[ForkassalOfTheInnerCircle]

So, as the topic quite blatantly insinuates, I'm wondering what happened to the poisoning of the warrens. In MoI, it seemed like it was so that mages could barely draw upon most of the warrens, making magic inept. Quick Ben got in league with some hood-aspected puppet, enabling him to traverse the warrens in spite of the poison, but the rest were more or less locked out. Now I'm reading Reaper's Gale, and came to think of the fact that all of the mages seem to be traversing most warrens pretty unrestricted, the same being true for the previous book. However, the poisoning of the warrens has been mentioned in Reaper's Gale, so I'm assuming they have not been cleansed. I do not want to google this as I've been running into spoilers left and right as of late, googling stuff I've forgotten. So, whatever happened to the not-being-able-to-use-warrens-thingy?

Bonus question: What was the name of that puppet that Quick Ben jostled about with? Was it Hairlock? He died in Deadhouse Gates, if I do not misremember, but since the puppet was definitely Hood-aspected, I guess it could be him anyway.

This post has been edited by Forkassal: 30 January 2013 - 12:33 PM

[umbraticus]

Forkassal, on 30 January 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

So, as the topic quite blatantly insinuates, I'm wondering what happened to the poisoning of the warrens. In MoI, it seemed like it was so that mages could barely draw upon most of the warrens, making magic inept. Quick Ben got in leage with some hood-aspected puppet, enabling him to traverse the warrens in spite of the poison, but the rest were more or less locked out. Now I'm reading Reaper's Gale, and came to think of the fact that all of the mages seem to be traversing most warrens pretty unrestricted, the same being true for the previous book. However, the poisoning of the warrens has been mentioned in Reaper's Gale, so I'm assuming they have not been cleansed. I do not want to google this as I've been running into spoilers left and right as of late, googling stuff I've forgotten. So, whatever happened to the not-being-able-to-use-warrens-thingy?

Bonus question: What was the name of that puppet that Quick Ben jostled about with? Was it Hairlock? He died in Deadhouse Gates, if I do not misremember, but since the puppet was definitely Hood-aspected, I guess it could be him anyway.

i was wondering about the exact same thing yesterday .
the only reason i could come up with, is that the crippled god lost some power or something after he got some major ass woopin' from Mael, haha. and so he can't poison the warrens anymore. but i think that actually happened before the poisoning, so then it doesn't make sense anymore.
another reason could be that it doesn't serve the crippled god anymore to poison the warrens, because he wants to use the letherii empire for his schemes and they need warrens to properly work as his little puppets.

[Use Of Weapons]

I figured that the action of Omtose Phellack slowed the poisoning to such an extent that the Crippled God's aim with it was defeated, and so he turned his attention to his other plans, and let the poisoning fade away.

[ForkassalOfTheInnerCircle]

umbraticus, on 30 January 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

Forkassal, on 30 January 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

So, as the topic quite blatantly insinuates, I'm wondering what happened to the poisoning of the warrens. In MoI, it seemed like it was so that mages could barely draw upon most of the warrens, making magic inept. Quick Ben got in leage with some hood-aspected puppet, enabling him to traverse the warrens in spite of the poison, but the rest were more or less locked out. Now I'm reading Reaper's Gale, and came to think of the fact that all of the mages seem to be traversing most warrens pretty unrestricted, the same being true for the previous book. However, the poisoning of the warrens has been mentioned in Reaper's Gale, so I'm assuming they have not been cleansed. I do not want to google this as I've been running into spoilers left and right as of late, googling stuff I've forgotten. So, whatever happened to the not-being-able-to-use-warrens-thingy?

Bonus question: What was the name of that puppet that Quick Ben jostled about with? Was it Hairlock? He died in Deadhouse Gates, if I do not misremember, but since the puppet was definitely Hood-aspected, I guess it could be him anyway.

i was wondering about the exact same thing yesterday .
the only reason i could come up with, is that the crippled god lost some power or something after he got some major ass woopin' from Mael, haha. and so he can't poison the warrens anymore. but i think that actually happened before the poisoning, so then it doesn't make sense anymore.
another reason could be that it doesn't serve the crippled god anymore to poison the warrens, because he wants to use the letherii empire for his schemes and they need warrens to properly work as his little puppets.

