[Tapper]

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:12 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 04 July 2018 - 12:56 AM, said:

The sad thing is that the Netherlands has actually stepped away from this in recent years, partly, due to a dry spell in talented players, but the hope is that under Koeman (who is also a Cruyff adept) they might be able to rebuild this slightly. The sad reality though is that there is little money in the Dutch league these days so talent is not really coming through anymore, or they leave much to early to go play (and fail) abroad.

I'd argue that two of your better players play for Liverpool. They are awesome. If Kluivert does well at Roma? Then your National side will have a solid spine. Much better than trying to qualify for this WC with Sneijder, Babel, Kuyt or whoever hasbeens.

Wijnaldum is a tough one. When playing in the Dutch competition (also under Koeman), he more or less occupied the #10 position behind the striker. At Liverpool he plays further back but with the freedom to roam. If Koeman chooses to play with a #10 (attacking midfielder) and two men behind him, Wijnaldum is likely to be played out of position or as a shuttling player with not much room in front of him. Question is also how much he will play at Liverpool next season, with Keita and Fabinho incoming.

[Macros]

that video of the dutch ball hunting made me think of kids on a play ground flocking after a ball.

sure it may have been revolutionary but that kind of en masse charge after the ball all round the pitch is madness.

(before you get your panties in a twist, Im not saying the netherlands were a bad side in the 70s)

in other news, the Commissioner has this to say:



if you dont follow the Commissioner of football you should.

hes always on point, and a fucking legend

[Tattersail_]

Tapper, on 04 July 2018 - 02:01 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:12 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 04 July 2018 - 12:56 AM, said:

The sad thing is that the Netherlands has actually stepped away from this in recent years, partly, due to a dry spell in talented players, but the hope is that under Koeman (who is also a Cruyff adept) they might be able to rebuild this slightly. The sad reality though is that there is little money in the Dutch league these days so talent is not really coming through anymore, or they leave much to early to go play (and fail) abroad.

I'd argue that two of your better players play for Liverpool. They are awesome. If Kluivert does well at Roma? Then your National side will have a solid spine. Much better than trying to qualify for this WC with Sneijder, Babel, Kuyt or whoever hasbeens.

Wijnaldum is a tough one. When playing in the Dutch competition (also under Koeman), he more or less occupied the #10 position behind the striker. At Liverpool he plays further back but with the freedom to roam. If Koeman chooses to play with a #10 (attacking midfielder) and two men behind him, Wijnaldum is likely to be played out of position or as a shuttling player with not much room in front of him. Question is also how much he will play at Liverpool next season, with Keita and Fabinho incoming.

Technically he's brilliant, one of my favourite Liverpool midfielders. He hold the balls up well, creates space and is good at getting out of tough positions. He's not a great goal scorer, and would need someone half decent next to him to play well. I don't know how he'll rotate into Klopp's midfield next season, but we're going to need cover in those 2 holding/deeper lying cm positions as they are expected to cover quite a lot of ground every match to compensate for high full backs and wide attacking players that don't track back.

[Tattersail_]

Mentalist, on 04 July 2018 - 01:53 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:29 PM, said:

Mentalist, on 04 July 2018 - 02:52 AM, said:

Malankazooie, on 04 July 2018 - 01:28 AM, said:

See, here's the deal in any sport. You need your super star. The guy who transcends all others with abilities in physicality and skill. And then you need to surround him with talent, enough so that he can maximize those talents to take you to victory. It's why Argentina and Portugal are going home (Ronaldo and Messi not surrounded with enough skilled players). Whereas Brazil, Belgium, England, Uruguay, and France are looking pretty good with this formula. Russia, Croatia, and Sweden, not so much.

Sooo.... who was the German superstar in 2014?

Ha ha ha, are you joking?

