[Defiance]

I agree with you about sentient animals. It's normally a big turn-off for me as well, yet Erikson handles them masterfully. Animals a certainly very important in the series, which is why the Hound's viewpoint is a good foundation.

For now, about all you know about Ascendants is that they're powerful beings. You'll learn more as you go. It's kind of like with the Deck of Dragons and the Warrens - you can get a loose grasp of them at the start, but the more you read about them the more you're able to piece things together.

As for Anomander Rake, well, keep reading

[Kanese S's]

The ascendancy thing will become clearer over time. For know, just know that they're generally a fair bit more powerful than your average Joe.

I want to say something about sapient animals... but it would probably be seen as slightly spoiler-y... so I won't. Then when you've read a few books down the line, you'll remember this post, and go "Aha!"

[Devaney]

Abyss, on 24 May 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

Devaney I can't even grasp how you are functioning at anything else at this moment.

Ha, yeah that was not fun. Thankfully I (finally) had time to finish it without my significant other dragging me over to play games with him. Brave man keeping me away from the books I enjoy especially when he knows better than doing that when I'm towards the end of a Malazan book.

Zadakeem, on 25 May 2013 - 04:50 PM, said:

Right now, Im really just enjoying the story. As far as rooting for people, I really have not picked a side, I do not know enough yet. All I know is WhiskeyJack is a good guy. I like him. and Tattersail. She is good too. I think...

Those were the two I liked most in GotM also. There are three others I can think of as well, which I'm avoiding naming as I can't recall when they came into the story, but the rest I either didn't like or was fairly indifferent towards in this book.

Also, lucky you with a job including reading benefits. Of course I'd probably never get work done if I had that luck.

[The Hust Legion]

I don't know why some people class GoTM as one of the worst in the series but I think it is quite good
Some of the scenes are the coolest in the entire series
But the start of GoTM is unforgettable .pale as chaotic
However the darujhistan politics took away some of the edge out of the cool bits. To be honest I was bored by them
But the bridge burners are perfectly introduced in this book I think ( as the most badass group of Malazan soldiers in the empire)

[Tehol the Only]

The Hust Legion, on 26 May 2013 - 10:54 PM, said:

I don't know why some people class GoTM as one of the worst in the series but I think it is quite good.

Worse in this series means it's still freakin' good
I think most people who finished the series consider it just as good as the others. (or at least in the same league)

[The Hust Legion]

Tehol the Only, on 27 May 2013 - 09:40 AM, said:

The Hust Legion, on 26 May 2013 - 10:54 PM, said:

I don't know why some people class GoTM as one of the worst in the series but I think it is quite good.

Worse in this series means it's still freakin' good
I think most people who finished the series consider it just as good as the others. (or at least in the same league)

yh memories of ice and the crippled god were the best for me

[Zadakeem]

The Hust Legion, on 26 May 2013 - 10:54 PM, said:

I don't know why some people class GoTM as one of the worst in the series but I think it is quite good

Brandon Sanderson, at a sighning, was asked of the Malazan series was any good. He replied that he recommended it, that it was very good. Although, he said, that one should start with the second book. And then go read the first.

But I love this books so far, especially the building schemes and politics. I like politics in stories. Fantasy religions and politics are very fun, hence why I like Brandon Sanderson so much.

I wanted to ask, Steven Erikson is proving himself masterful. But how is Esslemont?

[Zadakeem]

Chapters 7 & 8

ch. 7- Kruppe`s dreams are interesting. They are a little easier to interpret than the cards. But they are still clouded in awesome mystery.

Questions-- Kruppe speaks to the ELDER God K`rul. Elder God of what? Are there two levels of gods Elder and Child? "Every God falls at a mortals hands. Such is the only end to immortality" interesting statement, shall I remember it?

There was a lot of political manuevering in this chapter, which really put a smile on my face. I know a lot of people dont like politics in novels. I wonder why?

It seems Oponn has saved another life. For what purpose we know not. I used to think that hearing the spinning coin meant death. Or that something was not well,but this makes me think that it tells of Oponns involvment. This part also suggests, that the male and females halves of Oponn work separatly.

ch.8- This chapter was short. And kinda bugged me. A lot of interesting things happened. Such as Quick Ben and Hairlock having a very very interesting conversation.

