[Fanderay]

Not dead. Coffee on IV though and other shit to get done. Will read up as soon as practical

[Merrid]

Jalan, on 08 November 2017 - 06:39 PM, said:

How likely is it that Uncle Ben targetted Big Ben on night zero? Because if he didn't and the symp or some stupid town pretend to be muted alongside a player that's actually muted it created a perfect smokescreen for the first couple of days.

Ay Estos, on 08 November 2017 - 07:24 PM, said:

So... why don't we just vote one of them out today, then the other tomorrow?


remove vote
vote Anomandaris

Jalan, on 08 November 2017 - 07:29 PM, said:

Jalan, on 08 November 2017 - 06:39 PM, said:

How likely is it that Uncle Ben targetted Big Ben on night zero? Because if he didn't and the symp or some stupid town pretend to be muted alongside a player that's actually muted it created a perfect smokescreen for the first couple of days.

Ay Estos, on 08 November 2017 - 07:24 PM, said:

So... why don't we just vote one of them out today, then the other tomorrow?


remove vote
vote Anomandaris

So you want to use the smokescreen to set up two lynches in a row?

vote Ay Estos

Merrid, on 08 November 2017 - 07:40 PM, said:

Jalan, on 08 November 2017 - 07:29 PM, said:

Jalan, on 08 November 2017 - 06:39 PM, said:

How likely is it that Uncle Ben targetted Big Ben on night zero? Because if he didn't and the symp or some stupid town pretend to be muted alongside a player that's actually muted it created a perfect smokescreen for the first couple of days.

Ay Estos, on 08 November 2017 - 07:24 PM, said:

So... why don't we just vote one of them out today, then the other tomorrow?


remove vote
vote Anomandaris

So you want to use the smokescreen to set up two lynches in a row?

vote Ay Estos

I'm not sure which one is dumber

You, for bringing up this hypothesis that makes us go in circle (unless we do what you say we shouldn't - that is "buying into the smokescreen" )

Or, Ay, for actually falling for it.

Once I make up my mind I'll probably vote

I find myself going back to this exchange.

Basically, Jalan posits that one of the 2 silenced might be scum (b/c you'd have to be a moron vengy to fake silenced as town). Ay follows through with the suggestion "let's lynch 'em both to be sure" . Then Jalan tries tu trun around and accuse Ay of "setting up trains for 2 days" - where, as far as I can see, his own post was pretty much setting up that exact possibility (except he's claiming that he was merely speculating... still, I don't really see why he'd be getting so worked up on someone following what he suggested, if he was genuine)

vote Jalan

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 10 hours and 28 minutes remaining

12 Players still alive: Aranatha, Ay Estos, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Merrid, Nimander Golit, Osseric, Ruse, Thyrllan

7 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

2 Votes for Jalan ( Osseric, Merrid )
1 Vote for Kalse ( Nimander Golit )

Players not voted: Aranatha, Ay Estos, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Ruse, Thyrllan

[Jalan]

@Merrid: I wasn't trying to set up two lynches, as you claim. What I was trying to get at is the question if it is worth it to lynch the silenced players, since BB is the target. And we gain only a little bit by lynching UB. That's why I genunily asked everyone how likely it was that BB was pretending silenced. Because I didn't think it was likely.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 9 hours and 20 minutes remaining

12 Players still alive: Aranatha, Ay Estos, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Merrid, Nimander Golit, Osseric, Ruse, Thyrllan

7 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

2 Votes for Jalan ( Osseric, Merrid )
1 Vote for Kalse ( Nimander Golit )

Players not voted: Aranatha, Ay Estos, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Ruse, Thyrllan

[Path-Shaper]

May be absent towards timeout. I'll do my best to resolve asap.

[Nimander Golit]

Well this game sure lost its steam after a pretty exciting first two days.

[Merrid]

I blame the quasi-long weekend.

