[Telas]

Well, I'm here.
In regards to lynching, Let me confess.
"I honestly have no idea about who is in my faction and who is not."
So, I would prefer not to lynch.

[Atrahal]

Spite, on 15 November 2012 - 07:23 AM, said:

Ok reading up on the last few pages it seems to be a lot of talk about lynching spammers/ low posters.
I guess atm there isnt really a lot to go on because of the cult mechanics and no nk. Id be willing to vote to get a lynch so that we have some information, but im kind of unsure on the reasoning behind Tennes. If i had to choose right now id probably go for Telann because i think the case on him at least had some merit even if it was thin.

There is no case on Telann, stop making very vague stuff up - even the 'case-maker' admitted he knew shit about Telann. The reason you don't like the Tennes voting is because it's based on the same criteria we could easily lynch you for.

[Atrahal]

Spite, on 15 November 2012 - 07:41 AM, said:

yeah thats kind of what i thought. That seems like a rubbish reason :S

Ah, excellent! So you're going to come up with a better reason now are you? No? Then what the fuck are you doing here?

In any case, my vote on Tennes was for, at the time, low posting AND most spam per total number of posts.

[Telas]

Atrahal, on 15 November 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

Spite, on 15 November 2012 - 07:23 AM, said:

Ok reading up on the last few pages it seems to be a lot of talk about lynching spammers/ low posters.
I guess atm there isnt really a lot to go on because of the cult mechanics and no nk. Id be willing to vote to get a lynch so that we have some information, but im kind of unsure on the reasoning behind Tennes. If i had to choose right now id probably go for Telann because i think the case on him at least had some merit even if it was thin.

There is no case on Telann, stop making very vague stuff up - even the 'case-maker' admitted he knew shit about Telann. The reason you don't like the Tennes voting is because it's based on the same criteria we could easily lynch you for.

Why is everyone saying Telann in place of Tellan?

[Atrahal]

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 08:59 AM, said:

Atrahal, on 14 November 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

Hmm, Ruse silenced. Interesting. But not as interesting as this!

Ladies and gents, the spamometer! I've generally tried to be very lenient about what does not constitute spam, even the smallest amount of original somewhat game-related content makes an otherwise spam-filled post not count as spam in this measurement. On the other hand, sole repetition of previous statements, and reponses to spam even if they're serious (like telling people not to spam or to contribute more), themselves count as spam. This is up to post #439. So here we go:

Anomandaris 88% (7/8 posts are spam)
Emurlahn 86% (6/7)
Spite 86% (12/14)
Tennes 83% (5/6)
Telas 79% (15/19)
Silanah 73% (11/15)
Tellan 70% (14/20)
Olar Ethil 67% (8/12)
Ampelas 67% (14/21)
Ruse 56% (56/100)
Tulas Shorn 55% (12/22)
Galain 53%(10/19)
Atrahal 51% (23/45)
Karosis 46% (11/24)
Sorrit 39% (19/36)
Fener 31% (5/16)
Path-Shaper 25% (13/51)


So, as it turns out, low posting does in general correlate to low-content posting Seriously, some of those are shocking.


Edit: changed 'contribute' to 'correlate'.

What constitutes as spam though in what you have said. 6/7 posts for example, if he posted 2 more content filled post his percentage would drop from 86% to 6/9 which would be 66%.

If this was later in the game i'd jump on this willingly but this early into such a complex game i'm not for just jumping on. Incidently my last vote was for someone who hasn't posted in 170 posts plus.

The spam-o-meter was also a way to see if it would make some people post more by naming and shaming - and, whether they deny it was because of that or not, quite a few near the top have come on and posted more content since then.

Also, you're only looking at the percentages? Why do you think I voted for Tennes instead of Anomandaris? Because I took into account more than the percentages. You're right in one thing though, things have changed a bit since the spam-o-meter went up. I'll get to that in a minute.


Edit: Grammar.

This post has been edited by Atrahal: 15 November 2012 - 12:34 PM

[Atrahal]

Spite, on 15 November 2012 - 09:56 AM, said:

Quote

Spite, on 15 November 2012 - 07:23 AM, said:

Ok reading up on the last few pages it seems to be a lot of talk about lynching spammers/ low posters.
I guess atm there isnt really a lot to go on because of the cult mechanics and no nk. Id be willing to vote to get a lynch so that we have some information, but im kind of unsure on the reasoning behind Tennes. If i had to choose right now id probably go for Telann because i think the case on him at least had some merit even if it was thin.

How is the reason "I have a bad gut feeling about Tellan", better than "Hey, Tennes has very few post and almost all of them are spam"?

