[Tholen]

Thank you for posting the screenshot, yes this post is the source of my confusion

Tiamatha, on 20 August 2014 - 03:22 PM, said:

Kedeviss, on 20 August 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

Tiamatha, on 20 August 2014 - 03:00 PM, said:

Kedeviss, on 20 August 2014 - 02:45 PM, said:

Tiamatha, on 20 August 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Dragon I want Kedeviss gone

I think we have tested Kadagar and he had an LP. That leaves you and Tellan but he isn't around. You needn't worry though because your minions won't vote your way to lynch.

Tellan not being around isn't really much of an excuse. If anything, it would make more sense that he is the cult master (if one existed) and been laying low while he recruits. So clearly you have some hidden agenda in this.

Dragon, I want Tellan gone!

This is quite a desperate reaction move. You have not removed from voting Tennes?

There are 3 alts; Kedeviss, Kadagar and Tellan that have not had a role assigned to them.

There are 3 roles left; Mark the Dragon Cult Leader, Shark Face and Vittorio Malvora.

You are one of these 3 members. People will know my information is good because they themselves are included in it.

I have no ill will to Vitto but the rest of the thread will but odds are that 2 out of the 3 are people I want gone.

Once they are gone, then that will mean I am gone. I don't interfere with anyone else' VC. I just leave. Poof. Gone.

Are you claiming Vitto? If so then I have no interest in voting for you.

All this info has only come from you, and from the very beginning you claimed to be a Tyrant Steve-esque role and persona. Why would that engender any sort of trust that the information you give is entirely accurate? Of course you would include some information that people would recognize as truth, that's just basic common sense when doing a fake reveal or giving out false information - you always include some unimportant truth along with it to make the lies seem more legitimate.

But nevertheless, the information you give is entirely fishy for numerous reasons. For example, the supposed Mark role is not a Dresden role when not only every other role seen in this game, but every other role seen in every Obdigore dresden game, has been actual Dresden characters, so having a made-up power role makes no sense. Furthermore, you claim he's a regular recruiter but we have no factions listed in CFs so the rest of the thread would be entirely helpless at knowing whether they are making any headway against the cult, which is a huge design flaw.

Neither of your supposed claims add up at all, and we've yet to have any supporting evidence from any other player in the game, so far. There's essentially no reason whatsoever to believe this information, while at the same time many reasons not to. The rational course then, for me and presumably for everyone else, is to believe that it is a bunch of lies meant to mask your actual VC (because you keep claiming you only need to hurt the made-up roles) which is probably far more lethal to the rest of us than you want to admit.

I've gradually made this same analysis already, but here it is laid out together. So far, your response to any of this analysis has only been to try and shout out the same lies even louder, but you haven't been able to provide any more information or make any rational argument for why anyone should actually believe these claims, all you do is just keep saying it over and over again. If you want anyone to believe them, you need to justify it, but I suspect you are not in fact capable of that because they are indeed just lies.

If I was to make up a lie why would I use a name like "Mark the dragon cult leader". It sounds way too far fetched for it to be believed. However, I did not even mention him in my VC's, he came up in my "role find" what role performed an action the night before.

I copy and pasted my VC's earlier but now I will screenshot them.

Spoiler

[attachment=26466:VC.png]

I did not include Mac in my original VC's because he was alive and may not have wanted to work towards my goal.

You can see there is no "mark" in my VC's.

At least I have been forthcoming with VC, you have remained hidden. You do not want to escape you have let us know that much.

Why would anyone else not want to lynch you? You are not in Marcone's faction. You are not part of the Togg/Tholen group. Yet Tholen is defending you, why? Has he been recruited?

I think you are the best lynch for the whole thread. I don't know how much you have infected it though.


In fact, Tulas are you there? You have also refused to vote Kedeviss and voted along with him a few times. If Tholen has been recruited, does that directly affect you?

That's worrying actually.

Three votes to Kedeviss.

All you had to do to clear this up was let me know that the screenshot you provided your VCs from was not from Tiamatha.