[Aranatha]

Jalan, on 14 November 2017 - 01:38 PM, said:

Aranatha, on 13 November 2017 - 08:30 PM, said:

Jalan, on 13 November 2017 - 04:23 PM, said:

Because not giving them a chance to speak is so sensible? Oh, someone is faking being silenced and painting a big target on himself. No way that person could be town...

Tell me more about why someone who was inno would fake being Silenced, and why you would want to wait to lynch when two people were claiming to be Silenced, but only one could possibly have been.

This should be fascinating.

Well obviously Venge was, so ask him in SH. And as you will notice, I was never against lynching someone, just questioning wether it is good to lynch one of the silenced players, or if it wouldn't make more sense to give them a chance to talk.

... wait, why are you claiming Venge was "obviously" Silenced. We don't know which one was actually Silenced ... we literally have no way of knowing that. Giving them a chance to talk wouldn't have solved anything, because - and this may come as a shock to you - the one who was just pretending would have lied, and we couldn't have told them apart.

[Ay Estos]

I really feel like Jalan was just being an idiot - I don't think his initial statements warranted his making such obvious mistakes afterwards, but I also don't think that those are mistakes a scum player would make. They smell to me of town trying to backpedal after they realized they said something wrong.

Something that's rubbing me the wrong way and is going to warrant a longer look from me about is Nimander's vote hopping during Day 2. What was that about? The Benses don't have off thread comms right? Could it be a signal? Anyway, gonna go see how Nimander's early game was now...

[Ay Estos]

Hmmmm.... Embarrassing, I know, but that's what you get when you only skim the thread when you're on vacation.

I actually think that Nimander's point about Osseric and Kalse is a very good one, and an excellent catch if he has a point. I could see either Osseric or both being scum given those two posts Nimander pulled up.

Moving on to taking a closer look at Osseric and Kalse now I guess!

[Ay Estos]

Alright, so reading through Osseric, he really strikes me as trying to show that he's helpful town. Which of course makes me suspicious. But there are two things in particular that stand out to me.

Firstly, after I voted for Anomandaris with really the first comment re: "let's just lynch them both" Osseric basically went out of his way to support the whole "there couldn't be two silences" thing.

Osseric, on 08 November 2017 - 08:50 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 07 November 2017 - 09:13 AM, said:

Game mechanics and roles:
The Benses (evil team)

One of each of the following roles WILL be present:

Big Ben (killer) –

Uncle Ben (symp)


******

Innocents (good team)

Any combination of the following roles will be used. No role not described here will be used.
Upon investigation/CF, any of these will come up as "Innocent"

Dead Nobody: Once you were alive, and then you died. You have no special power, nothing special happened to you until you became drafted by force for this mission. Next time you see Hood in his realm, looking pissed, you'll know not to come and "check it out".

Vig: In your previous life, you were a powerful mercenary. However, you learned one day never to play baseball with a Malazan Sapper prisoner, specially if he supplies the ball. You have a vig kill that you can use once, at the night of your choice, during the game.

Healer: In your previous life, you were a wandering surgeon, offering your services in exchange for food and shelter. However, you learned one day that "Please, hand me this scalpel" and "I want to have sex with your mother" differ, in a small Seven Cities dialect, by one accent. Your mastering of Denul allows you to heal one player per night. Note: this skill does not affect Uncle Ben's silencing ability.

Finder: In a previous life, you were yourself a practitioner of Mockra. However, you learned one day why there was no first-hand report of what happens if you look in a mirror and try to convince yourself that you do NOT possess knowledge of Mockra. Despite the paradox-induced head explosion, you retain your old knowledge, and by focusing on one player per night, you can determine if this player is Big Ben or not.

Guard: In a previous life, you were a guard in the Seguleh Imperial Harem. However, you learned one day that when the queen says "Well, fuck me, my husband is home early for once", it should NOT be understood as an order. Every night, you chose the name of one player to guard. This player will be prevented to perform a night action for this night. If this player is part of a pair whose partner is still alive, the night action is not blocked.

Note: Any of these roles can exist as a PAIR. If this is the case, and the pair is roled, they have together ONE action per night, that they must agree on. Note that pair of Vigs have 2 night kills at their disposition, although they can't use both in the same night.

