[Barghast]

morning, guys

[Barghast]

just catching up. two NKs is bad.

[Hanas]

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

I want to look at the Cast train, see where, how and why it kicks off. There's a lot of people coming out of the woodworks and jumping on, and why? Low-posting is one, but the expectation of a connection or trying to use the reveal as legitimization is a whole other thing. It was a cheap trick to dump a vote and disappear again.

If Alkend was scum and Cast was his symp coming to his rescue, we would have gotten an inno CF anyway, so why lynch Cast?
If Cast wanted to avoid attention or turn a lynch, all he ahd to do was claim work was difficult, drag up a different case and vote on that.
There was weird judgment there from both Cast, unless he was genuine, and from those jumping onto the train, for not considering the motivation.

That clarifies a whole lot better how I feel about it yesterday's lynch.
Not being around may have spared me the tension of the moment, though.

In other news, tomorrow I will probably do a single one-line post to keep myself from being mod-killed, as I am without access for the weekend, which I will spend on DIY in and around the house. That's going to suck balls for my access, as the computer room is one of the things being overhauled and re-painted.

You are quoting one of your own previous posts as something that better clarifies your feelings? ummm ok.

[Gait]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

I want to look at the Cast train, see where, how and why it kicks off. There's a lot of people coming out of the woodworks and jumping on, and why? Low-posting is one, but the expectation of a connection or trying to use the reveal as legitimization is a whole other thing. It was a cheap trick to dump a vote and disappear again.

If Alkend was scum and Cast was his symp coming to his rescue, we would have gotten an inno CF anyway, so why lynch Cast?
If Cast wanted to avoid attention or turn a lynch, all he ahd to do was claim work was difficult, drag up a different case and vote on that.
There was weird judgment there from both Cast, unless he was genuine, and from those jumping onto the train, for not considering the motivation.

That clarifies a whole lot better how I feel about it yesterday's lynch.
Not being around may have spared me the tension of the moment, though.

In other news, tomorrow I will probably do a single one-line post to keep myself from being mod-killed, as I am without access for the weekend, which I will spend on DIY in and around the house. That's going to suck balls for my access, as the computer room is one of the things being overhauled and re-painted.

You are quoting one of your own previous posts as something that better clarifies your feelings? ummm ok.

Skimming much?

I added three bolded, italicized sentences/ sentence parts to the previous text and that is the clarification on the previous text.

[Jalan]

all right, I'm around

bad news on the double kill, one from each castle sort of makes me think about the location being a factor.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 21 hours and 51 minutes remaining
16 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, D'riss, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

9 votes to lynch, 8 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Alkend ( D'riss )
1 Vote for Rashan ( Gait )

Players not voted: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Eloth, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

[Hanas]

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

I want to look at the Cast train, see where, how and why it kicks off. There's a lot of people coming out of the woodworks and jumping on, and why? Low-posting is one, but the expectation of a connection or trying to use the reveal as legitimization is a whole other thing. It was a cheap trick to dump a vote and disappear again.

If Alkend was scum and Cast was his symp coming to his rescue, we would have gotten an inno CF anyway, so why lynch Cast?
If Cast wanted to avoid attention or turn a lynch, all he ahd to do was claim work was difficult, drag up a different case and vote on that.
There was weird judgment there from both Cast, unless he was genuine, and from those jumping onto the train, for not considering the motivation.

That clarifies a whole lot better how I feel about it yesterday's lynch.
Not being around may have spared me the tension of the moment, though.

In other news, tomorrow I will probably do a single one-line post to keep myself from being mod-killed, as I am without access for the weekend, which I will spend on DIY in and around the house. That's going to suck balls for my access, as the computer room is one of the things being overhauled and re-painted.

You are quoting one of your own previous posts as something that better clarifies your feelings? ummm ok.

Skimming much?

I added three bolded, italicized sentences/ sentence parts to the previous text and that is the clarification on the previous text.

I saw and read it. I am just saying that it is weird to do that. Kind of old man at a play ground looking at the kiddies weird.

[Gait]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:29 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 01:19 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Gait, on 01 August 2013 - 12:42 PM, said:

I want to look at the Cast train, see where, how and why it kicks off. There's a lot of people coming out of the woodworks and jumping on, and why? Low-posting is one, but the expectation of a connection or trying to use the reveal as legitimization is a whole other thing. It was a cheap trick to dump a vote and disappear again.