Because low posting isnt a reason its a cop out basically. Having a bad feeling i can get behind more because its based on content rather than just how often someone is posting

Galain, on 15 November 2012 - 09:57 AM, said:

Right, Karosis was the one who suggested to lynch those people who are likely to be modkilled. Apart from that he has not really contributed much and he seems to have vanished for today - he has only one post after the day started. So, I see where your suspicion comes from.
I still prefer to go for a low post right now though, that way people might become more inclined to up their posting.

This is aimed more at Spite and Ampelas than at you Galain, but....

You have suspicions of what exactly?!?!?!?!!!!! Seriously, that kind of statement, in a faction game, has me tearing my hair out in disbelief. When you say you suspect someone just like that, you make it sound as if you're looking for scum, which we're not!

If you're suspicious of someone it can only be because you suspect that they are not in your faction. So: Ampelas. Spite. Why do you suspect that Tellan/Karosis is not in your faction? What makes his play different from yours. Perhaps you would like to say something along the lines of "I'm Khanate and he strikes me as being Nepeth, so I would like to lynch him?". No? But seriously, give something to go with your 'suspicion.'

[Ampelas]

That actually is aimed at Galain Atrahal. How is it not. Can you point out my "suspicion" post?

[Atrahal]

Ok, so here is what I get from the flurry of activity from the time the spam-o-meter went up. It might not be related, sure, but the point I'm about to make is, I believe, still valid.

Since the spam-o-meter went up, Spite, Anomandaris, Emurlahn, Tennes, Silanah, the dudes near the top or at the top, have all been more active than has been usual for them up until now. May or may not be related - whatever, it doesn't matter. What matters is the substance of that activity.

Out of those, although they've all been posting, Tennes is the only to have posted some things of value since then. Whether or not that's because he was the one with votes on him, again, does not matter.

Anomandaris has pretty much literally echoed what others have already said.

Spite made up some really vague shit which was only designed to move people away from thinking low poster/high spammer hunt, i.e. self-preservation.

Silanah...I can't even think of anything to say. Bleh is appropriate.

Emurlahn....fine, a begrudging pass because of your apparent situation, though you could still have said something of value in your limited time.


In conclusion, I'm willing to switch my vote to one of Anomandaris, Spite, or Silanah.

[Atrahal]

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 12:48 PM, said:

That actually is aimed at Galain Atrahal. How is it not. Can you point out my "suspicion" post?

Because he was replying to your stuff about Karosis. Are you saying you are not now 'suspicious' in some vague unformed way of Karosis now?

[Ampelas]

Is it this one I posted the vote with?

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 14 November 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 22 hours and 45 minutes remaining

16 Players still alive: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Karosis, Olar Ethil, Ruse, Silanah, Sorrit, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

9 votes to lynch, 8 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Telas ( Spite )
3 Votes for Tellan ( Sorrit, Ruse, Olar Ethil )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Karosis, Silanah, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

I think this was last update by PS.

We have quite a lot of time left.

Vote Karosis

I have noticed he has more posts than me but cannot remember too much from today. So this is a prod to get him more active again.

Maybe not.

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 09:57 AM, said:

Karosis, on 13 November 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

Given that this game is going to be more fun with active players, and given that it will be played mostly behind the scenes and that it is necessary to play to do that, I am going to throw the suggestion out there that we should just lynch one of the people who are gonna get mod-killed. That way it's a little less likely to break the game if they get mod killed.

On that note,

vote Tennes

He is the first one I notices as not having checked in. Who are the others? I am thinking Fener, Korvalain, Tulas Shorn? Anyway, if people like this idea for a Day 1 lynch, I would be willing to move my vote amongst those players. If not, well I am open-minded, but I don't really see any great cases right now.

He has a few arguments with Ruse and Sorrit about numbers. Then this post. He votes Tennes who was NOT one of the ones that hadn't posted. I don't know what his game was here but it was only one click away to check. He then moves it to Tulas. Accuses Emur of being on Tulas' team. Says stuff about Fener's potential location. So that was ALL day one. Then if you look. Day 2 arrives and....

Is it this? Pointing out that he was active day one but not active day 2? Nope.


I think your post was aimed at Spite and at Galain. I don't think Karosis is in my faction hence my vote for him. That is what reading up and forming a gut feeling gets you. I don't think anybody else will vote for him but I am entitled to vote my own way for my own reasons.

[Ampelas]

Atrahal, on 15 November 2012 - 12:49 PM, said:

Ok, so here is what I get from the flurry of activity from the time the spam-o-meter went up. It might not be related, sure, but the point I'm about to make is, I believe, still valid.

Since the spam-o-meter went up, Spite, Anomandaris, Emurlahn, Tennes, Silanah, the dudes near the top or at the top, have all been more active than has been usual for them up until now. May or may not be related - whatever, it doesn't matter. What matters is the substance of that activity.

Out of those, although they've all been posting, Tennes is the only to have posted some things of value since then. Whether or not that's because he was the one with votes on him, again, does not matter.