For all pairs: You can communicate off-thread at all times. For a night action to be accepted, if must be confirmed by BOTH players (exception: if a provisional was been sent by both players, it can be confirmed by only one player).

If one of the players from a pair becomes Big Ben, the other remains unaware, and stays in the good team with corresponding winning conditions. It is possible for a pair to target one of the two players from the pair as long as both agree.

If only one from a pair is still alive, and becomes Big Ben, he keeps his other power to use as he pleases. Exception: if he is the lone member of a vig team with vig kills left, he loses the vig kills since he's already killing at night. (If he's part of a vig pair, he's welcome to use the vig kills as long as his partner agrees )


Everyone is this unless of course you're not

Dead Nobody: Once you were alive, and then you died. You have no special power, nothing special happened to you until you became drafted by force for this mission. Next time you see Hood in his realm, looking pissed, you'll know not to come and "check it out".

Emphasis mine

...and

Osseric, on 08 November 2017 - 08:57 PM, said:

Tennes, on 08 November 2017 - 08:53 PM, said:

Emphasis is definitely yours. Don't get what you are emphasizing for.The way I read that is: if there is one vig, there is one night kill from town PER GAME. If there are two, then there are two.

Other than that, I fail to see the relevance to our current overblown predicament.

(sigh)

first emphasis says - One of each scum role will be present

second emphasis - shows how for town ONLY there will be a possiblility of a pair and if that pair were to act - only 1 single action would be valid

this shows that there will only be 1 UB

But just in case, if there were 2 paired UB's they would still only have 1 action. This would still not allow for 2 people to be silenced at the same time.


(/sigh)

But then... given it looks like Venge was likely just fucking with us on Day 1, I think that Ano was likely the one who was silenced on Day 1. And you know what stood out to me? This pre-game vote:

Osseric, on 07 November 2017 - 05:19 PM, said:

Anomandaris, on 07 November 2017 - 05:03 PM, said:

Osseric, on 07 November 2017 - 05:02 PM, said:

First!

Do you really wanna have that conversation again, Osserc?

You spelled my name wrong

Therefore you are signalling to your boss that you are his symp and pretending that I am him/her to set me up later

Vote Anomadars

For leaving the i out of my name

Could this be Osseric preparing the Day 1 silencing?

Anyway, right now these things are sticking out to me. If he's the one doing the silencing, then when I suggested that we lynch both Ano and Hanas, and that I chose Ano first, he jumps on that because he knows that Ano is not the townie that was fucking with us during Day 1. Does everything he can to support this lynch, then silences Hanas during Day 2 so that Hanas couldn't even try to wiggle his way out of the Day 2 lynch. Lots of coincidences piling up...

[Ay Estos]

Alright, looking through Kalse, I'd say he's just snarky town. He doesn't do anything that really stands out, follows on the Ano vote noting that one of the two has to be scum fucking about, but then sorta flip flops when he realizes that Hanas has been silenced. He had good reasoning though:

Kalse, on 10 November 2017 - 07:21 PM, said:

It makes no sense for UB to silence Hanas on day two, he was on the chopping block already pretty heavily. Just another losing and negative play by town, I have a bad feeling.

I'll hammer if needed.

And to be honest, I kind of felt the same way as him about Nimander when I was skimming yesterday. Of course, that's changed a lot.

Based on all of the above, I think it's likely that Osseric is scum (Uncle Ben methinks? The silencer one) and that he was trying to set Kalse up, so...

vote Osseric

[Merrid]

Ay Estos, on 14 November 2017 - 06:51 PM, said:

Alright, looking through Kalse, I'd say he's just snarky town. He doesn't do anything that really stands out, follows on the Ano vote noting that one of the two has to be scum fucking about, but then sorta flip flops when he realizes that Hanas has been silenced. He had good reasoning though:

Kalse, on 10 November 2017 - 07:21 PM, said:

It makes no sense for UB to silence Hanas on day two, he was on the chopping block already pretty heavily. Just another losing and negative play by town, I have a bad feeling.