If Alkend was scum and Cast was his symp coming to his rescue, we would have gotten an inno CF anyway, so why lynch Cast?
If Cast wanted to avoid attention or turn a lynch, all he ahd to do was claim work was difficult, drag up a different case and vote on that.
There was weird judgment there from both Cast, unless he was genuine, and from those jumping onto the train, for not considering the motivation.

That clarifies a whole lot better how I feel about it yesterday's lynch.
Not being around may have spared me the tension of the moment, though.

In other news, tomorrow I will probably do a single one-line post to keep myself from being mod-killed, as I am without access for the weekend, which I will spend on DIY in and around the house. That's going to suck balls for my access, as the computer room is one of the things being overhauled and re-painted.

You are quoting one of your own previous posts as something that better clarifies your feelings? ummm ok.

Skimming much?

I added three bolded, italicized sentences/ sentence parts to the previous text and that is the clarification on the previous text.

I saw and read it. I am just saying that it is weird to do that. Kind of old man at a play ground looking at the kiddies weird.

The alternative was a fucking edit, which is old man at a play ground touching the kiddies forbidden.

[Mockra]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Well it looks like people are going all vote happy with the entire day left. I don't entirely understand how someone can think that Cast was a symp. The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them. It is better to assume that you lynched town then that you might have lynched a symp. Yesterday did leave us with a completed lynch train. There is also a starter train on Alkend and a attempted train on Barghast.

Path-Shaper, on 31 July 2013 - 11:12 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 7 hours and 56 minutes remaining

19 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Cast, D'riss, Desra, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Liosan, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

10 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Rashan ( Cast )
5 Votes for Alkend ( Okaros, Mockra, Gait, Trake, Liosan )
1 Vote for Desra ( Korbas )
10 Votes for Cast ( Barghast, Rashan, Alkend, Tellan, Desra, Anthras, Kalse, D'riss, Hanas, Galain)

Players not voted: Eloth, Jalan


That is a lynch.

Cast is dead. He was Yasuhide Narumasa and Peanutbutta of Arai Castle

scene forthcoming.

Path-Shaper, on 01 August 2013 - 03:19 AM, said:

Yoshiatsu still watched from the battlements long after the first skirmishes of the siege had ended. Ladders had been repelled with arrows and large rolling balls of burning pitch. The return arrow fire had cost him some defenders, but the fire arrows which had flown early on in the battle had been quickly extinguished. The attack had been a probing one, he knew. Serious numbers of forces had yet been committed by either side, the Fujiwari were simply testing the defenses and the backbones of those who defended. They should have known better, Yoshiatsu thought. The Miura were fighting for their last hope, there would be no easy victory here for those bastards from Odawara.
---------
General Ota surveyed the new disposition of the Fujiwari troops as they remade their camp in a forward position. As expected, Edo castle's outermost wall, which was really little more than a low fence ringed by a ditch, had not held long, and the retreat into the main portion of the keep had been orderly and well timed. If his troops had been less disciplined, the Fujiwari might have enjoyed slaughter, but the losses on the day were minimal. The loss of that outer defense was not much cause for concern either, as it would do little to help the Fujiwari unless it were to guard their retreat. "And let us hope it comes to that." Ota grimaced.

Night 2 is over.

Desra is dead. He was Kenji Tama and Blend of Arai castle.

Liosan is dead. He was Nobuhisa Genji and twelve of Edo castle.

From the CF's it looks to me like Cast was towny. I put his play down to panicky play because he came on and there was a major train on him. It happens.

Cast would still appear a towny from the CF, even if he was a symp though. Some players are saying they still don't like how the Alkend-Cast scene went down, and that Cast's play could have been that of a symp, while others may believe Cast and Alkend are town. But you are the only one that has come out to say that with the CF as it is, that Cast couldn't have been a symp, therefore Alkend is clear. I don't like this. I'd have been much more at ease had you said you believed Cast and Alkend were telling the truth, but to try to paint them as guaranteed innocent isn't the mafia way.

I can't understand how both Alkend and Cast could have played that so damned stupid if they were telling the truth. Gait's post sums up what I was already thinking a possible outcome could be.

