[Fiddler]

Apt, on 19 December 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

Andorion, on 19 December 2014 - 05:10 PM, said:

Apt, on 19 December 2014 - 07:45 AM, said:

Lets not descend into a who'd win debate but going by what we've seen Apsalar and Cots do, Apsalar would probably destroy Karsa in close combat.

Apsalar is every bit as powerful as Cotillion and Cots is an ascendant with a capital A.

Would it? Shadow magic would be nullified. Leaving her bladed weapons, speed and strength vs Karsas flint sword, strength and endurance. Going by the amount of damage Karsa can take it would be one hell of a fight, but if he managed to land one solid hit it would be devastating.

The thing about Cotillion, who is the one we are really discussing here, is that he doesn't brawl. He kills. Apsalar would use her 100's of years of experience and supernatural speed to finish the fight before it begins. Karsa's tough but he can still be killed with precision strikes. Arterial openings and severed tendons would be what you'd expect from her.

Apsalar the fishing girl (post possession) is who's being discussed (unless I missed something, which is totally possible), not Apsa'lar the Imass thief. Which is who I think you're referring to there.
Cotillion isn't even hundreds of years old at this point, more like forty or even fifty, but an Ascendant in a major house so yeah, he's got that going for him.

[worry]

Cotillion is somewhere over 100, likely less than 150, but yah definitely not multiple 100s of years old. But "Lets not descend into a who'd win debate" is as good a rule as any for this thread.

[Aptorian]

As Worry states, the Empire is over a hundred years old. Meaning Dancer/Cotillion is at least 120+ years old. Apsalar has cotillions memories and skills burned into her mind and body.

[Abyss]

Apt, on 20 December 2014 - 06:45 AM, said:

As Worry states, the Empire is over a hundred years old. Meaning Dancer/Cotillion is at least 120+ years old. Apsalar has cotillions memories and skills burned into her mind and body.

...which Cots and ST did NOT expect, btw.
...teenage girls man... You just can't trust em.

[Clawmaster]

Regarding the ascendancy question:

Apsalar took out 300+ Claw in Malaz City.

According to Shadowthrone's thoughts her shadow dance was more impressive than even Cotillion's - the god of Assassins who had possessed her.

Apsalar is definitely an Ascendant by now, and not just a low tier one.

edit: Whelp, seems someone said the exact same thing on page 1!

This post has been edited by Clawmaster: 07 February 2015 - 08:20 PM

[Tehol & Bugg Capital]

Think of Paran's thoughts on ascendants (which you can classify Aspalar as due to her possession by Cotillion).

Paran says that Ascendants aren't necessarily stronger, but its a force of will. The muscles behind a kick or a punch don't change, but the force of will behind a kick or punch is what sends the receiving party through a wall.

[Zeranamu]

Apt, on 17 December 2014 - 04:21 PM, said:

Think of Gessler breaking his hand when he punched Coltaine on the nose in DG. And these people were only on the cusp of ascending.

That's backwards, but the point is still valid. Coltaine was something nearing ascending himself, all things considered, if I recall correctly.

This post has been edited by Zeranamu: 10 July 2015 - 01:02 AM

[Kanese S's]

Whiskey Mike, on 18 December 2014 - 09:41 PM, said:

At what point do you see her ascend...is it just because she was possessed or was there another instance where you specifically she her ascend. I just assumed she was a possessed mortal who retained some of cotilions thoughts and abilities.

I would say that she was definitely an ascendant at/after the end of TBH.

The moment when Apsalar vs. All The Claw (okay, not all of them, but still hundreds of the most feared assassins in the world) = total Apsalar victory.

It's not even a close fight. She just goes into her shadow dance and completely wrecks them.

Clawmaster, on 07 February 2015 - 08:18 PM, said:

Regarding the ascendancy question:

Apsalar took out 300+ Claw in Malaz City.

According to Shadowthrone's thoughts her shadow dance was more impressive than even Cotillion's - the god of Assassins who had possessed her.

Apsalar is definitely an Ascendant by now, and not just a low tier one.

edit: Whelp, seems someone said the exact same thing on page 1!

Apsalar is basically Cotillion mk. 2, and if you're correct in that Shadowthrone said that, she may even be an improvement over the original, in which case she is an Ascendant with a capital A. At least at Karsa's level.


The point here is that if you get in a fight with Apsalar... you're gonna have a bad time.

[shovelbum]

BellaGrace, on 18 December 2014 - 04:16 PM, said:

Quote

Name one who has. (Seguleh don't count and Kallor isn't a true ascendant. )

Why do Seguleh get a pass? They're mortals still.

It was sort of a wtf moment, but Isn't the Hood agent who pops in on horseback and forgets his spear the first or second seguleh? He has a mask matching the description. No lipstick on his, though =p

Also, there were a couple lines in Memories of Ice wondering why it was Mok and not one of the higher ranked Seguleh sent as the punitive force. I think the Hood agent sort of suggests that seguleh first and second wear more hats than traveling the punitive force would allow.

Anyway, at least one of the top two seguleh would seem to be more than mortal.

This post has been edited by shovelbum: 28 January 2016 - 06:17 PM

[Geoffrey Barker]

Abyss, on 18 December 2014 - 12:07 AM, said:

Apt, on 17 December 2014 - 04:21 PM, said:

...

Apsalar is a carbon copy of a God of Killing Things, she will fuck you up.

Oh nicely phrased!

Quote

EDIT Run 3: The problem with this logic however is that if Ascendant super strength is real, then no mortal fighter should be able to block a strike with a sword from an Ascendant

Name one who has. (Seguleh don't count and Kallor isn't a true ascendant. )

Good point. Thinking about it the only one who really comes to mind is Trull versus Icarium and you know who in a later book. Icarium isn't an ascendant but he is super strong. I guess you could argue that Trull was getting mojo from the role he was playing.