[Ampelas]

Aaaaaaaand I'm alone.

[Eloth]

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Aaaaaaaand I'm alone.

Yeeeup. Totally alone, can't see anyone with you through my binoculars. Poor Ampelas.

[Ampelas]

Well, I was alone, albeit briefly.

[Eloth]

Just realised I'm getting a little silly since I already know I'm a dead man walking. Ohh well.

Agree with Denul, Kaschan has done perfectly well as a "be here but totally unnoticed and unsuspected" player in this game.

Has he tried to go out on a limb for anything or been content to just be ignored? Will have to look into that.

[Blend]

I seriously hope Abyss happens to saunter through....

[Ampelas]

Eloth, on 29 May 2014 - 02:45 PM, said:

Just realised I'm getting a little silly since I already know I'm a dead man walking. Ohh well.

Agree with Denul, Kaschan has done perfectly well as a "be here but totally unnoticed and unsuspected" player in this game.

Has he tried to go out on a limb for anything or been content to just be ignored? Will have to look into that.

In my own PM to PS I said that if one of Barghast/Nimander is not scum, Kaschan hits my list next.

I know that Denul's theory has me possibly paired with Atrahal, but at this point I don't really see him as more likely to be scum.

All this can change, of course, based on what happens today, but I thought I'd get that out there.

[Barghast]

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Aaaaaaaand I'm alone.

I'm here. Let me catch up. Shouldn't take long, just the last posts from about this time yesterday until now.

[Barghast]

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 02:53 PM, said:

Eloth, on 29 May 2014 - 02:45 PM, said:

Just realised I'm getting a little silly since I already know I'm a dead man walking. Ohh well.

Agree with Denul, Kaschan has done perfectly well as a "be here but totally unnoticed and unsuspected" player in this game.

Has he tried to go out on a limb for anything or been content to just be ignored? Will have to look into that.

In my own PM to PS I said that if one of Barghast/Nimander is not scum, Kaschan hits my list next.

I know that Denul's theory has me possibly paired with Atrahal, but at this point I don't really see him as more likely to be scum.

All this can change, of course, based on what happens today, but I thought I'd get that out there.

For the record, I had a dream last night(weird, I know) that you and Eloth were scum.(odd because I tend to believe Eloth for now) Maybe my subconscious is trying to tell me something. As far as me/Nimander, I know I'm inno, not sure about Nimander yet(still reading up), but I think everyone not involved with yesterday's lynch trains is scummy, so Kaschan is moving up the suspect list.

We have some time still. With the way things have gone, most players will wait until closer to time out. I suggest we not wait too too long though.

Back to my review.

[Eloth]

Barghast, on 29 May 2014 - 03:14 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 02:53 PM, said:

Eloth, on 29 May 2014 - 02:45 PM, said:

Just realised I'm getting a little silly since I already know I'm a dead man walking. Ohh well.

Agree with Denul, Kaschan has done perfectly well as a "be here but totally unnoticed and unsuspected" player in this game.

Has he tried to go out on a limb for anything or been content to just be ignored? Will have to look into that.

In my own PM to PS I said that if one of Barghast/Nimander is not scum, Kaschan hits my list next.

I know that Denul's theory has me possibly paired with Atrahal, but at this point I don't really see him as more likely to be scum.

All this can change, of course, based on what happens today, but I thought I'd get that out there.

For the record, I had a dream last night(weird, I know) that you and Eloth were scum.(odd because I tend to believe Eloth for now) Maybe my subconscious is trying to tell me something. As far as me/Nimander, I know I'm inno, not sure about Nimander yet(still reading up), but I think everyone not involved with yesterday's lynch trains is scummy, so Kaschan is moving up the suspect list.

We have some time still. With the way things have gone, most players will wait until closer to time out. I suggest we not wait too too long though.

Back to my review.

And if I said I healed steven erikson twice would HE have been scum as well?