Everyone, and myself included, needs to be more vocal. All of us, with a few brave exceptions, are acting too afraid to get too involved in the discussions or to talk game theory which might help us single out better targets that might be scum, because doing so sometimes draws the lynch their way. This happens sometimes, yes, but usually when only one or two people speak up while everyone else coasts, hoping to stay alive at the expense of not helping at all.

VOTE ALKEND

We have plenty of time, and I'll be looking into other and better cases, but for now this seems safe to me.

[Barghast]

ATM I'm not too enamourrred with the idea of lynching Rash. His play stinks of poor town play, but I'm not getting too many scum vibes from him.

wrt to Alkend: ok, so he calims his role is a "courier" or w/e--so when 2 factions make some kind of connection/"alliance", his continued existance will mean they get off-thread comms--that's how I read that reveal. while I find the value of such role kinda dubious, it's also way too elaborate a reveal to fake, imho. So i'm willing to give him a pass for now.

of the remainder, doing a brief name skim, Tellan pings my radar a bit. His play is verymmuch like that of a guarded and not so out-spoken Rashan. There's sme eagerness to kinda jump anywhere, but without the colourful commentary.

I'd need a re-read to be more certain, but right now that's where i'd be interested in looking.

and with that, I gotta go get some work done.

[Galain]

The alliance thing stinks to high heaven. This is Town vs Scum. Not faction. Yeah we have two Town teams, what does an alliance gain, we're still going after scum and we have no VCs that say we need to eliminate the other town so why would there be an alliance mechanic?

[Hanas]

Mockra, on 01 August 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Well it looks like people are going all vote happy with the entire day left. I don't entirely understand how someone can think that Cast was a symp. The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them. It is better to assume that you lynched town then that you might have lynched a symp. Yesterday did leave us with a completed lynch train. There is also a starter train on Alkend and a attempted train on Barghast.

Path-Shaper, on 31 July 2013 - 11:12 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 7 hours and 56 minutes remaining

19 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Cast, D'riss, Desra, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Liosan, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

10 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Rashan ( Cast )
5 Votes for Alkend ( Okaros, Mockra, Gait, Trake, Liosan )
1 Vote for Desra ( Korbas )
10 Votes for Cast ( Barghast, Rashan, Alkend, Tellan, Desra, Anthras, Kalse, D'riss, Hanas, Galain)

Players not voted: Eloth, Jalan


That is a lynch.

Cast is dead. He was Yasuhide Narumasa and Peanutbutta of Arai Castle

scene forthcoming.

Path-Shaper, on 01 August 2013 - 03:19 AM, said:

Yoshiatsu still watched from the battlements long after the first skirmishes of the siege had ended. Ladders had been repelled with arrows and large rolling balls of burning pitch. The return arrow fire had cost him some defenders, but the fire arrows which had flown early on in the battle had been quickly extinguished. The attack had been a probing one, he knew. Serious numbers of forces had yet been committed by either side, the Fujiwari were simply testing the defenses and the backbones of those who defended. They should have known better, Yoshiatsu thought. The Miura were fighting for their last hope, there would be no easy victory here for those bastards from Odawara.
---------
General Ota surveyed the new disposition of the Fujiwari troops as they remade their camp in a forward position. As expected, Edo castle's outermost wall, which was really little more than a low fence ringed by a ditch, had not held long, and the retreat into the main portion of the keep had been orderly and well timed. If his troops had been less disciplined, the Fujiwari might have enjoyed slaughter, but the losses on the day were minimal. The loss of that outer defense was not much cause for concern either, as it would do little to help the Fujiwari unless it were to guard their retreat. "And let us hope it comes to that." Ota grimaced.

Night 2 is over.

Desra is dead. He was Kenji Tama and Blend of Arai castle.

Liosan is dead. He was Nobuhisa Genji and twelve of Edo castle.

From the CF's it looks to me like Cast was towny. I put his play down to panicky play because he came on and there was a major train on him. It happens.