Tony Kroos is one of the best midfielders to grace the game, Muller is a superstar, Lahm one of the greatest ever defenders, if not the best RB ever then definitely top 3. No one in the World was better than Neuer in goal and back then Sweinsteiger could control a game like there was no tomorrow. Khedira worked great with him as well box to box and they had a good understanding and togetherness. They blew Brazil away in the semi's 7-1 which is one of the shock resluts of world football ever.

Shweinsteiger (iirc) didn't start in 2014, as he was past his prime.
I was half-joking: I'm aware Germany was an amazing squad (and Neuer deserved that golden glove), but that was just it: all of their solid players were top-ranked in their positions, but no one would really be called a "superstar" with the name recognition of Messi, Ronaldo, Suarez, Neymar, etc. Which was why I wanted Kazooie to answer that question,


Personally, I'm leaning towards Brazil or France to win it. Belgium has a shot if they can get an early lead on Brazil to shake their composure.

In the other bracket, England and Sweden seem pretty fairly matched up, from what I've seen of both teams: that one could go either way.

As someone who wants to see Russia out, but must grudgingly admit that their coach drilled them well in hard D (they've been playing like a less dynamic Iran), I was happy they got matched against Croatia, because that game would result in 50+ attempts on goal until eventually something goes in. I'd have been more worried of a Denmark/Russia pairing, because there'd be a higher chance of Russia advancing there, as both teams focus on defensive counters. Overall, Croatia's my one left-over dark horse in this tournament.

Croatia are a tough nut to crack and they have creative ability throughout their team. Lovren has been immense the latter half of the season, keeping both Ronaldo and Messi quiet in matches. I'd see Brazil/France/Belgium beat them but less so Uruguay due to style of play. However, if England get past Sweden I can see us beat Croatia due to our formation and Harry Kane being on fire.

[Tapper]

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 03:11 PM, said:

Tapper, on 04 July 2018 - 02:01 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:12 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 04 July 2018 - 12:56 AM, said:

The sad thing is that the Netherlands has actually stepped away from this in recent years, partly, due to a dry spell in talented players, but the hope is that under Koeman (who is also a Cruyff adept) they might be able to rebuild this slightly. The sad reality though is that there is little money in the Dutch league these days so talent is not really coming through anymore, or they leave much to early to go play (and fail) abroad.

I'd argue that two of your better players play for Liverpool. They are awesome. If Kluivert does well at Roma? Then your National side will have a solid spine. Much better than trying to qualify for this WC with Sneijder, Babel, Kuyt or whoever hasbeens.

Wijnaldum is a tough one. When playing in the Dutch competition (also under Koeman), he more or less occupied the #10 position behind the striker. At Liverpool he plays further back but with the freedom to roam. If Koeman chooses to play with a #10 (attacking midfielder) and two men behind him, Wijnaldum is likely to be played out of position or as a shuttling player with not much room in front of him. Question is also how much he will play at Liverpool next season, with Keita and Fabinho incoming.

Technically he's brilliant, one of my favourite Liverpool midfielders. He hold the balls up well, creates space and is good at getting out of tough positions. He's not a great goal scorer, and would need someone half decent next to him to play well. I don't know how he'll rotate into Klopp's midfield next season, but we're going to need cover in those 2 holding/deeper lying cm positions as they are expected to cover quite a lot of ground every match to compensate for high full backs and wide attacking players that don't track back.

I expect Fabinho to take the deep position, Henderson to be his first cover. Keita will probably be more box-to-box in front of him, I think together with Oxlade-Chamberlain, who was really impressive when he broke into the team.
That leaves whomever stays at the club out of Wijnaldum, Lallana or Milner for the bench. If an attacking midfielder is bought to replace Coutinho (Nabil Fekir is rumoured), playing time will be scarce.

[Gorefest]

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:37 PM, said:

When Canada, Usa and Mexico host the 2026 WC do all three automatically qualify?