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 28 May 2014 - 05:05 PM, said:

Sukul Ankhadu has been modkilled for inactivity.

It is now Day 3. There are 29 hours 33 minutes remaining.

9 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid

6 votes to lynch. 5 votes to go to night.

1 vote Nimander Golit: Denul
1 vote Denul: Pallid

Not voted: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit

Ok, well my review on those not around for the last lynch is changed by this. It's bad that we don't receive Sukul cf, but it does remove a top suspect, and we can hope that we got extremely lucky and Sukul was scum. I know it's a long, long, long shot, but could Sukul mk have had something to do with no kill last night?

[Barghast]

Eloth, on 29 May 2014 - 03:21 PM, said:

Barghast, on 29 May 2014 - 03:14 PM, said:

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 02:53 PM, said:

Eloth, on 29 May 2014 - 02:45 PM, said:

Just realised I'm getting a little silly since I already know I'm a dead man walking. Ohh well.

Agree with Denul, Kaschan has done perfectly well as a "be here but totally unnoticed and unsuspected" player in this game.

Has he tried to go out on a limb for anything or been content to just be ignored? Will have to look into that.

In my own PM to PS I said that if one of Barghast/Nimander is not scum, Kaschan hits my list next.

I know that Denul's theory has me possibly paired with Atrahal, but at this point I don't really see him as more likely to be scum.

All this can change, of course, based on what happens today, but I thought I'd get that out there.

For the record, I had a dream last night(weird, I know) that you and Eloth were scum.(odd because I tend to believe Eloth for now) Maybe my subconscious is trying to tell me something. As far as me/Nimander, I know I'm inno, not sure about Nimander yet(still reading up), but I think everyone not involved with yesterday's lynch trains is scummy, so Kaschan is moving up the suspect list.

We have some time still. With the way things have gone, most players will wait until closer to time out. I suggest we not wait too too long though.

Back to my review.

And if I said I healed steven erikson twice would HE have been scum as well?

Sacrilege! Plus I made it clear it was just a dream. I also dreamt I could fly, but I'm not about to leap off a building.......or am I??

[Ampelas]

Ok, my posting window is closed for now. I shall be back before timeout, and shall hold my vote for the moment.

[Eloth]

Barghast, on 29 May 2014 - 03:24 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 28 May 2014 - 05:05 PM, said:

Sukul Ankhadu has been modkilled for inactivity.

It is now Day 3. There are 29 hours 33 minutes remaining.

9 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid

6 votes to lynch. 5 votes to go to night.

1 vote Nimander Golit: Denul
1 vote Denul: Pallid

Not voted: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Kaschan, Nimander Golit

Ok, well my review on those not around for the last lynch is changed by this. It's bad that we don't receive Sukul cf, but it does remove a top suspect, and we can hope that we got extremely lucky and Sukul was scum. I know it's a long, long, long shot, but could Sukul mk have had something to do with no kill last night?

It's not worth even spending the time considering IMO, just pretend they were never in the game in the first place. 2 posts isn't worth the time it takes to even spell the name right.

[Barghast]

Galayn Lord, on 28 May 2014 - 09:43 PM, said:

I can clear up why there was a no kill. Scum targetted me last night, but I had a BP. So it wasn't anything to do with Eloth healing Ampelas (if indeed that was the case), or scum witholding their kill.

I held off on revealing this so as to be able to judge a few reactions to the no-kill.

Now, there were a couple of posts I wanted to respond to...

This is interesting.

Sorry for catching up from back to front, so allow me some wiggle room, but this is big. I'll read the rest before commenting further, but this was one of those 'what' posts.

Edit : fixed 'this'

This post has been edited by Barghast: 29 May 2014 - 03:39 PM

[Pallid]

holy lenghty posts batman!

I'm a little baffled by the logic that ties up nimander, barg and amp then leads to the amp vote. Sure the claimed healing was not required according to the claimed bp, but does the logic trail not lead to a nimander lynch being the most productive in the given scenarios?