I'll hammer if needed.

And to be honest, I kind of felt the same way as him about Nimander when I was skimming yesterday. Of course, that's changed a lot.

Based on all of the above, I think it's likely that Osseric is scum (Uncle Ben methinks? The silencer one) and that he was trying to set Kalse up, so...

vote Osseric

This is slightly better than nothing, but what I don't like is that you don't have a BB suspect.

Voting someone for suspicion of being UB is smth that won't really pan out for a few game days (if there's no silencings)

[Ay Estos]

Merrid, on 14 November 2017 - 07:03 PM, said:

This is slightly better than nothing, but what I don't like is that you don't have a BB suspect.

Voting someone for suspicion of being UB is smth that won't really pan out for a few game days (if there's no silencings)

I realize he's basically just a symp with a silence power, but I think an UB suspect is better than nothing at this point, which is what I've got from the rest of the thread.

[Merrid]

i'll be hitting the pool about an hour before timeout. Not thrilled about the Osseric case, but we still need to lynch.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 6 hours and 33 minutes remaining

12 Players still alive: Aranatha, Ay Estos, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Merrid, Nimander Golit, Osseric, Ruse, Thyrllan

7 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

2 Votes for Jalan ( Osseric, Merrid )
1 Vote for Kalse ( Nimander Golit )
1 Vote for Osseric ( Ay Estos )

Players not voted: Aranatha, Dejim Nebrahl, Eldat Pressen, Fanderay, Jalan, Kalse, Ruse, Thyrllan

[Nimander Golit]

I'll vote for Osseric if the Kalse train isn't going anywhere. I don't see much merit to the Jalan case. My big concern with Osseric is that I don't expect anything but an Inno CF. I guess we can see if anyone's silenced tomorrow as a soft CF.

[Fanderay]

Aranatha, on 14 November 2017 - 05:46 PM, said:

Jalan, on 14 November 2017 - 01:38 PM, said:

Aranatha, on 13 November 2017 - 08:30 PM, said:

Jalan, on 13 November 2017 - 04:23 PM, said:

Because not giving them a chance to speak is so sensible? Oh, someone is faking being silenced and painting a big target on himself. No way that person could be town...

Tell me more about why someone who was inno would fake being Silenced, and why you would want to wait to lynch when two people were claiming to be Silenced, but only one could possibly have been.

This should be fascinating.

Well obviously Venge was, so ask him in SH. And as you will notice, I was never against lynching someone, just questioning wether it is good to lynch one of the silenced players, or if it wouldn't make more sense to give them a chance to talk.

... wait, why are you claiming Venge was "obviously" Silenced. We don't know which one was actually Silenced ... we literally have no way of knowing that. Giving them a chance to talk wouldn't have solved anything, because - and this may come as a shock to you - the one who was just pretending would have lied, and we couldn't have told them apart.

Woah this post.

We know Ano was D1 silenced. We know Hanas was D2 silenced*

Unless you're positing that that Ano and Hanas both pretended to be silenced, Hanas for 2 days in a row and UB is actually not submitting orders?

I'm sure there is a strategy behind the fake D1 silencing, perhaps someone with more time could dig it out?


*Clearly a needed explanation: D1 2 people claim silence. D2 1 of those 2 people claim again. D2 claimant cannot have been silenced on D1 because not 2 Days in a row. D2 claimant is genuinely silenced on D2 (no counter silencing) and the other one of the 2 was silenced D1. So Ano on Day 1 and Hanas on Day 2.

I'm tempted to vote Aranatha now.

[Fanderay]

Nimander Golit, on 14 November 2017 - 08:09 PM, said:

I'll vote for Osseric if the Kalse train isn't going anywhere. I don't see much merit to the Jalan case. My big concern with Osseric is that I don't expect anything but an Inno CF. I guess we can see if anyone's silenced tomorrow as a soft CF.

If you're expecting a RI CF why would you consider voting that way rather than sticking to your guns?

Vote Nimander Golit