The things that bugged me though, is that both Whiskeyjack, and Quick Ben, come and talk about plans, or changes in the plans...and it is not written what those are even though we are in their perspectives! I assume we will find things later. But in my opinion, if we are in a certain perspective, should we not know what that person is doing at that time?

[Devaney]

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

I wanted to ask, Steven Erikson is proving himself masterful. But how is Esslemont?

Esselmont is a fairly good author imo. Since I'm only on tCG I haven't read his latest 2, but from what I've read I like his work. I read NoK with only the expectation that it would give me more information about the Malazan universe, and it did. I can't say it gripped me all that much emotionally, but it was interesting to see what had happened. RotCG I figured would do the same at the very least, and I was pleased to find better character development and more engaging stories in it. Of course there was more for him to work with rather than the more limited scope of his first as well as the fact that it wasn't his first book. SW though, I loved from the start. It seems he's found his voice.

He's not SE, but I think it would unfair to expect him to be. If you read him as a separate author and don't hold him to SE's standards, you'll probably enjoy his stories. Or, at the very least, you might just like to see what else happens in the world they've created.

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

Chapters 7 & 8

ch. 7- Kruppe`s dreams are interesting. They are a little easier to interpret than the cards. But they are still clouded in awesome mystery.

Questions-- Kruppe speaks to the ELDER God K`rul. Elder God of what? Are there two levels of gods Elder and Child? "Every God falls at a mortals hands. Such is the only end to immortality" interesting statement, shall I remember it?

There was a lot of political manuevering in this chapter, which really put a smile on my face. I know a lot of people dont like politics in novels. I wonder why?

It seems Oponn has saved another life. For what purpose we know not. I used to think that hearing the spinning coin meant death. Or that something was not well,but this makes me think that it tells of Oponns involvment. This part also suggests, that the male and females halves of Oponn work separatly.

ch.8- This chapter was short. And kinda bugged me. A lot of interesting things happened. Such as Quick Ben and Hairlock having a very very interesting conversation.

The things that bugged me though, is that both Whiskeyjack, and Quick Ben, come and talk about plans, or changes in the plans...and it is not written what those are even though we are in their perspectives! I assume we will find things later. But in my opinion, if we are in a certain perspective, should we not know what that person is doing at that time?

As far as Elder gods and what they are, that's certainly gone into more throughout the series. I'd say RAFO.

As for not knowing the plans the characters have going and managing with tidbits and morsels of the greater picture, that's part of SE's style I love so much. You'll find out... but in the meantime you're in the dark with mere hints to show you what might be coming. And there are a lot of hints. This is why you'll see so many sing the joys of re-reads for this series; all those hints you may have pondered, or indeed may have completely missed, the first time through are so much more obvious since you'll know from already completing it what they mean. On a first read though, it lets you enjoy the characters in the moment and try to figure out the big picture on your own until you finally see what the plan was.

This post has been edited by Devaney: 27 May 2013 - 03:41 PM

[Tehol the Only]

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

Brandon Sanderson, at a sighning, was asked of the Malazan series was any good. He replied that he recommended it, that it was very good. Although, he said, that one should start with the second book. And then go read the first.

Really? The only time i heard him talk about Malazan he said he never had the time to start reading it. (On his blog somewhere)
Can't say i really agree with the "just start with the second" philosophy.... publication order for the win.

As for Esslemont... You'll find very different feelings here. Personally i like his plots, his settings and some of his characters but i can't say i really appreciate his writing. Anyway his books aim is very different from Erikson's. They're like action blockbusters set in the malazan world... not much depth but plenty of fireworks.

Quote

shall i remember it?

In point of fact, almost every line in the book is significant at some point so ideally you want to remember it all Or failing that, you'll have to guess what's more important... hehe the guessing game is what hooked me at first.

Quote

But in my opinion, if we are in a certain perspective, should we not know what that person is doing at that time?

You're not exactly in their perspective... you're more like an invisible observer inside their head: you know what they're thinking and what is happening but you don't possess all their knowledge.


Big RAFO on K'rul and Oponn.

[Abyss]

Tehol the Only, on 27 May 2013 - 09:40 AM, said:

The Hust Legion, on 26 May 2013 - 10:54 PM, said:

I don't know why some people class GoTM as one of the worst in the series but I think it is quite good.