Anomandaris has pretty much literally echoed what others have already said.

Spite made up some really vague shit which was only designed to move people away from thinking low poster/high spammer hunt, i.e. self-preservation.

Silanah...I can't even think of anything to say. Bleh is appropriate.

Emurlahn....fine, a begrudging pass because of your apparent situation, though you could still have said something of value in your limited time.


In conclusion, I'm willing to switch my vote to one of Anomandaris, Spite, or Silanah.

Now I agree with what you say here. I'd be willing to swap to one of these too, i'm leaning towards Silanah due to the nonsense they post.

[Atrahal]

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 12:52 PM, said:

Is it this one I posted the vote with?

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 08:48 AM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 14 November 2012 - 11:09 PM, said:

It is Day 2. 22 hours and 45 minutes remaining

16 Players still alive: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Karosis, Olar Ethil, Ruse, Silanah, Sorrit, Spite, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

9 votes to lynch, 8 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Telas ( Spite )
3 Votes for Tellan ( Sorrit, Ruse, Olar Ethil )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Anomandaris, Atrahal, Emurlahn, Fener, Galain, Karosis, Silanah, Telas, Tellan, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

I think this was last update by PS.

We have quite a lot of time left.

Vote Karosis

I have noticed he has more posts than me but cannot remember too much from today. So this is a prod to get him more active again.

Maybe not.

Ampelas, on 15 November 2012 - 09:57 AM, said:

Karosis, on 13 November 2012 - 01:57 PM, said:

Given that this game is going to be more fun with active players, and given that it will be played mostly behind the scenes and that it is necessary to play to do that, I am going to throw the suggestion out there that we should just lynch one of the people who are gonna get mod-killed. That way it's a little less likely to break the game if they get mod killed.

On that note,

vote Tennes

He is the first one I notices as not having checked in. Who are the others? I am thinking Fener, Korvalain, Tulas Shorn? Anyway, if people like this idea for a Day 1 lynch, I would be willing to move my vote amongst those players. If not, well I am open-minded, but I don't really see any great cases right now.

He has a few arguments with Ruse and Sorrit about numbers. Then this post. He votes Tennes who was NOT one of the ones that hadn't posted. I don't know what his game was here but it was only one click away to check. He then moves it to Tulas. Accuses Emur of being on Tulas' team. Says stuff about Fener's potential location. So that was ALL day one. Then if you look. Day 2 arrives and....

Is it this? Pointing out that he was active day one but not active day 2? Nope.


I think your post was aimed at Spite and at Galain. I don't think Karosis is in my faction hence my vote for him. That is what reading up and forming a gut feeling gets you. I don't think anybody else will vote for him but I am entitled to vote my own way for my own reasons.

But dude, look at the kinds of things you tag Karosis with as suspicious - they're the kinds of arguments which are more valid if this was town vs. scum. Now, fair enough, you have finally come out and said you believe Karosis is not in your faction.

Would you care to elaborate on that?

[Telas]

Atrahal, on 15 November 2012 - 12:42 PM, said:

This is aimed more at Spite and Ampelas than at you Galain, but....

You have suspicions of what exactly?!?!?!?!!!!! Seriously, that kind of statement, in a faction game, has me tearing my hair out in disbelief. When you say you suspect someone just like that, you make it sound as if you're looking for scum, which we're not!

If you're suspicious of someone it can only be because you suspect that they are not in your faction. So: Ampelas. Spite. Why do you suspect that Tellan/Karosis is not in your faction? What makes his play different from yours. Perhaps you would like to say something along the lines of "I'm Khanate and he strikes me as being Nepeth, so I would like to lynch him?". No? But seriously, give something to go with your 'suspicion.'

That's your problem.
You expect people to come out and say:"I did a find on Player X and he is not in my faction so let's lynch him?"
Or to come out and say:"Player X preformed a thief action on me and I'm not a GoB player?"
Or"Player X is a Khanate so let's lynch him?
No,they may know something we do not(most probably they do).But they cannot come out and declare it in thread.
So they try to use non-existent town v scum argument to try and get their way.

[Atrahal]

Path-Shaper, on 15 November 2012 - 10:56 AM, said:

A word on timing & distance:

I try to resolve everything at the same time (end of the phase) unless they're actions that affect the player only, then they can be resolved immediately (and by the player).
I thought I had more or less taken care of this in design, and where it didn't, I more or less figured it would be OK.
Unfortunately, for some abilities, this isn't possible. I knew this: things that say 'until the end of this phase' kind of become impossible if you don't resolve them instantly - likewise, since 'dawn' is tied to 'first log-in of the game day' there will always be issues with dawn actions being processed after others have already submitted day actions/ done day things. Partly this can be mitigated with provisionals, but some things can't be. Turns out it is a tiny bit of a bigger problem than I thought.

