[Shinrei]

 Tattersail, on 10 December 2012 - 01:56 PM, said:

Everything so far points to Bubba being Blends partner. Let's get this game over and done with...

Vote Bubba

Im not in any haste. A new game wont start until next week anyways. Its almost my bedtime, and Id like tohear from the others.

[Shinrei]

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

 HiddenOne, on 10 December 2012 - 12:43 PM, said:

I'm back, it's Monday, blech

so you guys worked through the weekend break, huh? a lynch, a NK, and a vig? lucky hit for the vig, not so lucky on losing 2 town

back in a bit

A lucky hit for the vig?


Shin will be so happy to read that from you.

Well, town vigs are usually crap. Given my case and votw yesterday i had blend dead to rights though. The vote trains only made the odds even better.

[Khellendros]

 Khellendros, on 07 December 2012 - 04:17 PM, said:

Remove Vote

Vote Tattersail



Having done that, I'm immediately questioning myself from removing from Bubba. The guy has done nothing all game - he continually claims to be observing but hasn't given one solid opinion - now that is far more classic scum than anything Tattersail has done.

Hmm, I wonder if I should have listened to myself....

 Starling, on 08 December 2012 - 03:29 AM, said:

Right, caught up and I have lots of notes, so in the interest of continuing the trend I'll put out thoughts for each player.



Blend has been connected by GH to Azath and Khell, and by Shin to Tatts. He emphasises how scummy he found Venge; "Venge pulls the scummy shit he did", "Venge was certainly acting a bunch more scummy", although he can only find one quote to back up his claims, and the majority of the lynch was based around Venge playing "too nice". It feels like scum trying to justify his vote. He accuses me of symping Tatts, for my case on him earlier, which would be a seriously stupid move for me, if I was a symp. He spends a lot of time attempting to devalue Tatts' case against him, and trying to direct attention elsewhere.

I've snipped everything but Starling's thoughts on Blend. I know it might be distancing, but this isn't the only time Starling talks this way about Blend, which makes me feel more confident that they are not connected. See below.

 Starling, on 08 December 2012 - 03:34 AM, said:

So, to conclude:

I feel that Tatts and Azath are connected. Tatts downplaying the possibility that Azath has fake-revealed is most telling to me. Azath's behaviour since the reveal has been entirely too convenient, and I am suspicious that he is still alive.

In addition, I'm getting a scummy feeling from Blend, although I'm not seeing a connection with either Tatts or Azath. I'd be prepared to vote for any one of these three.

And now, I have to get ready for work. Hopefully I'll be able to post from work, depends how busy we are and how much of the thread I can access. Since it's a weekend break now I'm not expecting a lot of participation, but it would be nice to use this time to discuss what we are going to do.

These posts from Bubba struck me. The first attempt to identify something Tattersail as scummy you could pass off as a genuine misinterpretation of what Tats said, but the second (about it having been said that Azath was finding townies rather than scum) is very nonsensical and quite a stretch from what was actually being said. In light of what we now know, Bubba strikes me as trying a little too hard to form a connection between Azath and Tats.

 Bubba, on 09 December 2012 - 10:03 PM, said:

 Tattersail, on 09 December 2012 - 09:51 PM, said:

 Bubba, on 09 December 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

 Tattersail, on 09 December 2012 - 11:41 AM, said:

Starling I have a problem voting Azath today. I will not tomorrow it depends on who he finds tonight and the outcome.

How dodgy does it look that both Blend and Bubba are voting Azath when multiple people find them at least a little bit scummy.

Fair enough you think I'm scummy and you've.thought that since day one, that's fine. All I can do is make my thoughts known.

I think Blend is a symp or killer and Bubba is symp or killer leaving another symp or killer out there. From your comments above you suggest that you could be a killer but I will go on thinking that it would.be bad etiquette for a killer to play that way, by showing disinterest you get overlooked and that is why HO was frowned upon a few games back.

Shin or Khell is my bet for the other killer.

I'm happy to vote either of the ones I mentioned. Not so much on azath yet. Not starling gnaw or HO.

It does not make sense to do otherwise. Assuming two killers AND Azath IS one then well know more about him tomorrow. There is still another one out there.

I think Gust Hubbs death points fingers towards Azath and I think they (the killers) are setting us up.

This is your scummiest comment to date. How the fuck could the killers know who Azath was doing a find on?

Tatts, that comment pins you as the symp in my mind. You will do anything to protect your master.

You want mw to expand on that comment but ignore the rest of my post?

Gust made a case against azath and round up dead, this points us towards Azath. How do you not comprehend that?