[Barghast]

Denul, on 29 May 2014 - 09:11 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 29 May 2014 - 08:57 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 28 May 2014 - 10:52 PM, said:

Atrahal, Nimander, Kaschan, Barghast. That's my current top suspects list.

Actually replying to the post above this one, but can't be done from a phone, too many quoteblocks.

what did you do, a ctrl+f on self-heal? In the context, it is quite clear that what I mean, is that a revealed healer ought to be a dead healer as self-healing (usually only allowed if there's a healer-pair) is the only thing that can stop a kill. And self-healing is not allowed.

Second, healer reveals cannot be proven. That creates wifom and therefore, healer reveals are bad. Unless there's a code, or a partner, to verify.

Third, a revealed healer is safe to remove by scum. So they always SHOULD.

Fourth, we have so far seen a ninja, a BP and a healer. On three gamedays. In a low TMDI game. Coincidence much?

I think Eloth is scum revealing healer, withholding a kill. I think there's enough doubt surrounding them to make that reveal unsafe. GL revealing BP (also unverifiable) might make the no-NK less suspicious, taking heat away from Eloth. I'd say that's no coincidence, but symp/fellow scum saving the day.

Otherwise, too many roles for aan easy game and too much coincidence and a whole lot of bad play and decisions by roled townies.

Yes. ^ This very much.


Atrahal, I can see those roles in the game, just not all of them. We do not have a counter reveal which backs one of them up.

I see killers being elsewhere though. I think it is symp play by either Eloth or Galayn, and that the killers are out there. Nimander, Kaschan, Pallid maybe.


If Eloth is a symp, he claims healer, we lynch him if he doesn't die at night and that would PI Amp because Eloth's CF will be a town CF.

The whole thing is a play. It does not help us, if he is the healer he should have coded it in somewhere earlier or just be lynched.


I don't like the whole mess, but I reckon if we do catch scum we can piece together a lot of it.

Here you say the killers are among Nimander, Kaschan, and Pallid.

Denul, on 29 May 2014 - 09:38 AM, said:

Pallid, on 29 May 2014 - 09:30 AM, said:

Denul and Atrahal are pushing too hard here, self healing has been done before, its quite common on other sites. But furthermore -

if Eloth is telling the truth his cf will be town healer, see Lio's CF. So a lynch of Eloth would either clear or condeme amp. However that's not a gamble I'm willing to cast at because quite simply proving it would cost us our only two possible pi's at this juncture.

denuls last two posts scream of a lynch line up to get eloth or amp on the block using false logic to push the idea.


I don't like the way you two are going here, my votes currently on Denul but I'll happily go after atrahal

eta autocorrecting an the denul false.logic ljne

I am not just going to go with the flow and see what happens. I could quite easily vote a few different ways today for various reasons. I have already stated my unwillingness to vote Eloth today because of the reveal and no deaths.

I would much rather go for Barghast because of his failed lynch, Nimander because of Barghast's failed lynch and lack of votes, Kaschan because he hasn't voted all game. I think we will find scum in one of those three, truly.

Yet, stating on thread my uneasiness over both Eloth and Galayn's reveals needed to be done.

Then shortly after, you say you want to go after me again. I don't know why you're trying hard to speculate on who scum are, but keep getting stuck on me.



I haven't pieced together what to make of GL's reveal, and frankly I see suspicion in just about everyone. We've had a ninja vig, claimed healer, and a BP. My thoughts are that someone has to be lying, or we have some bizarre role mechanics in play.

[Barghast]

Ampelas, on 29 May 2014 - 01:11 PM, said:

It's not ENTIRELY improbable that all those roles exist in this game. Vig of any type tends to kill town more often than not, and I'm guessing the BP and Heal both would not save anyone since it was a day vig. Guard and Finder are generally the more powerful town roles anyways, and if THOSE exist as well, then yeah, someone is lying. (I am NOT suggesting anyone else reveal)

At this point, I feel it is in our interest to figure out what lynch brings us the most information.