Sadly, yes. It will also be an insane number of competing teams in pools of three teams where the first two teams progress to the next round. Don't ask. It is FIFA's idea of getting as many nations engaged as possible (justification: giving smaller countries a chance; reality check: getting maximum profit with maximum viewing numbers and a new record of crappy matches).

[Tattersail_]

Tapper, on 04 July 2018 - 03:23 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 03:11 PM, said:

Tapper, on 04 July 2018 - 02:01 PM, said:

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:12 PM, said:

Gorefest, on 04 July 2018 - 12:56 AM, said:

The sad thing is that the Netherlands has actually stepped away from this in recent years, partly, due to a dry spell in talented players, but the hope is that under Koeman (who is also a Cruyff adept) they might be able to rebuild this slightly. The sad reality though is that there is little money in the Dutch league these days so talent is not really coming through anymore, or they leave much to early to go play (and fail) abroad.

I'd argue that two of your better players play for Liverpool. They are awesome. If Kluivert does well at Roma? Then your National side will have a solid spine. Much better than trying to qualify for this WC with Sneijder, Babel, Kuyt or whoever hasbeens.

Wijnaldum is a tough one. When playing in the Dutch competition (also under Koeman), he more or less occupied the #10 position behind the striker. At Liverpool he plays further back but with the freedom to roam. If Koeman chooses to play with a #10 (attacking midfielder) and two men behind him, Wijnaldum is likely to be played out of position or as a shuttling player with not much room in front of him. Question is also how much he will play at Liverpool next season, with Keita and Fabinho incoming.

Technically he's brilliant, one of my favourite Liverpool midfielders. He hold the balls up well, creates space and is good at getting out of tough positions. He's not a great goal scorer, and would need someone half decent next to him to play well. I don't know how he'll rotate into Klopp's midfield next season, but we're going to need cover in those 2 holding/deeper lying cm positions as they are expected to cover quite a lot of ground every match to compensate for high full backs and wide attacking players that don't track back.

I expect Fabinho to take the deep position, Henderson to be his first cover. Keita will probably be more box-to-box in front of him, I think together with Oxlade-Chamberlain, who was really impressive when he broke into the team.
That leaves whomever stays at the club out of Wijnaldum, Lallana or Milner for the bench. If an attacking midfielder is bought to replace Coutinho (Nabil Fekir is rumoured), playing time will be scarce.

Oxlade is out until November, it gives Wijnaldum a chance in that time. As a Liverpool fan it is very exciting. We need a keeper though, we are crying out for one even though Karius had an alright second half of the season.

[Gorefest]

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 01:12 PM, said:

I'd argue that two of your better players play for Liverpool. They are awesome. If Kluivert does well at Roma? Then your National side will have a solid spine. Much better than trying to qualify for this WC with Sneijder, Babel, Kuyt or whoever hasbeens.

Yes, there is hope for the near future, absolutely. With Van Dijk and De Vrij in defense we finally have some defensive quality again for the first time since the days of Jaap Stam. Kluivert will hopefully develop in Italy, or he may implode like so many Dutch youngsters do when they move abroad too early. Personally I think he should have stayed at Ajax another 1-2 seasons. Strootman has the potential to be the group leader but after his injury way back in 2014 he is only now finding his stride back. Depay has had a fantastic season in France after being pretty terrible for Manchester United and will be a key player for us. And then there are some exciting youngsters coming through like Kluivert, Kadioglu, Lammers, Bacuna and Groeneveld. So I do really hope we will return to the fold at the next Euros.

[Gorefest]

Tattersail_, on 04 July 2018 - 03:28 PM, said:

Oxlade is out until November, it gives Wijnaldum a chance in that time. As a Liverpool fan it is very exciting. We need a keeper though, we are crying out for one even though Karius had an alright second half of the season.