Cast would still appear a towny from the CF, even if he was a symp though. Some players are saying they still don't like how the Alkend-Cast scene went down, and that Cast's play could have been that of a symp, while others may believe Cast and Alkend are town. But you are the only one that has come out to say that with the CF as it is, that Cast couldn't have been a symp, therefore Alkend is clear. I don't like this. I'd have been much more at ease had you said you believed Cast and Alkend were telling the truth, but to try to paint them as guaranteed innocent isn't the mafia way.

I can't understand how both Alkend and Cast could have played that so damned stupid if they were telling the truth. Gait's post sums up what I was already thinking a possible outcome could be.

Everyone, and myself included, needs to be more vocal. All of us, with a few brave exceptions, are acting too afraid to get too involved in the discussions or to talk game theory which might help us single out better targets that might be scum, because doing so sometimes draws the lynch their way. This happens sometimes, yes, but usually when only one or two people speak up while everyone else coasts, hoping to stay alive at the expense of not helping at all.

VOTE ALKEND

We have plenty of time, and I'll be looking into other and better cases, but for now this seems safe to me.

Really you can't understand how they could have been so stupid. Hehehehehehehe. That is rich.

Perhaps it is the fact that we just got done watching Khell lead multiple towns around by the nose with town making mistake after mistake that I can easily see two town players being that stupid. It is what town does. As for not thinking that Cast is a symp. Why would I do that. What possible good can come from thinking that Cast was anything other the town. WCS says that you can never assume that a symp has been lynched. There for I base my judgements off of the CF and Cast was town. If he was a symp nobody will know until the game is over. Assuming that Cast was a symp just leads to WIFOM with leads to scum running the game and getting town lynches with very little helpful information being put forth on the thread. For someone who is talking about how we have time and that people should step up you are sure quick to lay down a vote and continue a train. That is not very townish at all. Your entire posts smacks of someone who is attempting to make some kind of effort but not actually wanting to at all. Your post is contradictory which is not very townish behavior either.

[Barghast]

Galain, on 01 August 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

The alliance thing stinks to high heaven. This is Town vs Scum. Not faction. Yeah we have two Town teams, what does an alliance gain, we're still going after scum and we have no VCs that say we need to eliminate the other town so why would there be an alliance mechanic?

off-thread comms. some mods value them over others.

[Barghast]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:57 PM, said:

Mockra, on 01 August 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Well it looks like people are going all vote happy with the entire day left. I don't entirely understand how someone can think that Cast was a symp. The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them. It is better to assume that you lynched town then that you might have lynched a symp. Yesterday did leave us with a completed lynch train. There is also a starter train on Alkend and a attempted train on Barghast.

Path-Shaper, on 31 July 2013 - 11:12 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 7 hours and 56 minutes remaining

19 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Cast, D'riss, Desra, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Liosan, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

10 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Rashan ( Cast )
5 Votes for Alkend ( Okaros, Mockra, Gait, Trake, Liosan )
1 Vote for Desra ( Korbas )
10 Votes for Cast ( Barghast, Rashan, Alkend, Tellan, Desra, Anthras, Kalse, D'riss, Hanas, Galain)

Players not voted: Eloth, Jalan


That is a lynch.

Cast is dead. He was Yasuhide Narumasa and Peanutbutta of Arai Castle

scene forthcoming.

Path-Shaper, on 01 August 2013 - 03:19 AM, said:

Yoshiatsu still watched from the battlements long after the first skirmishes of the siege had ended. Ladders had been repelled with arrows and large rolling balls of burning pitch. The return arrow fire had cost him some defenders, but the fire arrows which had flown early on in the battle had been quickly extinguished. The attack had been a probing one, he knew. Serious numbers of forces had yet been committed by either side, the Fujiwari were simply testing the defenses and the backbones of those who defended. They should have known better, Yoshiatsu thought. The Miura were fighting for their last hope, there would be no easy victory here for those bastards from Odawara.
---------
General Ota surveyed the new disposition of the Fujiwari troops as they remade their camp in a forward position. As expected, Edo castle's outermost wall, which was really little more than a low fence ringed by a ditch, had not held long, and the retreat into the main portion of the keep had been orderly and well timed. If his troops had been less disciplined, the Fujiwari might have enjoyed slaughter, but the losses on the day were minimal. The loss of that outer defense was not much cause for concern either, as it would do little to help the Fujiwari unless it were to guard their retreat. "And let us hope it comes to that." Ota grimaced.