We have a Barghast non-lynch yesterday, and no NK. GL claims BP was hit, Eloth claims he healed me.

A Barghast lynch today:

If scum, that makes Nimander a top suspect, and also gives us two trains to compare. Also people ignoring a stalled lynch and pushing elsewhere become more suspicious. If innocent, it makes Nimander look a little better and doesn't really tell us much beyond speculating what scum might be on his train (yes, including me).

A Nimander lynch today:
If scum, makes Barghast look suspicious and PI's some people who have pushed for him when there was no other support. If inno, then it means I was wrong on my suspicions and I feel casts Denul in an interesting light considering he went after Nimander right away, rather than Barghast.

A Denul lynch today:

If scum, makes me look foolish and scummy for defending him. Tons of stuff on thread by him though, so there might be something to glean. If he's inno, doesn't really do much for us unless he's the symp.

An Eloth lynch today:

If scum, same as Denul - makes me look bad for defending him. If he's inno, at best he could be a symp, but I think it would point to certain people who pushed for what I feel is a bad lynch for today.

Personally, I am fine with returning to Mafia 101 and finishing a lynch that stalled. If Barghast is scum, and we let him go a second day, the screams from SH will echo for weeks. And he provides some info. I mean, if we really want to get into "OMG WIFOM DISTRACTIONS", then certainly Barghast would qualify as someone to vote for as well. Sure, why isn't Eloth dead? is a valid issue, but also, why wasn't Barghast lynched? Where'd Nimander go? Or was there someone else who was online, but just laid low?

This isn't cool. It's actually pretty messed up thinking. If I'm facing these types of thoughts then it won't ever matter what I do. This really takes the wind of of my sails.

[Galayn Lord]

To be fair, you're only focusing on the most insignificant part of Ampelas' argument.

[Nimander Golit]

I'm still alive? cool. Give me another hour or so for the aspirin to work read up. Amp might have done something to change my mind. though I doubt it.

[Nimander Golit]

Nimander Golit, on 28 May 2014 - 02:17 AM, said:

Galayn Lord, on 28 May 2014 - 01:10 AM, said:

Ack, sorry, got snagged by various things.

Ok, so what I'm seeing so far is a lot of finger-wagging and nodding over at various people, some of which may have substance, most of which is probably nothing, and some effort to coalesce all the ANGER around one individual - so all in all typical early game...except that we're already down possibly up to three townies.

Since we have little concrete to go on, I thought I'd bring back up the lynch train that was all but assured on day 1 were it not for that little suicide vig snag:

Quote

5 votes Liosan: Pallid, Denul, Barghast, Fener, Eloth

As I said, this was a pretty much dead cert lynch before the suiciding. Thus I am willing to bet everything that the corpse of Liosan owned that at least one of the ones here is scum. Luckily for us, we can already cross Fener off that list thanks to Liosan's, erm, heroics. That leaves us with Pallid, Denul, Barghast, and Eloth.

<snip>

I've been looking at that myself but from the other end. Where did the votes go after he posted the suicide trigger?

Quote

13 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Fener, Galayn Lord, Hood's Path, Kaschan, Liosan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

7 votes to lynch. 7 votes to go to night.

5 votes Liosan: Pallid, Denul, Barghast, Fener, Eloth
1 vote Galayn Lord: Hood's Path
1 vote Eloth: Ampelas
1 vote Atrahal: Liosan
1 vote Fener: Galayn Lord

Not voted: Atrahal, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Sukul Ankhadu

Lio's trigger, post 194

Amp: That sounds like an on thread ability trigger....

Hood's Path: Back and reading up. A quick skim of the most recent posts makes me think there might have been a vig of some kind?

Fener: Yeah that certainly doesnt bode well. However Im not real sure why you are focusing on me. I didnt start this train. And I gave you ample time to come back to the game and give some nice drawn out conclusions.

