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The first black Bond And you know you'll never go back.

#1 User is offline   Shinrei 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 04:41 AM

"Idris Elba As James Bond: The Right Move for the 007 Franchise"

http://www.hollywood...t_Move/43049789

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There are those who look directly down their noses at the Internet rumor mill; casting aspersions as to its place within respectable journalism. It’s difficult to blame them, as the rush to break news first has given rise to a rather shaky reclassification of what qualifies as news in the first place. But perhaps we shouldn’t throw the baby out with the digital bathwater. Even those “confirmed” news bits that end up debunked or outright denied can hold merit if in no other capacity than as a catalyst for worthwhile dialogue.

Case in point, a recent report divulged that actor Idris Elba had taken a meeting with James Bond producer Barbara Broccoli. According to Skyfall star Naomie Harris, this meeting was to broach the subject of a black James Bond and investigate the possibility of Elba stepping into the role. The web exploded into frenzied excitement both at the progressiveness of this purported new direction for the character and the repeatedly proven talent and screen presence of Elba. Whether this rumor proves true or whether it is cast on the ever-mounting pile of baseless blog chatter, the prospect of Elba’s casting as Bond opens the door for a long-overdue innovation to the franchise, one that transcends beyond the obvious diversity in the lead role, or lack thereof up to now.

James Bond is Britain’s most lethal and effective double-0 agent. His unparalleled ability to thwart the sinister schemes of the world’s worst villains, and his unquestionable prowess with women, is made all the more impressive when one considers he has been plying his trade for fifty years. Dr. No, Bond’s first filmic outing, hit theaters in 1962. Six actors and twenty-three films later, James Bond is still kicking ass and taking names. Not bad for a man that, even by the most generous calculations, is in his late seventies. The series has never really acknowledged the fact that the clock seems to reset each time a new actor takes over the role. Even when the character was more or less rebooted in Casino Royale, the new Bond timeline began with Judi Dench as M; negating years of established canon.

Logistically, as the mechanics of the series currently exist, this amnesic approach to each changing of the Bond guard is a necessity. If we applied strict rules of chronology to the franchise, the only thing James Bond would be licensed to do would be to receive discounts at restaurants or break his hip. That loses something in the sexy department. A measure of responsibility therefore falls on the audience of course to suspend their disbelief. The problem is that this charade is based on the foregone conclusion that James Bond is one man’s name.

In 1995’, the filmmakers GoldenEye made a drastic change to the series. In a forward-thinking decision, Dame Judi Dench was cast as Bond’s boss, M, a role that had theretofore been played by two men. Though the changeover from Bernard Lee’s M to Robert Brown’s in the early 80s was not acknowledged, Dench’s break from the M mode was pronounced enough that the writers had to introduce the idea that she hadn’t been in that cushy MI-6 office the whole time. It was the first instance of M referring to the predecessors to the job.

So the question then became, why not do the same with Bond? Why not offer the radical suggestion that James Bond is not a person, but a position. With the sheer number of bad guys who tend to know his name, even when he is trying to infiltrate their organizations, it would actually make sense that the name James Bond is a cover. It would re-contextualize the whole franchise and completely change the archetype for 007. Suddenly the idea of Bond having battled both Cold War instigators AND cyber terrorists isn’t nearly as far-fetched. This also affords the series the ability to “kill off” Bond from time to time when a new actor is to be brought on, a la Dr. Who. A singular Bond whose cinematic longevity is all-but assured is great and all, but the suspense inherent in the idea that James could die would dramatically alter how we watch his action sequences.

Elba is possessed of plenty of the qualities we have come to associate with Bond. For one thing, he has a tremendous amount of poise. When he enters a scene, he is in full command of every moment and our attention is fixed on his performance. He's also exceedingly dashing; a trait that has defined this classic cinematic spy from day one. He looks good in a suit, but the dashing really comes from more of a smooth air of confidence. Elba has also proven his ability to deliver accomplished performances in equal measure with adept navigation of huge-scale action sequences. Given that the Bond films often employ fantastical stunts, and yet much would be demanded of his character work as a brand new 007, this artful combination would be crucial.