Yeah, I also thought the delivering of ass-kicking from Mael was before or at least simultaneous with the posioning of the warrens (to be honest, the chronological order of things leaves me quite confused at times).

Use Of Weapons, on 30 January 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

I figured that the action of Omtose Phellack slowed the poisoning to such an extent that the Crippled God's aim with it was defeated, and so he turned his attention to his other plans, and let the poisoning fade away.

I actually never thought of the poisoning as a willful act, I just figured that as the Crippled God's presence grew stronger, so did the poison running through the warrens. Maybe you are correct.

[Puck]

Wilful or nor, but the reason Paran and QB brought Pannion into the cave with Burn's guardians was for Pannion to use the ice of Omtose Phellack to slow down the infection that the Crippled God was causing Burn.

Iirc, the infaction was not per se a wilful act of his, but caused by his presence due to being a god foreign to Wu. There probably were factors that accelerated its progress, like the CG's will, but iirc the infaction was spreading from Genabackis and therefore less strong the further away one got. The ice, then, slowed it down and negated its effects enought for magic to become usable again, though it did not stop it entirely.

As to your bonus question: the puppet was named Talamandas and had absolutely nothing to do with Hairlock (who died in GotM, btw). Talamandas used to be a Barghast shaman who got caught in some kind of ritual upon his death and was freed by QB in MoI. Due to being both dead and a former Barghast shaman he had connections to Hood and as well as the newly awakened Barghast gods.

This post has been edited by Puck: 30 January 2013 - 01:28 PM

[ForkassalOfTheInnerCircle]

Puck, on 30 January 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

Wilful or nor, but the reason Paran and QB brought Pannion into the cave with Burn's guardians was for Pannion to use the ice of Omtose Phellack to slow down the infection that the Crippled God was causing Burn.

Iirc, the infaction was not per se a wilful act of his, but caused by his presence due to being a god foreign to Wu. There probably were factors that accelerated its progress, like the CG's will, but iirc the infaction was spreading from Genabackis and therefore less strong the further away one got. The ice, then, slowed it down and negated its effects enought for magic to become usable again, though it did not stop it entirely.

As to your bonus question: the puppet was named Talamandas and had absolutely nothing to do with Hairlock (who died in GotM, btw). Talamandas used to be a Barghast shaman who got caught in some kind of ritual upon his death and was freed by QB in MoI. Due to being both dead and a former Barghast shaman he had connections to Hood and as well as the newly awakened Barghast gods.

This pretty much cleared it up for me. One can also assume, that the Omtose Phellack ritual not only slowed down but also pushed back the infection, right?

Ah yes, Talamandas, now I remember. He was bound by his kin to the roots of a tree or the like, so as not to haunt them after his death. I seem to remember this was standardized procedure with dead shamans of the Barghast. It's been a year and a half since I read the first book, and after the third book I took quite a long break from the series, so my memory of these events are kind of hazy.

[Spoilsport Stonny]

Wasn't it Pannions sister's presence and her OP magic that was what healed burn? QB, Paran and Pannion exchanged the Matron finnest for the girl at the Morn rent and then took her to Burn's cave. If you were to look up 'professional football's all time bonehead plays', you might read about a Miami Dolphin kicker named Ray Finkle, who missed a twenty-six yard field goal in the closing seconds of Super Bowl Seventeen. What you wouldn't read about is how Ray Finkle lost his mind, and was committed to a mental institute, only to escape and join the police force under the assumed identity of a missing hker, seducing her way to the top, in a diabolical plan to get even with Dan Marino whom he blamed for the entire thing!!!

[Sinisdar Toste]

everyone seems to be forgetting something here.

MoI and DG happen roughly parallel in timeline, and throughout DG, unless they run into the shapeshifters on the path of hands, plenty of people are using the warrens without trouble. i point this out because it illustrates that the poisoning of the warrens and the poisoning of burn are two separate but related things.

the poisoning of burn is killing her, and when she dies, all life winks out, since burn's dream is the world in some weird metaphorical way. QB bringing pannion into burns warren to unleash OP stops this infection nicely, and lets pannion and his sister live in peace.

the poisoning of the warrens is geographic, restricted to genebackis, specifically the pannion domin and it's immediate surroundings. the power of chaos pannion had been channeling and bestowing on his followers caused the warrens to be poisoned and practically useless to anyone but them. this is ultimately another attack by the crippled god, yet it is different from the way that the crippled god is killing burn, simply by being present on her flesh. related, but distinct issues. once the domin is defeated, the warrens go back to normal.

don't believe me? kamist reloe repeatedly uses his warren throughout DG, pearl mockra's an entire ship's crew on the journey to quon tali. gesler and stormy's group enter several different warrens while onboard the silanda. no sign of any poison there.

