[umbraticus]

hi,

i finished reading the malazan book of the fallen a few weeks ago and man it was a ride!!
however, i hoped (rather naively) to get a lot of answers to the millions of questions SE throws at you as a reader. even the last book in the series doesn't shy away from throwing mysterious stuff in just to tingle those curioussensors without answering them later. some are more difficult to answer than others and i've also forgotten some of them through the series because i didn't write them down .
i hoped the collective brain of this forum could answer some of these questions. i haven't read any other novels from SE, so if the answer to a question is written in one of those, just mention it and i'll discover it later.

1. somewhere in the last book we get a tiny piece of thoughts going on in shadowthrones head. it serves little purpose other than hinting he's a sons of a god and or goddes!! say what? his mother belittles him for 'only ruling a small empire' and 'choosing to rule a broken realm' his father accomplished more. i guess this is just promo for the books that focus on kellanved and dancers history?
2. so around dust of dreams i think olar ethil appears into the story without much precedence or actions leading up to it. like a t'lan imass rising from dust . she calls herself the mother of all races and always threatens everyone she meets with how powerful she is. but we never get a real full backstory. some hints are dropped she would be more ancient than the eleint and the elder gods themselves. if she is a godess and mother of all races (the ape-folk preceding the t'lan imass too), why was she affected by the ritual? and basicly, who the hell is she?

3. another plain and simple where the hell did he actually come from: ruthan gud... imass even call him elder one. the first time we hear from him is in his heroic stormrider magic charge against the nahruk. subquestion: how did he obtain that magic? he tells that he sort of borrowed it. another related question: do we ever get the full history about the wall and the stormriders? the characters always only know more like myths about it.

4. why does feners blood give the imass back their flesh? or why didn't they figure this out earlier

5. who told carsa to go to darujistan and destroy the altar of fener? why did he do it? and how did he know the exact timing when he would manifest?

6. the tyrants of darujhistan, who were they? and because i think these are related to it: why are there pickled seguleh beneath krulls temple/bar?

7. on the last pages of the book wants to use crokus to 'remind a fop' who is in charge of the game. is that fop the errant? there's still so much going on at the ending of the book, i want moooore!



wow, that's actually quite the list . feel free to answer whatever question you feel like. or direct me to a thread where it has already been discussed but i missed in my read through the last few pages.

This post has been edited by umbraticus: 19 March 2014 - 08:06 PM

[worry]

1) Shouldn't be taken so literally. Kel is just ruminating on what a nag his ma was, and he's imagining her with hyperbole in the frame of what he's managed to accomplish.

2) Olar Ethil has been around since Deadhouse Gates. There's not much clarification one can do here except point out that Elder Gods do get screentime in the Karkhanas Trilogy.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

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1. somewhere in the last book we get a tiny piece of thoughts going on in shadowthrones head. it serves little purpose other than hinting he's a sons of a god and or goddes!! say what? his mother belittles him for 'only ruling a small empire' and 'choosing to rule a broken realm' his father accomplished more. i guess this is just promo for the books that focus on kellanved and dancers history?

The family stuff fleshes out the character. Night of Knives goes into the Ascension of Kellenved and Dancer, but thats about it and it doesnt contain any of theor POVs.

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2. so around dust of dreams i think olar ethil appears into the story without much precedence or actions leading up to it. like a t'lan imass rising from dust . she calls herself the mother of all races and always threatens everyone she meets with how powerful she is. but we never get a real full backstory. some hints are dropped she would be more ancient than the eleint and the elder gods themselves. if she is a godess and mother of all races (the ape-folk preceding the t'lan imass too), why was she affected by the ritual? and basicly, who the hell is she?

RAFO especially Forge of Darkness, for more about Olar Ethil's batshit craziness. She does a lot of boasting, and how much is true or not is debateable. She bound herself to the ritual, mostly because she is vindictive and crazy.

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3. another plain and simple where the hell did he actually come from: ruthan gud... imass even call him elder one. the first time we hear from him is in his heroic stormrider magic charge against the nahruk. subquestion: how did he obtain that magic? he tells that he sort of borrowed it. another related question: do we ever get the full history about the wall and the stormriders? the characters always only know more like myths about it.

Gudd is a mystery but the clues are there to infer. RAFO for more possibilities. He also has some words to say in the Bonehunters. Go back and check that out. The Stormrider stuff is dealt with in ICE's Stonewielder, but whether you find that info to be good enough is subjective.

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4. why does feners blood give the imass back their flesh? or why didn't they figure this out earlier

Well, its not like you could just call down a God with a dog whistle. It took the battle cries of ascentants to make him manifest fully for real above Kolanse. And blood has power. Especially a God's blood. The specific details were never revealed but we have seen others use blood for rituals.

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5. who told carsa to go to darujistan and destroy the altar of fener? why did he do it? and how did he know the exact timing when he would manifest?