Night 2 is over.

Desra is dead. He was Kenji Tama and Blend of Arai castle.

Liosan is dead. He was Nobuhisa Genji and twelve of Edo castle.

From the CF's it looks to me like Cast was towny. I put his play down to panicky play because he came on and there was a major train on him. It happens.

Cast would still appear a towny from the CF, even if he was a symp though. Some players are saying they still don't like how the Alkend-Cast scene went down, and that Cast's play could have been that of a symp, while others may believe Cast and Alkend are town. But you are the only one that has come out to say that with the CF as it is, that Cast couldn't have been a symp, therefore Alkend is clear. I don't like this. I'd have been much more at ease had you said you believed Cast and Alkend were telling the truth, but to try to paint them as guaranteed innocent isn't the mafia way.

I can't understand how both Alkend and Cast could have played that so damned stupid if they were telling the truth. Gait's post sums up what I was already thinking a possible outcome could be.

Everyone, and myself included, needs to be more vocal. All of us, with a few brave exceptions, are acting too afraid to get too involved in the discussions or to talk game theory which might help us single out better targets that might be scum, because doing so sometimes draws the lynch their way. This happens sometimes, yes, but usually when only one or two people speak up while everyone else coasts, hoping to stay alive at the expense of not helping at all.

VOTE ALKEND

We have plenty of time, and I'll be looking into other and better cases, but for now this seems safe to me.

Really you can't understand how they could have been so stupid. Hehehehehehehe. That is rich.

Perhaps it is the fact that we just got done watching Khell lead multiple towns around by the nose with town making mistake after mistake that I can easily see two town players being that stupid. It is what town does. As for not thinking that Cast is a symp. Why would I do that. What possible good can come from thinking that Cast was anything other the town. WCS says that you can never assume that a symp has been lynched. There for I base my judgements off of the CF and Cast was town. If he was a symp nobody will know until the game is over. Assuming that Cast was a symp just leads to WIFOM with leads to scum running the game and getting town lynches with very little helpful information being put forth on the thread. For someone who is talking about how we have time and that people should step up you are sure quick to lay down a vote and continue a train. That is not very townish at all. Your entire posts smacks of someone who is attempting to make some kind of effort but not actually wanting to at all. Your post is contradictory which is not very townish behavior either.

Agree with everything but the underlined. in theory, townies should always be honest and straightforward. In practice, town players are notorious for using their toes to test their gag reflexes.

[Hanas]

Galain, on 01 August 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

The alliance thing stinks to high heaven. This is Town vs Scum. Not faction. Yeah we have two Town teams, what does an alliance gain, we're still going after scum and we have no VCs that say we need to eliminate the other town so why would there be an alliance mechanic?

I can think of several things that an alliance bring. We saw no night kills on night one and then one from each town faction last night. Shin said that this was not a M/P game but that it isn't a high tmdi. So there is probably some kind of mechanic where the to town factions can join. I am inclined to believe it for now.

[Hanas]

Barghast, on 01 August 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:57 PM, said:

Mockra, on 01 August 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Well it looks like people are going all vote happy with the entire day left. I don't entirely understand how someone can think that Cast was a symp. The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them. It is better to assume that you lynched town then that you might have lynched a symp. Yesterday did leave us with a completed lynch train. There is also a starter train on Alkend and a attempted train on Barghast.

Path-Shaper, on 31 July 2013 - 11:12 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 7 hours and 56 minutes remaining

19 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Cast, D'riss, Desra, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Liosan, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

10 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Rashan ( Cast )
5 Votes for Alkend ( Okaros, Mockra, Gait, Trake, Liosan )
1 Vote for Desra ( Korbas )
10 Votes for Cast ( Barghast, Rashan, Alkend, Tellan, Desra, Anthras, Kalse, D'riss, Hanas, Galain)

Players not voted: Eloth, Jalan


That is a lynch.

Cast is dead. He was Yasuhide Narumasa and Peanutbutta of Arai Castle

scene forthcoming.