This post has been edited by Sinisdar Toste: 31 January 2013 - 02:07 AM

[ForkassalOfTheInnerCircle]

Sinisdar Toste, on 31 January 2013 - 02:04 AM, said:

everyone seems to be forgetting something here.

MoI and DG happen roughly parallel in timeline, and throughout DG, unless they run into the shapeshifters on the path of hands, plenty of people are using the warrens without trouble. i point this out because it illustrates that the poisoning of the warrens and the poisoning of burn are two separate but related things.

the poisoning of burn is killing her, and when she dies, all life winks out, since burn's dream is the world in some weird metaphorical way. QB bringing pannion into burns warren to unleash OP stops this infection nicely, and lets pannion and his sister live in peace.

the poisoning of the warrens is geographic, restricted to genebackis, specifically the pannion domin and it's immediate surroundings. the power of chaos pannion had been channeling and bestowing on his followers caused the warrens to be poisoned and practically useless to anyone but them. this is ultimately another attack by the crippled god, yet it is different from the way that the crippled god is killing burn, simply by being present on her flesh. related, but distinct issues. once the domin is defeated, the warrens go back to normal.

don't believe me? kamist reloe repeatedly uses his warren throughout DG, pearl mockra's an entire ship's crew on the journey to quon tali. gesler and stormy's group enter several different warrens while onboard the silanda. no sign of any poison there.

I'm not all too tight on the warrens, but since it's geographical, would that mean that a specific place in Wu represents a specific place in any warren (except for Shadow, which appears to be constantly moving)? This is the only way I can make sense of the geographical perspective of the poisoning.

[Sinisdar Toste]

the warrens are somewhat analogous across geographic location - this is also addressed in DG where kalam thinks to himself that he had always thought that the imperial warren only encompassed the area around unta and the central malazan empire. this geographic overlap also comes up in lostara and pearls hunt for felisin paran, since she travelled southward from otataral island via warren, and was dropped out of the warren with baudin, kulp and heboric at some point between the island and the sea east of vathar crossing, where stormy, gesler and truth eventually end up. that point where they fall out (though it's slightly out of the way from a direct line - the overlap isn't one to one) ends up being raraku.

[Luperci]

Puck, on 30 January 2013 - 01:26 PM, said:

Wilful or nor, but the reason Paran and QB brought Pannion into the cave with Burn's guardians was for Pannion to use the ice of Omtose Phellack to slow down the infection that the Crippled God was causing Burn.

Iirc, the infaction was not per se a wilful act of his, but caused by his presence due to being a god foreign to Wu. There probably were factors that accelerated its progress, like the CG's will, but iirc the infaction was spreading from Genabackis and therefore less strong the further away one got. The ice, then, slowed it down and negated its effects enought for magic to become usable again, though it did not stop it entirely.

As to your bonus question: the puppet was named Talamandas and had absolutely nothing to do with Hairlock (who died in GotM, btw). Talamandas used to be a Barghast shaman who got caught in some kind of ritual upon his death and was freed by QB in MoI. Due to being both dead and a former Barghast shaman he had connections to Hood and as well as the newly awakened Barghast gods.

Its been awhile since I read MoI but whatever happened to Talamandas after Quick finished his mission with him, did he join the other spirits wherever they went or maybe Quick added on another soul? I forget whatever deal Quick and Hood have since its been said that the presence of Death was strong on Quick (someone points this out, maybe Bottle? and Fid flips out on Quick always saying they never could trust him or really know what he is up to).

[Spoilsport Stonny]

I think he went with the Barghast and joined them on their journey that the young barghast gods advised them to take.

I remember the gods not being a big fan of Talamandas cuz he wasnt jiving with what they were puttin down.

This post has been edited by Spoilsport Stonny: 04 December 2013 - 11:29 PM

[worry]

Oh yah, I think you're right.