[Tholen]

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 10:37 AM, said:

Why am I left speaking to you? I feel like spamming just to piss you off.

And this statement aptly illustrates why this game leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth that I am not really caring anymore to play apart from the fact that it lowers the enjoyment of those who do still play.

That attitude sucks, especially since there's no repercussion from those you do piss off, and you know it.

Quote

Let me see a screen shot of your role pm. You demand shit, because your little head cannot work things out. You have gotten yourself all mixed up because you saw something once of Korvalains.

See in that screenshot above ^ it says what just happened? That is a day action from day 2 about the night before, ie Night 1.

Why are you a retard?

When this game is done, I hope we can have a poll where we amend the general rules of the game that screenshotting PMs is out of the question even if we can quote them.

It is unfriendly to those who play from phones, it leaves less room (or much more work) for those who want to fake reveal (asking for a screenshot instead of text to verify by other players) and it can be considered a convenient way around "no quoting P-S" (which Obdi for this game expressedly allowed).

I think some discussion on perhaps limiting the number of unremovable roles in any given game might also be in order.

[Tiamatha]

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 10:37 AM, said:

Why am I left speaking to you? I feel like spamming just to piss you off.

And this statement aptly illustrates why this game leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth that I am not really caring anymore to play apart from the fact that it lowers the enjoyment of those who do still play.

That attitude sucks, especially since there's no repercussion from those you do piss off, and you know it.

Quote

Let me see a screen shot of your role pm. You demand shit, because your little head cannot work things out. You have gotten yourself all mixed up because you saw something once of Korvalains.

See in that screenshot above ^ it says what just happened? That is a day action from day 2 about the night before, ie Night 1.

Why are you a retard?

When this game is done, I hope we can have a poll where we amend the general rules of the game that screenshotting PMs is out of the question even if we can quote them.

It is unfriendly to those who play from phones, it leaves less room (or much more work) for those who want to fake reveal (asking for a screenshot instead of text to verify by other players) and it can be considered a convenient way around "no quoting P-S" (which Obdi for this game expressedly allowed).

To be fair Kalse, I only quoted my PM, the screenshot was never my idea to begin with.

[Tulas Shorn]

Tholen, on 21 August 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:

I think some discussion on perhaps limiting the number of unremovable roles in any given game might also be in order.

You don't know whether we are irremovable or just unlynchable for a day. Read Kedeviss's anti-lynch mechanic for example.

I for example, am absolutely sure that there has been no successful NK on me during the last two nights,and that is not because of my abilities. I may be NKable but no one has tried. Someone did kill of the creature in Harry's head.

[Tiamatha]

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:05 AM, said:

Tholen, on 21 August 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:

I think some discussion on perhaps limiting the number of unremovable roles in any given game might also be in order.

You don't know whether we are irremovable or just unlynchable for a day. Read Kedeviss's anti-lynch mechanic for example.

I for example, am absolutely sure that there has been no successful NK on me during the last two nights,and that is not because of my abilities. I may be NKable but no one has tried. Someone did kill of the creature in Harry's head.

The problem I have with it, is that I have not been harmful to another player in this game. I have no harmful abilities yet I am set upon daily.

[Tulas Shorn]

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:08 AM, said:

The problem I have with it, is that I have not been harmful to another player in this game. I have no harmful abilities yet I am set upon daily.

Your brilliance makes the masses jealous. Pay no attention to their pitiful cries of anger.

[Tiamatha]

If day 1-4 I have not been able to be lynched then why day 5 or 6 are people trying? They only get frustrated when it doesn't work. I provide good analysis on our last 3 suspects and no one is responding to it. The game to me is frustrating

[Tiamatha]

Tulas, have you been recruited? Would you say if you had?

[Tulas Shorn]

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

Tulas, have you been recruited? Would you say if you had?

I have not been recruited. No I wouldn't say it.

[Tiamatha]

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:17 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

Tulas, have you been recruited? Would you say if you had?

I have not been recruited. No I wouldn't say it.