Worse in this series means it's still freakin' good
I think most people who finished the series consider it just as good as the others. (or at least in the same league)

GotM's 'start in the middle' thing blows many many readers' minds, and then compounds it by not explaining everything in a nice calm orderly 'wise wizard breaks it all down for the ignorant farmboy' kind of way.

Devaney, on 27 May 2013 - 03:35 PM, said:

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

I wanted to ask, Steven Erikson is proving himself masterful. But how is Esslemont?

Esselmont is a fairly good author imo. ...He's not SE, but I think it would unfair to expect him to be. If you read him as a separate author and don't hold him to SE's standards, you'll probably enjoy his stories. Or, at the very least, you might just like to see what else happens in the world they've created.

I would agree with this and go a bit further... i really enjoy ICE's books. They're a great complement and supplement to what SE has wrought in the ten MBF books, but on their own are also really enjoyable fantasy and better than a lot of what's out there.

Devaney, on 27 May 2013 - 03:35 PM, said:

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:12 PM, said:

Chapters 7 & 8

ch. 7- Kruppe`s dreams are interesting. They are a little easier to interpret than the cards. But they are still clouded in awesome mystery.

Questions-- Kruppe speaks to the ELDER God K`rul. Elder God of what? Are there two levels of gods Elder and Child? "Every God falls at a mortals hands. Such is the only end to immortality" interesting statement, shall I remember it?

There was a lot of political manuevering in this chapter, which really put a smile on my face. I know a lot of people dont like politics in novels. I wonder why?

It seems Oponn has saved another life. For what purpose we know not. I used to think that hearing the spinning coin meant death. Or that something was not well,but this makes me think that it tells of Oponns involvment. This part also suggests, that the male and females halves of Oponn work separatly.

ch.8- This chapter was short. And kinda bugged me. A lot of interesting things happened. Such as Quick Ben and Hairlock having a very very interesting conversation.

The things that bugged me though, is that both Whiskeyjack, and Quick Ben, come and talk about plans, or changes in the plans...and it is not written what those are even though we are in their perspectives! I assume we will find things later. But in my opinion, if we are in a certain perspective, should we not know what that person is doing at that time?

As far as Elder gods and what they are, that's certainly gone into more throughout the series. I'd say RAFO.

As for not knowing the plans the characters have going and managing with tidbits and morsels of the greater picture, that's part of SE's style I love so much. You'll find out... but in the meantime you're in the dark with mere hints to show you what might be coming. And there are a lot of hints. This is why you'll see so many sing the joys of re-reads for this series; all those hints you may have pondered, or indeed may have completely missed, the first time through are so much more obvious since you'll know from already completing it what they mean. It lets you enjoy the characters in the moment and try to figure out the big picture on your own until you finally see what the plan was.

I agree with Devaney here again.
The different flavors and types of Gods and Ascendents, and how they interact with mortals and each other, are a big part of the setting and figuring it all out over the series is one of the best parts. We know, WE KNOW you want to know NOW, but that's part of why the payoff in enjoyment is so great.

[Defiance]

That quote about gods and mortals is always a good one to remember.

I love the political maneuvering as well. It gives Darujhistan a life of its own.

As you saw, Oponn works in two different ways. The luck that pushes, and the luck that pulls. The Lord pushes, the Lady pulls. To remember which is which, I think of it as the Lord pushes you into danger, whereas the Lady pulls you away from it. Thus, when the coin is spinning, it could land on Lord or Lady.

About chapter 8:

One thing that's important to note is that just because a character knows something, they won't lay it out in their perspective. For example, if you have planned out your entire day (get up, get dressed, shower, brush teeth, go to work, come home and watch TV, sleep), you're not going to think of it like that in your head. Instead, you just think of it as your plans for the day.

However, we do know what the former plans were. The former plan was to plant bombs at all of Darujhistan's gates. This would have been suicide due to the fact that a city is going to take quick note of anyone doing serious work around the gates, regardless of whether or not you're in disguise.

Here's the quote: "We ain't going to mine the city gates?" Fiddler asked, glancing at Hedge.