With the previous films serve as precedent, it will take a fearless, against-type piece of casting to force the helmers of the Bond franchise to rethink the construct of the character. Idris Elba would make a great Bond for plenty of reasons beyond his skin color, but his hiring could also bring about a major reinvention of our perception of this iconic character.


I, for one, think this is a great idea.

Discuss.
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#2 User is offline   MTS 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 04:48 AM

While I'm not yet ready to see Craig's Bond go, I think this is an awesome idea, and would love to see Elba as Bond.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 04:54 AM

If Stringer is Bond, then McNulty needs to be a bad guy.

On a more serious note, why do they have to change who James Bond is (into a "position", rather than a person) for a potential transition to a black James Bond? Just make him the regular James Bond and have done with it.
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#4 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:04 AM

I don't like it. It's just wrong. I don't like when people start to get pro-active about gender and race and want to alter an established character. What's next? We need to have a female James Bond because women don't get enough respect? Maybe an Asian or Indian James Bond because it will appeal to the huge Chinese and Indian film market?

Just the way this article phrases it makes me annoyed, a "black James Bond". It's like they want to put Shaft in a Tuxedo. Bond is bond. He's some kind of mal content, slightly posh upper class sociopath- That's who he is. The skin color should not define him.

On the other hand, who the hell doesn't love Idris Elba? I could stand to watch him play Bond. He'd be a good fit.

How ever, Daniel Craig still has 2 or 3 films left on his contract. By the time they get around to looking for a new bond how old will Elba be? Too old?

This post has been edited by Aptorius: 13 November 2012 - 08:05 AM

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:27 AM

Idris Elba could, I suppose, make a good Bond, but if Bond is going black then what about Colin Salmon?
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:35 AM

The only problem I ever had with a black James Bond was the names that used t be punted around for it. I recall Will Smith being touted several years ago. No thanks.

but Elba is ace, he wild nail that role no problem.

I've heard the typical "I'm not racist, but Bond is Suppose to he a posh white guy" argument every time a black bind is suggested.
Bollocks to that, it was written 70 or so years ago, times have changed, if they were setting it in the 50's that might have the tiniest bit of weight but its not. The leading mi6 agent is 007, James Bond, its his character and personality that was s the focal point, and I think Elba would nail it.

Regarding craic, I love his Bond, but I recently read that he would happily kill the contract and step away from the role. But apts possibly correct (I feel dirty) say 5 years down the line, maybe more, when his contract expires, Elba may be a little too old.

Anyone else that we think would carry the role? A yonget Denzel with an English accent perhaps?
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I don't know many British actors at the best of times, I don't really watch much TV and in films the Brits are usually bad guys (damn you holllywood!). The guy from Spartacus wold have the physicallity and cold blooded down but I don't know if he would do the sardonic well, I've only ever seen him cracking a whip at gladiators
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 08:39 AM

Idris Elba would be a fantastic Bond! I couldn't care less about what skin colour Bond is supposed to have. Sure, if Bond had been an icelandic agent it might've been a little odd, though still workable, but it's not like England is some sort of white homogenous society.

Anyways, Elba would radiate menace in the role. It would be awesome.
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#8 User is offline   Shinrei 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 09:30 AM

Watching Casino Royale with an ex-girlfriend, she said Danial Craig was the least attractive Bond. When he got out of the water at the beach in Casino Royale she exclaimed "he's a pinhead!", as in, he has a small head especially in comparision with his musculature. And he has 'pistol grip ears' too.

I can't say I care, but maybe the ladies of Malazan have an opinion.
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#9 User is offline   MTS 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 10:58 AM

View Postamphibian, on 13 November 2012 - 04:54 AM, said:

If Stringer is Bond, then McNulty needs to be a bad guy.

On a more serious note, why do they have to change who James Bond is (into a "position", rather than a person) for a potential transition to a black James Bond? Just make him the regular James Bond and have done with it.

Holy crap I would love to see Dominic West play a Bond villain.