That was Picker, the retired Bridgeburner. She got lost in the Azath in Darujhistan and I think it was Hood that she eventually crossed paths with and charged her with the mission. He did it because he was tasked with the mission, and lets face it, if Karsa was told he had the chance to kill a God, I think he would embrace that opportunity wholeheartedly. He knew when the manifestation would happen because he was a. In Fener's temple and b. he is sensitive to the magic of Wu and probably just knew. Also, he is the Knight of the House of CHains, and probably was tuned into what was happening in Kolanse and at the Spire.

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6. the tyrants of darujhistan, who were they? and because i think these are related to it: why are there pickled seguleh beneath krulls temple/bar?

Read Orb Sceptre Throne for answers similar to what you got in Stoneweilder.

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7. on the last pages of the book wants to use crokus to 'remind a fop' who is in charge of the game. is that fop the errant? there's still so much going on at the ending of the book, i want moooore!

Shadowthrone is actually talking about Malick Rel. If u remem,ber back at the beginning of Gardens of the Moon, Cotillion posesses Sorry to exact revenge on Laseen. Cots says "The hell you will!" and this is sort of like Cotillion saying "Oh no, we're going to go through THIS again, Kels..."

[Soulcrusher]

I thought Olar Ethil was first mentioned in Gardens Of The Moon, something about a huge mage battle over *can't remember the name of the city*

[worry]

Mentioned in GotM, first on-screen appearance in DG.

[D'iversify]

Soulcrusher, on 20 March 2014 - 12:05 AM, said:

I thought Olar Ethil was first mentioned in Gardens Of The Moon, something about a huge mage battle over *can't remember the name of the city*

Battle of Kartool, google ebook page 320: http://books.google....&q=olar&f=false

[Andorion]

4. why does feners blood give the imass back their flesh? or why didn't they figure this out earlier


You know I just got this image in my head of Fener running for his life, chased by a bunch of crazed Imass waving their stone swords:

"Don't be afraid! We just want to cut you and drain your blood!"

"I am not T'iam!!!!!!"

[umbraticus]

worry, on 19 March 2014 - 08:51 PM, said:

1) Shouldn't be taken so literally. Kel is just ruminating on what a nag his ma was, and he's imagining her with hyperbole in the frame of what he's managed to accomplish.

haha, typical theatric shadowthrone

Andorion, on 22 March 2014 - 03:36 AM, said:

4. why does feners blood give the imass back their flesh? or why didn't they figure this out earlier


You know I just got this image in my head of Fener running for his life, chased by a bunch of crazed Imass waving their stone swords:

"Don't be afraid! We just want to cut you and drain your blood!"

"I am not T'iam!!!!!!"

haha! i would really want to see that happening


thanks all for the answers everyone

[umbraticus]

i suddenly remembered another question i encountered in the series.
in (i think) dust of dreams Seren Pedac travels with silchas ruin and the whole gang, when she is 'contacted' by the warren of mokra. she would hold a lot of potential as a mage and possibly be of the level of a high mage. this passage really struck me as something significant because a person is contacted by a warren. there is no precedent or repetition of this kind of contact so i'm assuming it was some sort of ascendant. however, through all of the following events this never gets explained. why was she contacted, who or what was that and what was that moments significance?

[Abyss]

umbraticus, on 24 March 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

i suddenly remembered another question i encountered in the series.
in (i think) dust of dreams Seren Pedac travels with silchas ruin and the whole gang, when she is 'contacted' by the warren of mokra. she would hold a lot of potential as a mage and possibly be of the level of a high mage. this passage really struck me as something significant because a person is contacted by a warren. there is no precedent or repetition of this kind of contact so i'm assuming it was some sort of ascendant. however, through all of the following events this never gets explained. why was she contacted, who or what was that and what was that moments significance?

Mokra was was one of the three chained dragons Cotillion visits in Meanas. I don't remember which one, but my take is that her blood is what powers Mokra and it was her voice.

[Andorion]

Abyss, on 24 March 2014 - 08:42 PM, said:

umbraticus, on 24 March 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

i suddenly remembered another question i encountered in the series.
in (i think) dust of dreams Seren Pedac travels with silchas ruin and the whole gang, when she is 'contacted' by the warren of mokra. she would hold a lot of potential as a mage and possibly be of the level of a high mage. this passage really struck me as something significant because a person is contacted by a warren. there is no precedent or repetition of this kind of contact so i'm assuming it was some sort of ascendant. however, through all of the following events this never gets explained. why was she contacted, who or what was that and what was that moments significance?

Mokra was was one of the three chained dragons Cotillion visits in Meanas. I don't remember which one, but my take is that her blood is what powers Mokra and it was her voice.

This raises a rather worrying question. How many warrens are powered by Eleint? We know they are stuck in Starvald Demelain, or in some cases imprisoned in Shadow, but apparently they can reach through Warren barriers, so.....