We don't yet know what the new plan is, as it shifts away from the Bridgeburners just as Whiskeyjack starts laying things out. This is so that we can be shown, not told, what the Bridgeburners are going to do. All that you can do right now is guess (we know they have their Moranth munitions, and we know that they're going to be entering Darujhistan through the docks by acting like fishermen).

[Zadakeem]

Tehol the Only, on 27 May 2013 - 03:42 PM, said:

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

Brandon Sanderson, at a sighning, was asked of the Malazan series was any good. He replied that he recommended it, that it was very good. Although, he said, that one should start with the second book. And then go read the first.

Really? The only time i heard him talk about Malazan he said he never had the time to start reading it. (On his blog somewhere)
Can't say i really agree with the "just start with the second" philosophy.... publication order for the win.

This is not recorded. It was at a sighning in Provo, UT a friend of mine went to. He may have just given the opinion that one of his friends gave him. Besides, he has to support Tor publications. It is the company that gives him the most money after all haha.

But straight of fact, the quote from Brandon is hearsay...tell you what. I will ask him directly when I see him later this month.

[Zadakeem]

Defiance, on 27 May 2013 - 03:52 PM, said:

Here's the quote: "We ain't going to mine the city gates?" Fiddler asked, glancing at Hedge.

Are you reading along with me? To pull out an exact quote like that you HAVE to be breaking out the book. Or you have a photographic memory...

[Tehol the Only]

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

I will ask him directly when I see him later this month.

Tell him i need my copy of Words of Radiance.

Right.

Now.

[Defiance]

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Defiance, on 27 May 2013 - 03:52 PM, said:

Here's the quote: "We ain't going to mine the city gates?" Fiddler asked, glancing at Hedge.

Are you reading along with me? To pull out an exact quote like that you HAVE to be breaking out the book. Or you have a photographic memory...

Not reading along with you, I just know the book pretty well from reading it so much that finding quotes isn't difficult, especially when you're giving me the context of the chapter.

[Zadakeem]

Overall,

I agree with the opinion that you all present. Steven Eriksons style of both giving you too much and too little information is part of the intrigue of the book. It honestly pulling me through, giving me desire to read more.

I will give this, Erikson has his own style, and that is awesome. You can definetly tell he his not trying to copy another authors way of writing, like so many others do.

I am excited to get to Esslemonts stories. From what I can glean from all the comments, they seem to be smaller. Action/Thriller stories. Instead of gigantic nation versus nation stories. And thats ok, I would like to see a more localized story in this world. It would make that story richer, knowing that something bigger is also happening.

Also, as I try to read it try to read it in such a way, that I can ask questions and make comments that any reader would. I try to make it so that anybody who is reading the book for the first time, and has questions, will see those asked. If that makes sense? haha.

[Zadakeem]

Tehol the Only, on 27 May 2013 - 04:04 PM, said:

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 04:00 PM, said:

I will ask him directly when I see him later this month.

Tell him i need my copy of Words of Radiance.

Right.

Now.

O trust me, I plan on demanding it. He is getting close though. He is starting on Legion 2 and Alloy of Law 2 now...so that just shows he is reaching the end point of Words of Radiance if he is now turning to other projects. I cant wait...

This post has been edited by Zadakeem: 27 May 2013 - 04:17 PM

[Abyss]

Zadakeem, on 27 May 2013 - 04:14 PM, said:

...I am excited to get to Esslemonts stories. From what I can glean from all the comments, they seem to be smaller. Action/Thriller stories. Instead of gigantic nation versus nation stories. And thats ok, I would like to see a more localized story in this world. It would make that story richer, knowing that something bigger is also happening.

He does both. You'll see when you get to them.

Quote

Also, as I try to read it try to read it in such a way, that I can ask questions and make comments that any reader would. I try to make it so that anybody who is reading the book for the first time, and has questions, will see those asked. If that makes sense? haha.

Just my $0.02cdn, I think the way to go is just focus on your own reading experience and use the threads you start to enhance it.
Your enjoyment (you seem to be enjoying ) will carry over to anyone reading the posts and they'll jump in or start their own as they prefer.

[Zadakeem]

Blood and Bone
Orb, Sceptre, Throne
Stoneweilder.

Those are all malazan books right? Is there any others by Esslemont I should know of that are involved in the Chronology?