As for the change, it's actually been a pretty convincing fan theory for quite a while, and at least explains the personality/age differences between the actors who have played Bond.

http://www.cracked.c...-movies-better/

I agree with Apt though in that the way the article is worded the whole 'James Bond is a position' thing seems to be trying to justify why Elba can be Bond, as if Bond cannot be played by a black person as it stands now, which is just silly.

Quote

Watching Casino Royale with an ex-girlfriend, she said Danial Craig was the least attractive Bond. When he got out of the water at the beach in Casino Royale she exclaimed "he's a pinhead!", as in, he has a small head especially in comparision with his musculature. And he has 'pistol grip ears' too.

I can't say I care, but maybe the ladies of Malazan have an opinion.

Well, in trying to convince my gf to go see Skyfall with me I learned that she is not a fan of Daniel Craig's looks either, though she did admit the man could really wear a suit.

As for others who could pull it off, Colin Salmon is a good one. Chiwetel Ejiofor maybe?
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#10 User is offline   polishgenius 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:07 AM

View PostAptorius, on 13 November 2012 - 08:04 AM, said:

I don't like it. It's just wrong. I don't like when people start to get pro-active about gender and race and want to alter an established character. What's next? We need to have a female James Bond because women don't get enough respect? Maybe an Asian or Indian James Bond because it will appeal to the huge Chinese and Indian film market?

Just the way this article phrases it makes me annoyed, a "black James Bond". It's like they want to put Shaft in a Tuxedo. Bond is bond. He's some kind of mal content, slightly posh upper class sociopath- That's who he is. The skin color should not define him.

On the other hand, who the hell doesn't love Idris Elba? I could stand to watch him play Bond. He'd be a good fit.



This is the thing. It shouldn't be about making James Bond black, it should be about which actor is the best fit, in terms of personality and acting, for James Bond. And at the moment the only rival I can think of for Elba is Michael Fassbender.

Having an American play Bond would cause far more outcry over here I suspect, despite an Aussie and an Irishman already having done it, but we couldn't complain too much given the amount of iconic American characters currently being played by British guys (especially from comics).

But you're quite right that if Craig was going to do another two films, Elba would be pushing it in age and if he did three, he'd certainly be too old (he's 40 now so that would probably put him in his fifties).

This post has been edited by polishgenius: 13 November 2012 - 11:07 AM

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#11 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:45 AM

View PostShinrei, on 13 November 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

Watching Casino Royale with an ex-girlfriend, she said Danial Craig was the least attractive Bond. When he got out of the water at the beach in Casino Royale she exclaimed "he's a pinhead!", as in, he has a small head especially in comparision with his musculature. And he has 'pistol grip ears' too.

I can't say I care, but maybe the ladies of Malazan have an opinion.


The thing about Craigs bond that I love so much is that he was a dramatic departure from the bond we had come to expect from mainly Roger Moore and Pierce Brosnan. This suave, suit wearing upper class brit who makes a one liner as he uses his gadgets to un-panty random women and sips Martini's all day long. Granted Pierce Brosnans Bond was taking Bond into more personal stories (especially that one where he's been held captive by the Chinese for a year or something like that) but when Daniel Craig was cast it totally changed the movies.

Daniel Craig is intimidating like no Bond has been before. He looks like a violent man. He has a hard face, with cold blue eyes and when he acts or speaks you almost flinch because you know and feel that this man is capable of terrible violence and kills with out remorse or hesitation. Craigs Bond is a murderer masquerading as a nice guy. A monster dressed in a fine suit who only seems shackled by his love for his own country. I like that about him. He's not a pretty man and he doesn't do pretty things. People in his line of work should be flawed and horrible and stunning to watch in action. Not some tea and crumpets eating posh who seems more worried about his appearance than getting the job done.

I could see Idris Elba personifying some of the same traits while adding some of his natural charm. Stringer Bell from Wire television show was a similar kind of man. Sophisticated yet brutal.