How do you comprehend A finder looking for townies? I don't think that has ever happened in any game I have ever played/modded/or read. It is the worst excuse I have ever heard...well maybe not the worst, but it's up there. There were a lot of people on that train(and if you notice not ME. I didn't think he was scum at that point), I can see the killers picking GH for being on that train, but I can not see Azath picking GH for a find, on the basis of being town. Now you are all calling me "lazy and Disinterested" I am doing neither. I am ONLY acting when I see scummy behavior. I'm not voting on a whim. and I am sure as hell not trying to run the game. I made my case, I let everyone comment, read all those comments, then I acted on them. How the fuck is this called scummy behavior is beyond me.

[Khellendros]

The only doubt for me currently is that it's not Bubba but HO. But there's just no way to tell with HO. Some thoughts on the matter at hand might be nice from him.

[Shinrei]

Beddy bye. See yall tomorrow.

[Khellendros]

Huh - we're dismissing HO because of his tendency to not be around, but he actually has more posts than Bubba...


I still think Bubba is the stronger candidate for scum because of his play the previous day, but it might be worth taking a look at HO's earlier activity.

[Lizradusa]

It is Day 4. 30 hours and 50 minutes remaining
6 Players still alive: Bubba, Hiddenone, Khellendros, Shinrei, Starling, Tattersail

4 votes to lynch, 3 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Bubba ( Tattersail )

Players not voted: Bubba, Hiddenone, Khellendros, Shinrei, Starling

[Khellendros]

Oh hey, look at that, Blend struck me as scummy a while back...but then he managed to blend back in.

 Khellendros, on 06 December 2012 - 09:11 AM, said:

 Tattersail, on 06 December 2012 - 08:32 AM, said:

 Khellendros, on 06 December 2012 - 02:05 AM, said:

I would go for Blend and Gust, actually.

What is this based on?

Ah, someone finally asked!


A few things: First, they're posting both quantitatively and qualitatively like I would normally associate with scum - gently prodding and leading, and could be argued to be selecting targets who either they think might be popular choices (Blend with you), or they believe will put up less of a fight (Gust with Azath).

There's also what might be distancing in the form of Gust's case which paints Blend as a symp - which also immediately puts Blend in that "let's only look to lynch here if other things entirely dry up category".

Ok, so this post is really about looking at HO's posts. First, I find it tragically ironic that the guy who says this...

 HiddenOne, on 06 December 2012 - 12:39 AM, said:

now, look - you're going to have to put this in perspective You are creating WIFOM, and it has to be for the sheer purpose of causing distraction or confusion, because by now everyone knows you have a hardon for me that goes beyond reason and would be less likely to listen because you're like a barking dog one becomes accustomed to in the neighborhood.

You presume to speak for the thread, when that is not your place. You have created a situation where scum can use this little drama to leave me around for a laugh. You're also trying to say that you're not the killer, because if you were, I'd be gone.

this is so scummy, straighten up and help us figure the game out

...is also the guy who spends his posts writing stuff like this:

 HiddenOne, on 05 December 2012 - 01:43 AM, said:

Calling it day
Seems PS is telling us about some roles, agreed - I will have to read that & the thread in the morning

Looks like there is some good work being done, I'll try to offer some opinons when I return

And then never does. Indeed, the only time HO has posted anything of substance in this game is when he has felt the need to defend himself from my incessant prodding. Without that, you could easily cut HO's post count by a third.



These are HO's reactions to Azath's reveal:

 HiddenOne, on 06 December 2012 - 12:04 PM, said:

Be back in 45 mins or so
Since PS is extending day I want to see whar cases on EM & Azath are before voting

And finder reveal is stinky

 HiddenOne, on 06 December 2012 - 12:44 PM, said:

well, I guess I don't have to make a decision on this after all

I guess I will believe Azath after all, but the timing is very questionable - I have to admit I would do the same thing

 HiddenOne, on 07 December 2012 - 03:11 PM, said:

 Bubba, on 07 December 2012 - 04:24 AM, said:

 Azathmaster, on 07 December 2012 - 04:06 AM, said:

 Gnaw, on 07 December 2012 - 03:50 AM, said:

 Azathmaster, on 07 December 2012 - 03:26 AM, said:

Comparing an old role to ideas of a new role help me to organize my thoughts about it. Its just a habit i guess.

Care to share those thoughts?
If I need to remind you, you did put us at the top of the "suspicious" list by not getting NK'd last night.