Path-Shaper, on 01 August 2013 - 03:19 AM, said:

Yoshiatsu still watched from the battlements long after the first skirmishes of the siege had ended. Ladders had been repelled with arrows and large rolling balls of burning pitch. The return arrow fire had cost him some defenders, but the fire arrows which had flown early on in the battle had been quickly extinguished. The attack had been a probing one, he knew. Serious numbers of forces had yet been committed by either side, the Fujiwari were simply testing the defenses and the backbones of those who defended. They should have known better, Yoshiatsu thought. The Miura were fighting for their last hope, there would be no easy victory here for those bastards from Odawara.
---------
General Ota surveyed the new disposition of the Fujiwari troops as they remade their camp in a forward position. As expected, Edo castle's outermost wall, which was really little more than a low fence ringed by a ditch, had not held long, and the retreat into the main portion of the keep had been orderly and well timed. If his troops had been less disciplined, the Fujiwari might have enjoyed slaughter, but the losses on the day were minimal. The loss of that outer defense was not much cause for concern either, as it would do little to help the Fujiwari unless it were to guard their retreat. "And let us hope it comes to that." Ota grimaced.

Night 2 is over.

Desra is dead. He was Kenji Tama and Blend of Arai castle.

Liosan is dead. He was Nobuhisa Genji and twelve of Edo castle.

From the CF's it looks to me like Cast was towny. I put his play down to panicky play because he came on and there was a major train on him. It happens.

Cast would still appear a towny from the CF, even if he was a symp though. Some players are saying they still don't like how the Alkend-Cast scene went down, and that Cast's play could have been that of a symp, while others may believe Cast and Alkend are town. But you are the only one that has come out to say that with the CF as it is, that Cast couldn't have been a symp, therefore Alkend is clear. I don't like this. I'd have been much more at ease had you said you believed Cast and Alkend were telling the truth, but to try to paint them as guaranteed innocent isn't the mafia way.

I can't understand how both Alkend and Cast could have played that so damned stupid if they were telling the truth. Gait's post sums up what I was already thinking a possible outcome could be.

Everyone, and myself included, needs to be more vocal. All of us, with a few brave exceptions, are acting too afraid to get too involved in the discussions or to talk game theory which might help us single out better targets that might be scum, because doing so sometimes draws the lynch their way. This happens sometimes, yes, but usually when only one or two people speak up while everyone else coasts, hoping to stay alive at the expense of not helping at all.

VOTE ALKEND

We have plenty of time, and I'll be looking into other and better cases, but for now this seems safe to me.

Really you can't understand how they could have been so stupid. Hehehehehehehe. That is rich.

Perhaps it is the fact that we just got done watching Khell lead multiple towns around by the nose with town making mistake after mistake that I can easily see two town players being that stupid. It is what town does. As for not thinking that Cast is a symp. Why would I do that. What possible good can come from thinking that Cast was anything other the town. WCS says that you can never assume that a symp has been lynched. There for I base my judgements off of the CF and Cast was town. If he was a symp nobody will know until the game is over. Assuming that Cast was a symp just leads to WIFOM with leads to scum running the game and getting town lynches with very little helpful information being put forth on the thread. For someone who is talking about how we have time and that people should step up you are sure quick to lay down a vote and continue a train. That is not very townish at all. Your entire posts smacks of someone who is attempting to make some kind of effort but not actually wanting to at all. Your post is contradictory which is not very townish behavior either.

Agree with everything but the underlined. in theory, townies should always be honest and straightforward. In practice, town players are notorious for using their toes to test their gag reflexes.

So you don't think that Mockra's post was not contradictory or do you think that being contradictory in a single post is not untownish behavior? Just for clarificiation.

[Tellan]

Kalse, on 01 August 2013 - 12:31 PM, said:

Okaros, on 01 August 2013 - 03:30 AM, said:

If I were to believe Alkend, I have a hard time trying to put together all of the things Alkend has said and done here into a cohesive MO.

Alkend, on 31 July 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

Sigh.
I'm Goro, of the Miura clan.
My ability allows certain members of the two town factions to communicate, under very specific circumstances.
Happy now?

So, under pressure on day 2 Alkend reveals a role that it seems cannot give us any useful information through his reveal other than to PI him. It's not as bad as a Healer revealing, but it's fairly close. Why reveal? Just to save your skin? But since you emphasize that it is only under "very specific circumstances" you are implying that it is a weak role. Generally, it is not useful to reveal due to pressure when your reveal and role can't provide any info to town like a Finder can. All it does is identify for scum a roled town. It's generally better not to give scum that information they don't have and keep them more in the dark about the town setup and who is left.