This post has been edited by Aptorius: 13 November 2012 - 12:29 PM

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:46 AM

Hell yes Idris Elba would be awesome as Bond! :thumbsup:

As to the wider discussion...whether a justification for the changing faces of Bond is needed in-universe or not is kinda moot. It happens. We don't care as long as the person playing Bond does it well and fits the role. So the meta justification to keep the entertainment coming really already makes a mockery of any concerns over a sense of continuity of actor's skin colour, doesn't it? Therefore any in-universe justification is optional. *shrug*
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 12:18 PM

Craig is signed on for two more Bond films, but after that I'd be happy to see Elba as Bond. He's just a phenomenal actor.

As far as who Bond is, there has always been the fan theory of why so many have played him being because the Bond name and 007 title are both code names and have been different men throughout history....though I suppose events in SKYFALL make that theory null and void.

At any rate, I don't see any reason why there can't be a black Bond. Go for acting chops and forget about skin colour.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 12:29 PM

View PostQuickTidal, on 13 November 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

Craig is signed on for two more Bond films, but after that I'd be happy to see Elba as Bond. He's just a phenomenal actor.

As far as who Bond is, there has always been the fan theory of why so many have played him being because the Bond name and 007 title are both code names and have been different men throughout history....though I suppose events in SKYFALL make that theory null and void.

At any rate, I don't see any reason why there can't be a black Bond. Go for acting chops and forget about skin colour.

Not to mention that apparently Roger Moore visits the grave of his dead wife - who was shot in a George Lazenby movie.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 01:34 PM

This raised an interesting thought. Maybe at the end of Daniel Craig's run, they could kill him off, but by then he will be so feared that his successor is given the identity "James Bond" to keep Britain's enemies guessing. So it really does become a "position" in the story. Then you could hire anybody to do the role, and explore some different things.
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#16 User is offline   Shinrei 

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Posted 13 November 2012 - 01:44 PM

View PostAptorius, on 13 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

Granted Pierce Brosnans Bond was taking Bond into more personal stories (especially that one where he's been held captive by the Chinese for a year or something like that) but when Daniel Craig was cast it totally changed the movies.



lol, she mentioned that movie too. She said "how could Bond spend a year in the gulag and come out with love handles?" Brosnan didn't beef up for the role, obviously. Can't say that about Craig.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 02:02 PM

View PostMcLovin, on 13 November 2012 - 01:34 PM, said:

This raised an interesting thought. Maybe at the end of Daniel Craig's run, they could kill him off, but by then he will be so feared that his successor is given the identity "James Bond" to keep Britain's enemies guessing. So it really does become a "position" in the story. Then you could hire anybody to do the role, and explore some different things.


Yeah, that would be a way to go and would be in keeping with the SKYFALL changing of the guard with

Spoiler


I could defo seeing them go that route and imagine that Craig's bond is the first in this line of Bonds.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 02:41 PM

View PostAptorius, on 13 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

View PostShinrei, on 13 November 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:



Watching Casino Royale with an ex-girlfriend, she said Danial Craig was the least attractive Bond. When he got out of the water at the beach in Casino Royale she exclaimed "he's a pinhead!", as in, he has a small head especially in comparision with his musculature. And he has 'pistol grip ears' too.




Daniel Craig is intimidating like no Bond has been before. He looks like a violent man. He has a hard face, with cold blue eyes and when he acts or speaks you almost flinch because you know and feel that this man is capable of terrible violence and kills with out remorse or hesitation. Craigs Bond is a murderer masquerading as a nice guy. A monster dressed in a fine suit who only seems shackled by his love for his own country. I like that about him. He's not a pretty man and he doesn't do pretty things. People in his line of work should be flawed and horrible and stunning to watch in action. Not some tea and crumpets eating posh who seems more worried about his appearance than getting the job done.



Apt nails it. Craig is very handsome, I think, but a different kind of handsome than Brosnan. I get bored looking at Brosnan (or any beau for that matter) after a while because he is good-looking and that's it. Craig is interesting to look at and is still interesting to look at after 10 minutes, and his pistol grip ears and what not add to that. His face has imperfections, edges, lines, roughness, it tells stories. (That's true for anybody in my opinion, not just actors, btw and I love seeing that in people.) And then he creates an atmosphere when he walks in, he exudes a palpable physical presence which I think comes with this job where you never know how much longer you live and when you deal out death.