What do you make of the Khadagar, Kedeviss and Tellan triangle, who do you think is who? Do you believe Kedeviss is Molly?

[Tulas Shorn]

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:19 AM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:17 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

Tulas, have you been recruited? Would you say if you had?

I have not been recruited. No I wouldn't say it.

What do you make of the Khadagar, Kedeviss and Tellan triangle, who do you think is who? Do you believe Kedeviss is Molly?

Yes, I believe Kedeviss is Molly.
I think Khadagar is the power player(Cult?) you are looking for, because of quick replacement by PS. I would test Tellan lynch proof but I don't think he is that dangerous.(Even if he is sharkface)

[Kalse]

Tholen, on 21 August 2014 - 11:02 AM, said:

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 10:37 AM, said:

Why am I left speaking to you? I feel like spamming just to piss you off.

And this statement aptly illustrates why this game leaves such a bitter taste in my mouth that I am not really caring anymore to play apart from the fact that it lowers the enjoyment of those who do still play.

That attitude sucks, especially since there's no repercussion from those you do piss off, and you know it.

Quote

Let me see a screen shot of your role pm. You demand shit, because your little head cannot work things out. You have gotten yourself all mixed up because you saw something once of Korvalains.

See in that screenshot above ^ it says what just happened? That is a day action from day 2 about the night before, ie Night 1.

Why are you a retard?

When this game is done, I hope we can have a poll where we amend the general rules of the game that screenshotting PMs is out of the question even if we can quote them.

It is unfriendly to those who play from phones, it leaves less room (or much more work) for those who want to fake reveal (asking for a screenshot instead of text to verify by other players) and it can be considered a convenient way around "no quoting P-S" (which Obdi for this game expressedly allowed).

I think some discussion on perhaps limiting the number of unremovable roles in any given game might also be in order.

I guess all of that depends on the structure of the game and we shouldn't comment on the set-up of the game until we've seen SH. There's a lot we don't know: how the 'random' lynch mechanic at a no-lynch is tied into this game, how much goes on behind the scenes, how players are supposed to fulfill their VCs.

In a way, Obdi created a sort of horror movie game: group of people gets caught between supremely powerful beings, have to co-ordinate but who can they trust? Main hope being the power players off one another and leave a door open.

There's invulnerability and invulnerability; in Tales of the Desert 2 (up until now, maybe combined with Gems Heroes II, the only instance of across-thread-invulnerability) it was the result of bad design - it wasn't the one off that was expected and it snowballed across the game as it was accessible to all (with certain degrees of ease) and affected everyone at a single location, plus the counter mechanic was more expensive than the immunity, et cetera.

In this game, it seems it is only tied to particular roles and the question still is if it is bullshitting on the player's part by pretending a one-time ability is permanent (which is good mafia play) or role-tied. If it is role-tied, then the question remains whether or not that is balanced.

In this game, it seems a NPE (negative play experience) for quite a few on thread, including me. In part, the frustration comes in my case from the behavior of the players behind the seemingly invulnerable alts in question.

I guess it's combined with the fact that for those of us who need to escape, the main motivation to post is to prevent a random lynch on ourselves or our team while we wait for Magic Moment X that will allow us out. For the invulnerable ones, the thread seems a less interesting/necessary part of the game because they can probably do the stuff they need to do during the night phase. So in this case, they spend the time on thread spamming and pissing people off.

Personally, I don't know why - yeah, sure they know that the others can't use the lynch to get rid of them when they are frustrated enough to do so, but where's the long term fun in pissing people off for two weeks on end?

[Tiamatha]

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:24 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:19 AM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:17 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:15 AM, said:

Tulas, have you been recruited? Would you say if you had?

I have not been recruited. No I wouldn't say it.

What do you make of the Khadagar, Kedeviss and Tellan triangle, who do you think is who? Do you believe Kedeviss is Molly?

Yes, I believe Kedeviss is Molly.
I think Khadagar is the power player(Cult?) you are looking for, because of quick replacement by PS. I would test Tellan lynch proof but I don't think he is that dangerous.(Even if he is sharkface)

If Khadagar is cult, Tellan is Shark Face then who would you say the vampire is?