This game is supposed to be low TMDI, so all of those principles still apply.

But instead Alkend felt that revealing his weak role to save his skin is more beneficial for town than keeping quiet. I have two problems with believing this idea:

1. If the reveal helps us, why not reveal fully? Tell us what the "very specific circumstances" are. If you've already revealed as roled town, what's the harm in giving town more information (which ultimately is always what town lacks and needs to win) instead of being coy about it? The scum will try and remove you whether they know the details or whether they just know you are roled town. But you had all day and didn't do so. (And before you make some "I didn't want to get modkilled" defence, a simple read of the OP indicates that revealing your abilities is allowed as long as you change the wording, which should not be difficult, so that is no excuse)

2.

Alkend, on 31 July 2013 - 04:51 PM, said:

Anthras, on 31 July 2013 - 04:48 PM, said:

So there is no way Alkend can verify his claim?

Short of the person I communicate on behalf of coming on thread and saying "Yep, he's cool", there's nothing I can do.
If you are that person, don't be an idiot.

Alkend then discourages his supposed lover from publicly confirming his reveal. Why? He's already revealing to save his skin so clearly Alkend thinks he is important to town. Why be only a PI and not get yourself a VPI or CI? Especially since with no kill last night there's a high chance of a healer - if the healer is convinced you are CI they won't be doubting themselves from healing you every night. Furthermore, whomever is the lover and speaks up to confirm the reveal is not in any more danger because since Alkend has not revealed any mechanics of his ability the person he turns into a lover could just as easily be roled town, RI, or even scum. That person does not need to reveal anything about themselves, just say "I am Alkend's current lover as of last night and what he says is true" and nothing more, which doesn't reveal anything about themselves but does give town more information to work with.

So if Alkend actively believes his revealing is worth it to town, and if there's no harm in someone else confirming it to assuage our doubts, why is he discouraging that from happening?!


So yeah, I have a very hard time believing that Alkend's intentions here match what a player who wants town to win would be doing.



Oh, and also, I can't find any Goros who were affiliated with the Miura clan. But if you were hurriedly doing a google search for a plausible Miura name to fake reveal as, one of the top results might be Miura Goro, which sounds good as long as you don't read too much about him and realize that he is born in the wrong century to be a Sengoku samurai...

I am agreeable with Okaros here. I don't actually think to believe the reveal and Alkend being around is going to cloud the thread further on. I don't want to get into a situation where we are at D day with Alkend still alive

I feel like the situation won't take care of itself, so we need to do something about it. His presence will cloud the thread, and there'll always be someone who jumps to an Alkend vote in opposition to other cases. The two ways we cand deal with it is lynch him, or hope he gets NK'd. A clouded thread is good for scum, so I wouldn't count on the NK, so that just leaves lynching him. Its still early, so I don't want to drop my vote yet, but he's topping my list unless a good case is made on someone else where the evidence is really convincing

[Okaros]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them.

dddduuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[Hanas]

Okaros, on 01 August 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them.

dddduuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

I know right. Yet in every game people want to play on like some who came up with a town CF was a symp. It is mind boggling.

[Barghast]

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 02:03 PM, said:

Barghast, on 01 August 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 01:57 PM, said:

Mockra, on 01 August 2013 - 01:40 PM, said:

Hanas, on 01 August 2013 - 12:46 PM, said:

Well it looks like people are going all vote happy with the entire day left. I don't entirely understand how someone can think that Cast was a symp. The thing about symps is that they PI town so you never know if you lynched them. It is better to assume that you lynched town then that you might have lynched a symp. Yesterday did leave us with a completed lynch train. There is also a starter train on Alkend and a attempted train on Barghast.

Path-Shaper, on 31 July 2013 - 11:12 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 7 hours and 56 minutes remaining

19 Players still alive: Alkend, Anthras, Barghast, Cast, D'riss, Desra, Eloth, Gait, Galain, Hanas, Jalan, Kalse, Korbas, Liosan, Mockra, Okaros, Rashan, Tellan, Trake

10 votes to lynch, 10 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Rashan ( Cast )
5 Votes for Alkend ( Okaros, Mockra, Gait, Trake, Liosan )
1 Vote for Desra ( Korbas )
10 Votes for Cast ( Barghast, Rashan, Alkend, Tellan, Desra, Anthras, Kalse, D'riss, Hanas, Galain)

Players not voted: Eloth, Jalan


That is a lynch.