I am desperately hoping that Liverpool will go for Jasper Cillessen, who is currently second goalkeeper at Barcelona and the Dutch national goalkeeper. He is from (near) my home town and went through my team's youth system (NEC Nijmegen). So if they buy him Liverpool will have an absolutely awesome keeper and my club will get some desperately needed transfer funds (a percentage of the sale and some more from the developmental system pot). So Cillessen is your guy!!

[Malankazooie]

Took off work early yesterday and went out with some mates to do some pub crawling - day off today due to Independence Day holiday here in the U.S.

Anyway, I wake up with a hang over and check this thread. Wow, it's like I took a stick and thumped a hornets' nest. .

Glad to see so many of you so passionate about the history of the game and stuff. But lets turn this passion towards the present and future and get to gabbin' about the current goings on at the World Cup. Come on Sweden! Although, if they get beat by England I won't be too disappointed. For some reason I want to see an England v. Russia semifinal. If that goes down, do you think your PM will make an appearance? Maybe sit next to Putin and put on her best "look we're friends" awkward smile? What about the newly wed Duke and Duchess of Sussex? Will they make an appearance? Wow, that would be neat and sure to be the gossip of the season.Probably will show up at Wimbledon instead, the bums.

[Gorefest]

There will be no members of the British government present at the tournament at any stage, not even if they make the final. The government already announced that months ago. With the current tensions it wouldn't be advisable. No negative travel advice to English fans though, although there are significantly less English fans present at this world cup than at previous editions considering the relative short distance.

I think Sweden can really frustrate England with good defensive organisation. England showed a lack of ideas against Colombia and seems very easily put off-balance. They are however very strong at set pieces, so we may just get an England 2-1 victory from a couple of corner or free kick situations. I'm not expecting an enjoyable match from a fan perspective. It'll be slow and dogged, with very few chances created.

This post has been edited by Gorefest: 04 July 2018 - 04:01 PM

[Mentalist]

Yeah, I can see both sides forcing set-pieces (Sweden earned themselves almost as many PKs as England so far). And correct me if I'm wrong, but I got the impression that England won't really be having a big height advantage against Swedish defenders?

And yeah, I agree. I'm expecting Friday's games to be far more exciting.

[Malankazooie]

Wow. Probably the save of the tournament.

France up 1 to nil over Uruguay at half. Exciting game so far. You soccer heads watching?

[Mentalist]

French team can barely keep up with Mbappe.

Uruguay really missing Cabani to keep the offense in synch.

Great first half, overall.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 06 July 2018 - 03:00 PM

[Mentalist]

Well, that was a pretty one-sided game.

Impressive how they made Pogba a real team player, compared to 4 years ago.

[Tiste Simeon]

Glad Uruguay are out. France/England final very plausible.

[Mentalist]

Brazil/Belgium about to start.

If Belgium can get a quick goal, I can see them winning. Otherwise, Brazil is likely to steamroll them eventually.

Edit: aaaand an OG by Brazil on 13th min

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 06 July 2018 - 06:17 PM

[Mentalist]

Yeah, Brazil really wasn't ready for De Bruyne as a roving 3rd striker. And I've never seen Lukaku run so much aside of his counter-sprints.

Belgium adopted the Mexico style of counters- only with more talent and actual passing.

That being said, Brazil's early misses (and Courtois' phenomenal saves) must be getting into their heads smth fierce.

Insanely exciting though. The question is, whether Belgium can keep this running up for another full 45?

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 06 July 2018 - 06:54 PM

[Malankazooie]

Wowhoaweewha! That charge by Lukaku and finding De Bruyne for the finishing cracker of a strike. Now that's the stuff of World Cup legend.

[Dolmen 2.0]

Malankazooie, on 06 July 2018 - 07:17 PM, said:

Wowhoaweewha! That charge by Lukaku and finding De Bruyne for the finishing cracker of a strike. Now that's the stuff of World Cup legend.

Flames! what a play!

I mean I know I wanted Brazil in the final but Belgium soccer is legit, I hope they win and that nonsense Neymar's been up to comes to an end.