[Tiamatha]

Korabas? He was outed by Kedeviss who has no find ability?

[Kalse]

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

If day 1-4 I have not been able to be lynched then why day 5 or 6 are people trying? They only get frustrated when it doesn't work. I provide good analysis on our last 3 suspects and no one is responding to it. The game to me is frustrating

Not only to you.
As for analysis, you want us to lynch the cult leader.

1) None of us have seen proof he exists;
2) he doesn't mess with the victory conditions of everyone who needs to escape;
3) ergo, what's in it for us to do you a favor? It isn't like you earned any sympathy this game.

[Tulas Shorn]

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Not only to you.
As for analysis, you want us to lynch the cult leader.

1) None of us have seen proof he exists;
2) he doesn't mess with the victory conditions of everyone who needs to escape;
3) ergo, what's in it for us to do you a favor? It isn't like you earned any sympathy this game.

It does hurt the escapees, if you are recruited you no longer are an escapee and your VCs change, to impossibel VCs maybe. Like killing Tiam.

[Kalse]

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Not only to you.
As for analysis, you want us to lynch the cult leader.

1) None of us have seen proof he exists;
2) he doesn't mess with the victory conditions of everyone who needs to escape;
3) ergo, what's in it for us to do you a favor? It isn't like you earned any sympathy this game.

It does hurt the escapees, if you are recruited you no longer are an escapee and your VCs change, to impossibel VCs maybe. Like killing Tiam.

So one VC we don't know how to accomplish gets replaced with another one? I don't think that's a big deal.

[Tiamatha]

Kalse you have appealed to my human side, early in the game yes I posted a lot. Since Friday I held a lot back, then I got stuck into the game and was putting two and two together. How would you feel if you are participating on thread but not being listened to, and people are just voting for you because they don't want to disrupt the factions that are forming?

From a game point of view..

Kalse, Tennes and Telas have 3 votes.

I have 1 vote.

Togg and Tholen have 2 votes.

Tulas and Kedeviss have 2 votes but have been voting with Togg and Tholen.

Osseric and Korabas appear sporadically.

Khadagar is hardly here at all.

Tellan has 1 vote.

I do not have to vote but my vote should be wanted by you because otherwise the redirect could fall your way.

So why vote for me? 5 days in a row.

Now who is next? Do you really want the other faction around? We could lynch Tholen or Togg. The independents don't care. Tellan and Kedeviss could vote these two. Bang, we move forward.

Yet we are stuck voting for the unlynchable day in and day out and that occupies the thread. I thought the above analysis would be helpful but no one is using it, and we are stuck in a rut.

[Tholen]

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

Tulas Shorn, on 21 August 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Not only to you.
As for analysis, you want us to lynch the cult leader.

1) None of us have seen proof he exists;
2) he doesn't mess with the victory conditions of everyone who needs to escape;
3) ergo, what's in it for us to do you a favor? It isn't like you earned any sympathy this game.

It does hurt the escapees, if you are recruited you no longer are an escapee and your VCs change, to impossibel VCs maybe. Like killing Tiam.

So one VC we don't know how to accomplish gets replaced with another one? I don't think that's a big deal.

It might even not arbitrarily get us killed when we try and accomplish it!

[Tiamatha]

Kalse, on 21 August 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Tiamatha, on 21 August 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

If day 1-4 I have not been able to be lynched then why day 5 or 6 are people trying? They only get frustrated when it doesn't work. I provide good analysis on our last 3 suspects and no one is responding to it. The game to me is frustrating

Not only to you.
As for analysis, you want us to lynch the cult leader.

1) None of us have seen proof he exists;
2) he doesn't mess with the victory conditions of everyone who needs to escape;
3) ergo, what's in it for us to do you a favor? It isn't like you earned any sympathy this game.

You are not seeing it. Why would you victory conditions remain to escape if you are recruited? I don't think people are trying to escape. Maybe one or two, but not all.