Hood's Path: OK, I've read up. I'm assuming that's a vig from Liosan - Lio, since we're short on time, can you confirm that that's what you're expecting to happen? It sounded like PS is not going to be back before deadline, so we're unlikely to get a resolution before then.

Hood's Path: Now, the question becomes - does this clear Liosan? Personally I find unlikely that there would be a scum vig in the game (that just seems like it would be OP in the end game), so on that basis I don't think it makes sense to complete the Liosan lynch. I guess I need to go away and have a think about who would be a viable alternative.

Ampelas replying to HP's last post: Yeah, I don't think lynching Liosan is a good idea. Even if it's a bluff, it's day one and only buys him a night, which would be dumb.

Kaschan quotes Lio's trigger post: That looks remarkably like a suicide vig. I hesitate to lynch someone until PS gets on to clarify. Which will most like be after time out.

HP posts several quotes from Eloth and then:There's enough for me to see this as a good alternative. Remove Vote. Vote Eloth

HP: Welp, that's me done - won't be back before timeout. Seems like everyone else has left already though...

Barghast quotes Lio a couple of times, comments some, and removes vote.

Galayn Lord does his stupid command line stuff, removes vote, and votes Eloth.

PS resolves the vig.


11 posts between the vig trigger and resolution. Ampelas, Hood's Path, Fener, Kaschan, Barghast, and GL. Scratch Fener and HP.

Now it comes down to what you think is the right play. I'd have continued with the LIo lynch simply because there wasn't enough time to go elsewhere. If it was vig, he dies. If it wasn't a vig, why let him live to simply be lynched the next day? HP, Amp, Kaschan, and Barghast all disagree with me and think that lynching Lio is a bad idea. HP removes and votes Eloth. Barghast simply removes. GL is last with a remove and vote Eloth with no explanation. Kaschan has no vote down and Ampelas has his firmly on Eloth.


I'm willing to bet that one of Ampelas, Kaschan, Barghast, and GL are scum. Ampelas simply thinks that lynching Liosan is a bad idea and then disappears. Not a single word of encouragement to swing and follow his own vote for Eloth. Barghast explains why he removes. Kaschan doesn't say anything beyond he's hesitant to lynch anyone until the Liosan thing plays out. GL's remove and vote comes plenty late enough that he had to know he was wasting his time.

Quote

At timeout...


11 players are alive: Ampelas, Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Galayn Lord, Hood's Path, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

7 votes to lynch. 7 votes to go to night.

3 votes Eloth: Ampelas, Hood's Path, Galayn Lord

Not voted: Atrahal, Barghast, Denul, Eloth, Kaschan, Nimander Golit, Pallid, Sukul Ankhadu

Amp's lack of enthusiasm for is own choice bothers me but GL bothers me more. His stupid posts, jumping at the PS coercion, and then the "nah, I'm just fucking with you". But I have enough doubt about that that I'm more willing to go with the safer choice; the person who reset the modkill timer during the freeze:


Vote Sukul Ankhadu

Starting here. The red highlights. GL picked up his game today. I still don't like the way he started and I'm not certain what the BP reveal does for him (as far as what I think of him.) Sukul is gone, Barghast and Kaschan I find more townie.


Day 2 no lynch:

Ampelas, on 28 May 2014 - 07:10 AM, said:

Well, based on 2 scum and a possible symp being alive, it's not the end of the world if we dont' get a lynch today. Two wrong lynches and two NK's means it's game over (nod to Nimander ). We can get an NK tonight to narrow the field, and still have two more days to get a correct lynch.

Eloth is at L-2. Denul has said he'd switch from Barghast to Eloth to get a lynch if Amp does. Amp doesn't so Denul sticks with Barghast. This is all prior to the Eloth reveal, so Amp's blase attitude can't be excused by that. Apparently Amp doesn't care if we don't lynch and doesn't care about an NK. Cutesy cat pictures doesn't make that attitude any less scummy.