said:

Karosis, on 16 June 2020 - 02:01 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 June 2020 - 09:20 PM, said:

Hmm Vote KaratallidFor their friendly interaction so far. Lovely quoting of each other and an "I see you" vote from the symp Eldat.

A signal vote? from a symp? in a 6 votes to lynch situation?Ionno what you're smoking, but the golden rule is "symps never vote scum" vote Atrahal

I agree with Karosis here.

Trake, on 16 June 2020 - 02:24 PM, said:

Silchas Ruin, on 15 June 2020 - 04:15 PM, said:

Checking in.

I’m not into the lame cases du jour. After last game I’d like to not let low coasters get by too long. Nimander signed on to say he’s sick, but Silchas hasn’t posted anything more than a check in. I’d like to hear more from him.vote Silchas

Also agree with Trake. Low-posters cause the game to stall out in the worst way (and I was an offender yesterday but will try to be more available going forward). Nimander is on the verge of a modkill so the next lowest poster other than me is Silchas. For nowVote Silchas Ruin

combined with this, what looks like an attempt to get a low poster hunt started screams scum to me.

Vote Hentos Ilm

Looks like an attempt? My dear boy, it's an obvious low-poster witch hunt. I have made that abundantly clear.

[Hentos Ilm]

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 05:20 PM, said:

Karosis, on 17 June 2020 - 05:04 PM, said:

Nimander Golit, on 17 June 2020 - 04:45 PM, said:

Karosis, on 17 June 2020 - 03:48 PM, said:

If you think Hentos' vote was nonsensical, would it not make more sense to vote Hentos himself?

No...because as I explained and as it has been clearly IGNORED.
Voting for a symp is pointless.
I said in my post where I voted that Hentos seems to be a symp derailing his masters (Karat) potential lynch train. What other objecting is there so blatantly defending Karat?
Why not sort back and see how things unfold? This is what town should do.


This isn't rocket science and the fact that people that are implicated in all this (YOU being one) are being so blatantly obtuse is telling.

Karosis, on 17 June 2020 - 03:48 PM, said:

Atrahal made a symp "case" out of literally nothing. When he got called out on it, he didn't try to look elsewhere, did this weird "oops, I guess I'm wrong.. but I'll double down anyways in case I hit a nerve" type response.

Need to go back and read some of the other's comments about the whole thing.

Naaa but he didn't tho. Symp signalling is a very standard thing...but people just jumped onto him way more aggressively than what is warranted.
Even I asked atrahal why would someone signal back and was trying to figure out the logic...but others pounced and placed votes and the train quickly shifted before the thread even knew what was going on.

The speed of how the train shifted, the reasoning behind the shift, How easily he was railroaded...ALL point to SOMETHING going on here when I was catching up.
This "slip" is like chum in the water for scum. Scum don't have second thoughts about who they are gonna vote...they are not trying to figure stuff out. If there is a "weird" statement by someone they now is inno... they come in HARD, because its easy.

So...This is what I think happened. Hentos come out and derailed the potential train on Karat.
simple.

You came out and didn't even question it and planted a vote on Atrhal without really caring. This is how it reads to me.

Sure you all implicated is not gonna see it that way...I dont expect you to.
What I Expect is anyone who IS TOWN to see simple logic and reason and vote accordingly.

The underlined: yeah, symps "signal". and 90 % of the time neither town nor scum catch it.

Symp cases are (generally) BS. I say this every single game, and I'm not gonna stop now.

I understand that your argument is "people are deflecting from Kara". The problem is... if the "case" on him was BS, then saying it was BS isn't "deflecting",, it's calling the BS out.

if you're scum, and someone votes you for a dumb reason, you're not gonna sit and analyze "is this a purposefully weak vote that's supposed to get any case against me dismissed -and is therefore, a "signal"... or is this idiot just drawing attention to me for no reason".

You don't signal with votes. Scum treat every vote as hostile. So Tatt's case was dumb.

That being said, a lot of people are using dumb logic. not much to say about that.

There is a big difference between calling out a bad symp signaling case.
And literally derailing a vote train onto the person for simply doing a symp signal case. Some people pointed it out but wants clarity. Others just voted and didn’t seem to care. I can only go by what I’ve read on the thread after all.


This happened last Match. SOMETIEMS people get lucky with a symp signal case and then people panic. And attack back. This happens a lot. While it is not bullet proof. It can’t be ignored.

Here when I caught up... seeing how badly certain people attack atrahal, for something so mundane FOR ME IS TELLING. So I have to look hard at it.

This is the crux of it.

Then you have the issue of Hentos voting for his target... the “SYMP”.
I mean really?

I cannot ignore this. Symps usually make the most noise about symps.
But one rule I think he forgot was YOU DONT VOTE A SYMP.

Logically I can only assume he was derailing the two votes on Karat.

That’s that... there is no point in me arguing this with the people I think are involved.

So I’ll leave it at that.

Where did you learn to play Mafia? You vote for SCUM. Symps are SCUM. Yes they are not as important as getting the ACTUAL scum but if they are sitting around causing a mess on thread and it's nice and early in the game you vote for them. Period. Notice how easy the last game was after a symp got voted out day 1?

[Hentos Ilm]

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 05:33 PM, said:

Shit. I am starting to get a Tennes vs Gait vibe from Nimander and Kara.


Nimander has a point though. The original train deserves a second look. I'm not reading much into that original vote and build up on Karatalid but Hentos Ilms presence did push shit the other way like it or not.
I am interested in voting Karatallid or Eldat for information.

Hentos being a possible symp makes sense.


Vote Karatallid

My presence? I literally had like 2 or 3 posts on day 1 before I disappeared. I voted Atrahal first and that was it. I'd hardly call that a commanding presence and if it is, then put a feather in my cap and call me General.

[Hentos Ilm]

Silchas Ruin, on 17 June 2020 - 08:55 PM, said:

It saddens me for Town that I need to spell this shit out.

"Work" does not equal clarity.

Its fucking Day 2. Dont act like theres a treasure trove of shit to sift through, there isn't.

I'm beelining for a vote that tells me the most about the voting on day 1. That's all there is as far as I'm concerned.
That wont be made clearer the more we gab about it.

If you can point to the trains and name another vote that offers more info do so.

Thank you for stating what I've basically said.

We don't have much to go on. Pissing on each other for Day 1 votes is dumb; we needed a lynch and by golly poor Tats was the lamb. Analyzing trains is useful. Do that (directed to everyone)

[Hentos Ilm]

Remove Vote
Silchas came out and started talking which is all I wanted anyway. Low posters kill the game.

As a summary to my read-up, what a backward set of logic you've gone with, Nimander. A good symp would actually symp someone OTHER than their master to get that person lynched and then ho ho, you're chasing more symp tails day after day. We don't even know if there's a symp in this game. At this point, your logic and play is actively detrimental to the town so

Vote Nimander Golit

[Hentos Ilm]

I'll be around (off and on) today but will miss the lynch timer for sleep based on PS's last timestamp.

[Desra]

here sitting down at laptop now. been a busy bee