[worry]

Basically all of the human ones, ie all of the ones that flow through K'rul.

[Abyss]

Andorion, on 27 March 2014 - 03:31 AM, said:

Abyss, on 24 March 2014 - 08:42 PM, said:

umbraticus, on 24 March 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

i suddenly remembered another question i encountered in the series.
in (i think) dust of dreams Seren Pedac travels with silchas ruin and the whole gang, when she is 'contacted' by the warren of mokra...why was she contacted, who or what was that and what was that moments significance?

Mokra was was one of the three chained dragons Cotillion visits in Meanas. I don't remember which one, but my take is that her blood is what powers Mokra and it was her voice.

This raises a rather worrying question. How many warrens are powered by Eleint? We know they are stuck in Starvald Demelain, or in some cases imprisoned in Shadow, but apparently they can reach through Warren barriers, so.....

worry, on 27 March 2014 - 04:26 AM, said:

Basically all of the human ones, ie all of the ones that flow through K'rul.

Should qualify something, the dragons don't necessarily provide the power for the warrens. It's strongly suggested they helped Krul 'shape' them.

There are also certain warrens like Aral Gamelon (demon summoning) that likely have nothing to do with Krul and the dragons' shaping.

Also, the dragons who helped Krul all seemed to be ones active in the world, or at least not stuck in Starvald Demelain as seen in RG/prior to events in TCG.

[Mekeritrig]

Abyss, on 24 March 2014 - 08:42 PM, said:

umbraticus, on 24 March 2014 - 08:24 PM, said:

i suddenly remembered another question i encountered in the series.
in (i think) dust of dreams Seren Pedac travels with silchas ruin and the whole gang, when she is 'contacted' by the warren of mokra. she would hold a lot of potential as a mage and possibly be of the level of a high mage. this passage really struck me as something significant because a person is contacted by a warren. there is no precedent or repetition of this kind of contact so i'm assuming it was some sort of ascendant. however, through all of the following events this never gets explained. why was she contacted, who or what was that and what was that moments significance?

Mokra was was one of the three chained dragons Cotillion visits in Meanas. I don't remember which one, but my take is that her blood is what powers Mokra and it was her voice.

I was under the impression that the warren had self-manifested a consciousness. It's unprecedented, but it's the warren of the mind -- if any warren were going to do it, it'd be Mockra. It just makes sense that the power of conscious thought would develop a meta-consciousness. Granted, then I'm not sure how the dragons fit in....

[amphibian]

Mekeritrig, on 04 April 2014 - 01:39 AM, said:

I was under the impression that the warren had self-manifested a consciousness. It's unprecedented, but it's the warren of the mind -- if any warren were going to do it, it'd be Mockra. It just makes sense that the power of conscious thought would develop a meta-consciousness. Granted, then I'm not sure how the dragons fit in....

Eloth says that she is the Mistress of Illusions, Meanas, Mockra and Thyr, and that her blood shapes things. So, yes, if we can take her word at face value(we likely can because the three chained dragons are surprisingly trustworthy elsewhere), she is saying she is the voice within Mockra and the living embodiment of the warren.

However, I suspect that she isn't absolutely essential to the functioning of the warren and that it would continue as a magical source of power if she died. It could be a sort of "Mockra grew beyond the initial framework Eloth set forth" situation.

[Tony-t]

JUST JUST JUST finished crippled god. Best series that I have ever read, now I have to look for another one (don't think an others will compare but.

I was sort of worried for ericksen throughout the whole tenth book, think how could he wrap up so many characters. I thought he did a pretty good job, but as usual the journey is better than destination. Just a few questions/ comments off the top of my head.

1. really expected a longer scene between tavore and ganoes. Ganoes got lost in this story, too bad I really liked him. But I thought there would be more of a key exchange between the siblings, although the "I lost her" line from tavore was pretty heart felt. referring to felisin im guessing.

2.WHY did tavore do all this, when she said the line I stated above, I thought maybe it was because she thought felisin was in kolanse. Maybe im just having trouble accepting she did all this just to free this crippled god, maybe im missing something huge. maybe Im just reaching but I felt there was another purpose to all of this

3.What role did draconus play? shadowthrone visits him and they "aqree" on something but then im not sure we even see him again WHERE DID HE GO

4.Quick Ben... throughout this entire book I thought they were going to have some huge reveal about him (ruthan gudd laugh when he hears "adeaphon Delat") I thought that maybe some of his souls would be revealed.

5. legitimately forgot about crokus, came out of nowhere.

[worry]

2) Well, setting free the Crippled God = saving the world, more or less, so it was a pretty good idea regardless.
3) I don't remember the details, but I'm pretty sure what Draconus agreed to was not to interfere with something or another. He took some vengeance out on some deserving people, let off some steam that way, but essentially he agreed not to take part in the convergence.