My thoughts are that the role is likely to be an information role (maybe a tracker? Or watcher?) and can see if someone performed an NA, but can only post about it in pics in resolution.
On being on suspicion list: some people may find you or me suspicious because we havent been NK'd, but others have noticed that scum may have purposefully not killed either of us so town would think that we were scum, which reinforces the fact that we are town. So its kinda WIFOM.

The problem I have with that is there is now some sort of other finder revealing stuff. Your finds now look kinda scumy, and with you doing a find on GH just as he gets NKed. Doesn't look good.

I just don't know who should get voted on first. You, Gnaw, or Tatts.

I will wait to hear from the of the people before placing a vote.

If the message were that Tatts isn't town, it would mean a finder. I agree that Azath looks scummy now because the odds of doing a Find on the guy who got Nkd are very low, but super convenient for him.

So Azath is scummy, not scummy, is scummy. In all honesty, that's pretty much the kind of switching I was doing too.

There is no real interaction with Blend to speak of that I noticed, but I may just double-check that one.

[Khellendros]

Oh, this is interesting. I've just seen this from the beginning of day 1. Venge tried to get Bubba lynched before he's even posted, Tattersail then jumps on it....and then Blend appears to try and chide them for voting Bubba so quickly!

 Blend, on 03 December 2012 - 02:34 PM, said:

 Tattersail, on 03 December 2012 - 02:23 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 03 December 2012 - 02:04 PM, said:

So far I see several good cases that I could get behind.

The EM case is strong and yet so is the Khell case. Both have a lot of merit in my book. But you know who really needs to be lynched. Bubba, it has been a while since he played mafia and what better way to welcome someone back into the warm mafia embrace then to lynch them before they can post.


Vote Bubba


Plus he is an admin so the hate and rage that would roll off of him would be impressive.

Ha ha, so cruel I love it!

Remove Vote

Vote Bubba

You're being kind of wanton with your votes, don't you think?

[Khellendros]

Some more goodies from day 1. First, Blend quickly following Bubba with a vote for Gnaw:

 Bubba, on 03 December 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

I have to say that vote Gnaw is the first really scum like thing I have seen today.

Remove vote, Vote Gnaw


I will be the first to put some pressure on you to explain.

 Blend, on 03 December 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

 Gnaw, on 03 December 2012 - 06:37 PM, said:

I talk too much. Going to try the lurker mode that others use so successfully.

Lurkers don't usually admit to being lurkers. And lurking is a known scum tactic. Why would you intentionally do something that looks scummy?

remove vote
vote Gnaw

Bubba's sole comment on the HO train of day 1:

 Bubba, on 04 December 2012 - 10:45 AM, said:

I will swap over to the HO train if everyone bails on the Venge train, or if my vote is needed to get the lynch. I have no history of HO so it's hard for me to guess at his playing style.

And this is Blend's 'opinion' of the HO train. Previously I was focused on Shinrei because he removed from HO when he was on L-1, but it was Blend who started the momentum shift to Venge. Trying to save partner, or knowing that HO would come back inno if lynched, trying to make themselves seem townier?

 Blend, on 04 December 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 03 December 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

After a role like that being a towny is kind of a nice break. I just get to enjoy the show rather then lick my chops at the amount of flesh that I am going to rip off of someones back.

Comments like this are pretty scummy if you ask me. I still think Gnaw's being scummy too. He still never really explained why he dropped a vote with no explanation, and has pretty much ignored any inquiries into that vote. But comments like Venge's up above make me feel quite alright with voting him.

I was pretty disappointed to wake up this morning to see that HO was a L-1 on a completely nothing case when there is some much scummier behaviour out there. I understand the want to lynch someone on principle, specially in an altless game, but come on guys, we could at least TRY to play Mafia.

remove vote
vote Venge

Screw not trying to start a new train. Yes, it looks suspicious, but come on, I'd much rather have a lynch that made a bit of sense, rather than finding out that HO was an inno after a caseless lynch.

This is the only post which really makes me question whether it's HO rather than Bubba. Pretty much everything else seems to point at Bubba.

[HiddenOne]

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 02:13 PM, said:

The only doubt for me currently is that it's not Bubba but HO. But there's just no way to tell with HO. Some thoughts on the matter at hand might be nice from him.

what do you want me to talk about? I've not been involved since before the weekend, so I don't have a grasp on the convo

[Khellendros]

 HiddenOne, on 10 December 2012 - 05:00 PM, said:

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 02:13 PM, said:

The only doubt for me currently is that it's not Bubba but HO. But there's just no way to tell with HO. Some thoughts on the matter at hand might be nice from him.

what do you want me to talk about? I've not been involved since before the weekend, so I don't have a grasp on the convo

Oh sorry, HO, I didn't realise that you weren't aware that EVERYTHING IS WRITTEN DOWN AND RECORDED, rather than this entire game taking place via oral transmission only.