I think Craig is the perfect man for the job, and I hope that even though he wants to leave the contract he'll do a few more.

As for the Black Bond, it depends why and what the producers want to achieve with a switch. Bond is a product from the cultural, political and socialbackground at that time, during the Cold War, and black people were largely excluded from this kindof life, the education and background you needed to get into that job, I am sorry to say. If they want to stay with Bond how he was originally created, thenno. If the old Bond has outlived himself, then yes.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:18 PM

View PostShinrei, on 13 November 2012 - 09:30 AM, said:

Watching Casino Royale with an ex-girlfriend, she said Danial Craig was the least attractive Bond. When he got out of the water at the beach in Casino Royale she exclaimed "he's a pinhead!", as in, he has a small head especially in comparision with his musculature. And he has 'pistol grip ears' too.

I can't say I care, but maybe the ladies of Malazan have an opinion.


Your ex-girlfriend is crazy.

View PostAptorius, on 13 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

The thing about Craigs bond that I love so much is that he was a dramatic departure from the bond we had come to expect from mainly Roger Moore and Pierce Brosnan. This suave, suit wearing upper class brit who makes a one liner as he uses his gadgets to un-panty random women and sips Martini's all day long. Granted Pierce Brosnans Bond was taking Bond into more personal stories (especially that one where he's been held captive by the Chinese for a year or something like that) but when Daniel Craig was cast it totally changed the movies.

Daniel Craig is intimidating like no Bond has been before. He looks like a violent man. He has a hard face, with cold blue eyes and when he acts or speaks you almost flinch because you know and feel that this man is capable of terrible violence and kills with out remorse or hesitation. Craigs Bond is a murderer masquerading as a nice guy. A monster dressed in a fine suit who only seems shackled by his love for his own country. I like that about him. He's not a pretty man and he doesn't do pretty things. People in his line of work should be flawed and horrible and stunning to watch in action. Not some tea and crumpets eating posh who seems more worried about his appearance than getting the job done.


I think there's justification for either style. As you say, the Craig bond shows off the sort of person you'd expect from all that violence. I think what the earlier bonds were going for was that he can be so suave and calm because he's just that good - ie he has lots and lots and lots of confidence (and confidence is sexy ;) ) but also the skills and gadgets to get through anything and everything without getting scarred either physically or emotionally.


View PostTapper, on 13 November 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

View PostQuickTidal, on 13 November 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

Craig is signed on for two more Bond films, but after that I'd be happy to see Elba as Bond. He's just a phenomenal actor.

As far as who Bond is, there has always been the fan theory of why so many have played him being because the Bond name and 007 title are both code names and have been different men throughout history....though I suppose events in SKYFALL make that theory null and void.

At any rate, I don't see any reason why there can't be a black Bond. Go for acting chops and forget about skin colour.

Not to mention that apparently Roger Moore visits the grave of his dead wife - who was shot in a George Lazenby movie.


You could say that Moore and Lazenby were the same person but the other actors are different? I think I read something on this somewhere and an important point to note is that apparently several of the various actors' last films have bond going through something more traumatic that would potentially lead to needing a new bond? Not like outright die, but ie the last Brosnan Bond goes rogue.

View Postworrywort, on 14 September 2012 - 08:07 PM, said:

I kinda love it when D'rek unleashes her nerd wrath, as I knew she would here. Sorry innocent bystanders, but someone's gotta be the kindling.
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Posted 13 November 2012 - 11:50 PM

I'm fairly certain the 'black Bond' comment was a reference to a completely unrelated flic where Elba may play a secret agent type who is similar to Bond in the sense that Jason Bourne is the 'younger Bond' and Neeson's character in the Taken movies is the 'retired Bond'.

The rest is just internet feeding frenzy bollocks.
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