Cast is dead. He was Yasuhide Narumasa and Peanutbutta of Arai Castle

scene forthcoming.

Path-Shaper, on 01 August 2013 - 03:19 AM, said:

Yoshiatsu still watched from the battlements long after the first skirmishes of the siege had ended. Ladders had been repelled with arrows and large rolling balls of burning pitch. The return arrow fire had cost him some defenders, but the fire arrows which had flown early on in the battle had been quickly extinguished. The attack had been a probing one, he knew. Serious numbers of forces had yet been committed by either side, the Fujiwari were simply testing the defenses and the backbones of those who defended. They should have known better, Yoshiatsu thought. The Miura were fighting for their last hope, there would be no easy victory here for those bastards from Odawara.
---------
General Ota surveyed the new disposition of the Fujiwari troops as they remade their camp in a forward position. As expected, Edo castle's outermost wall, which was really little more than a low fence ringed by a ditch, had not held long, and the retreat into the main portion of the keep had been orderly and well timed. If his troops had been less disciplined, the Fujiwari might have enjoyed slaughter, but the losses on the day were minimal. The loss of that outer defense was not much cause for concern either, as it would do little to help the Fujiwari unless it were to guard their retreat. "And let us hope it comes to that." Ota grimaced.

Night 2 is over.

Desra is dead. He was Kenji Tama and Blend of Arai castle.

Liosan is dead. He was Nobuhisa Genji and twelve of Edo castle.

From the CF's it looks to me like Cast was towny. I put his play down to panicky play because he came on and there was a major train on him. It happens.

Cast would still appear a towny from the CF, even if he was a symp though. Some players are saying they still don't like how the Alkend-Cast scene went down, and that Cast's play could have been that of a symp, while others may believe Cast and Alkend are town. But you are the only one that has come out to say that with the CF as it is, that Cast couldn't have been a symp, therefore Alkend is clear. I don't like this. I'd have been much more at ease had you said you believed Cast and Alkend were telling the truth, but to try to paint them as guaranteed innocent isn't the mafia way.

I can't understand how both Alkend and Cast could have played that so damned stupid if they were telling the truth. Gait's post sums up what I was already thinking a possible outcome could be.

Everyone, and myself included, needs to be more vocal. All of us, with a few brave exceptions, are acting too afraid to get too involved in the discussions or to talk game theory which might help us single out better targets that might be scum, because doing so sometimes draws the lynch their way. This happens sometimes, yes, but usually when only one or two people speak up while everyone else coasts, hoping to stay alive at the expense of not helping at all.

VOTE ALKEND

We have plenty of time, and I'll be looking into other and better cases, but for now this seems safe to me.

Really you can't understand how they could have been so stupid. Hehehehehehehe. That is rich.

Perhaps it is the fact that we just got done watching Khell lead multiple towns around by the nose with town making mistake after mistake that I can easily see two town players being that stupid. It is what town does. As for not thinking that Cast is a symp. Why would I do that. What possible good can come from thinking that Cast was anything other the town. WCS says that you can never assume that a symp has been lynched. There for I base my judgements off of the CF and Cast was town. If he was a symp nobody will know until the game is over. Assuming that Cast was a symp just leads to WIFOM with leads to scum running the game and getting town lynches with very little helpful information being put forth on the thread. For someone who is talking about how we have time and that people should step up you are sure quick to lay down a vote and continue a train. That is not very townish at all. Your entire posts smacks of someone who is attempting to make some kind of effort but not actually wanting to at all. Your post is contradictory which is not very townish behavior either.

Agree with everything but the underlined. in theory, townies should always be honest and straightforward. In practice, town players are notorious for using their toes to test their gag reflexes.

So you don't think that Mockra's post was not contradictory or do you think that being contradictory in a single post is not untownish behavior? Just for clarificiation.

I think that it's not enough to say he's not playing like town, b/c town players do nothing but fuck up as a general rule.