See, this way, you can take a look back over the conversations whenever it suits you, at your leisure, to any level of detail you desire. We thought it was a better system than previous.

[Khellendros]

Anyways,

Vote Bubba


And even if it's not Bubba, we can afford to the loss I reckon. And it's pretty much got to be HO then.

[Tattersail_]

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

Anyways,

Vote Bubba


And even if it's not Bubba, we can afford to the loss I reckon. And it's pretty much got to be HO then.

Yes and if not them two then you.

If not you then starling.

We can widdle it down assuming the symp is dead. If he is still alive then we need to be careful tomorrrow

[Tattersail_]

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

Some more goodies from day 1. First, Blend quickly following Bubba with a vote for Gnaw:

 Bubba, on 03 December 2012 - 06:36 PM, said:

I have to say that vote Gnaw is the first really scum like thing I have seen today.

Remove vote, Vote Gnaw


I will be the first to put some pressure on you to explain.

 Blend, on 03 December 2012 - 06:39 PM, said:

 Gnaw, on 03 December 2012 - 06:37 PM, said:

I talk too much. Going to try the lurker mode that others use so successfully.

Lurkers don't usually admit to being lurkers. And lurking is a known scum tactic. Why would you intentionally do something that looks scummy?

remove vote
vote Gnaw

Bubba's sole comment on the HO train of day 1:

 Bubba, on 04 December 2012 - 10:45 AM, said:

I will swap over to the HO train if everyone bails on the Venge train, or if my vote is needed to get the lynch. I have no history of HO so it's hard for me to guess at his playing style.

And this is Blend's 'opinion' of the HO train. Previously I was focused on Shinrei because he removed from HO when he was on L-1, but it was Blend who started the momentum shift to Venge. Trying to save partner, or knowing that HO would come back inno if lynched, trying to make themselves seem townier?

 Blend, on 04 December 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

 Vengeance, on 03 December 2012 - 09:46 PM, said:

After a role like that being a towny is kind of a nice break. I just get to enjoy the show rather then lick my chops at the amount of flesh that I am going to rip off of someones back.

Comments like this are pretty scummy if you ask me. I still think Gnaw's being scummy too. He still never really explained why he dropped a vote with no explanation, and has pretty much ignored any inquiries into that vote. But comments like Venge's up above make me feel quite alright with voting him.

I was pretty disappointed to wake up this morning to see that HO was a L-1 on a completely nothing case when there is some much scummier behaviour out there. I understand the want to lynch someone on principle, specially in an altless game, but come on guys, we could at least TRY to play Mafia.

remove vote
vote Venge

Screw not trying to start a new train. Yes, it looks suspicious, but come on, I'd much rather have a lynch that made a bit of sense, rather than finding out that HO was an inno after a caseless lynch.

This is the only post which really makes me question whether it's HO rather than Bubba. Pretty much everything else seems to point at Bubba.

Although that post by Blend is worrisome regarding HO.

[Tattersail_]

You would have called it day one ha!

[Khellendros]

 Tattersail, on 10 December 2012 - 05:27 PM, said:

 Khellendros, on 10 December 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

Anyways,

Vote Bubba


And even if it's not Bubba, we can afford to the loss I reckon. And it's pretty much got to be HO then.

Yes and if not them two then you.

If not you then starling.

We can widdle it down assuming the symp is dead. If he is still alive then we need to be careful tomorrrow

You haven't beeen foolish so far so don't start being now. Nothing I've said discounts the symp. And the "if not him, then him" sarcasm is unnecessary - I'm clearly basing that statement on the ream of posts which I've just gone over and shown to you all.

[Khellendros]

 Tattersail, on 10 December 2012 - 05:28 PM, said:

You would have called it day one ha!

Which is probably the strongest argument for it NOT being HO

[Khellendros]

Ah, forget my previous post - I thought you'd written "we CAN'T widdle [whittle?] it down assuming the symp is dead." Thought you were accusing me of being blase

[Lizradusa]

It is Day 4. 28 hours and 20 minutes remaining
6 Players still alive: Bubba, Hiddenone, Khellendros, Shinrei, Starling, Tattersail

4 votes to lynch, 3 votes to go to night.

2 Votes for Bubba ( Tattersail, Khellendros )

Players not voted: Bubba, Hiddenone, Shinrei, Starling