I'll have to go through the entire design yet again for the next game, and remove these last bits, too. Luckily, less than half of the roles will come out of this game alive..... less re-balancing of what is already written.

Distance: good to know for all of you:

If you move from one tile to another, you are considered to be in both for the purposes of targeting others and being targeted yourself.

For example, say that:

Quote

player A is on the Mirror and moves to the Nepeth Barracks at the 5.34 timestamp. He targets player B with a Retainer action while on the Barracks.
Player B is on the Square of Camels and moves to the Road to Ishktar at the 5.36 timestamp.

For the purpose of resolving actions, Player A is on the Mirror AND the Nepeth Barracks. Player B is at the Square AND at the Road. Because the road is adjacent to the Mirror, the action will go through.
So, movement extends the possibilities of some of your actions, and also increases the chance you'll be targeted yourself.

Since movement is a use of your action for that phase, for the majority of you this will be a negative effect (being targeted more) unless you have a lot of Items/ Retainers, of course, so that you can target more people.

Do the timestamps matter? Sorry, I'm having trouble understanding. So, essentially, you can hit someone (or be hit by someone) two tiles away, not just one?

[Atrahal]

Telas, on 15 November 2012 - 01:04 PM, said:

Atrahal, on 15 November 2012 - 12:42 PM, said:

This is aimed more at Spite and Ampelas than at you Galain, but....

You have suspicions of what exactly?!?!?!?!!!!! Seriously, that kind of statement, in a faction game, has me tearing my hair out in disbelief. When you say you suspect someone just like that, you make it sound as if you're looking for scum, which we're not!

If you're suspicious of someone it can only be because you suspect that they are not in your faction. So: Ampelas. Spite. Why do you suspect that Tellan/Karosis is not in your faction? What makes his play different from yours. Perhaps you would like to say something along the lines of "I'm Khanate and he strikes me as being Nepeth, so I would like to lynch him?". No? But seriously, give something to go with your 'suspicion.'

That's your problem.
You expect people to come out and say:"I did a find on Player X and he is not in my faction so let's lynch him?"
Or to come out and say:"Player X preformed a thief action on me and I'm not a GoB player?"
Or"Player X is a Khanate so let's lynch him?
No,they may know something we do not(most probably they do).But they cannot come out and declare it in thread.
So they try to use non-existent town v scum argument to try and get their way.

Then do it better

[Atrahal]

Also, I think PS' allusion to dawn resolutions means that Ruse should have been silenced since the beginning of the day, but because the player doing the silencing didn't log on until what was partway through they day for most people, and had no provisional, they didn't get their dawn action in until then.

So our culprit may be someone who started posting for the first time today about the time when Ruse was silenced. Maybe.

[Telas]

Hey,I didn't do it.
PEOPLE did it.
But seriously, what did you expect them to do?Come out and declare they want a player lynched because they know he wasn't in their faction?
Oh,and what has amazed me is the lack of find contracts.Last game had a lot of those.
Of course, this maybe because of tiles not letting finds go through.*shrugs*

[Atrahal]

Telas, on 15 November 2012 - 01:12 PM, said:

Hey,I didn't do it.
PEOPLE did it.
But seriously, what did you expect them to do?Come out and declare they want a player lynched because they know he wasn't in their faction?
Oh,and what has amazed me is the lack of find contracts.Last game had a lot of those.
Of course, this maybe because of tiles not letting finds go through.*shrugs*

Yeah, tiles situation is my guess. Also, there's probably fewer finders in this game.

And no, I expect people to at least state that the reason they are hung up on someone is because they suspect that that person is not in their faction. But people like Spite haven't done that. "I'm suspicious of him" literally sounds like he thinks Tellan is a killer! And he might well have killing abilities but that's hardly the point is it?

But I concede you have a point, perhaps I'm being too much of an old grumpypants.

[Path-Shaper]

Atrahal, on 15 November 2012 - 01:07 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 15 November 2012 - 10:56 AM, said:

A word on timing & distance:

I try to resolve everything at the same time (end of the phase) unless they're actions that affect the player only, then they can be resolved immediately (and by the player).
I thought I had more or less taken care of this in design, and where it didn't, I more or less figured it would be OK.
Unfortunately, for some abilities, this isn't possible. I knew this: things that say 'until the end of this phase' kind of become impossible if you don't resolve them instantly - likewise, since 'dawn' is tied to 'first log-in of the game day' there will always be issues with dawn actions being processed after others have already submitted day actions/ done day things. Partly this can be mitigated with provisionals, but some things can't be. Turns out it is a tiny bit of a bigger problem than I thought.

I'll have to go through the entire design yet again for the next game, and remove these last bits, too. Luckily, less than half of the roles will come out of this game alive..... less re-balancing of what is already written.

Distance: good to know for all of you:

If you move from one tile to another, you are considered to be in both for the purposes of targeting others and being targeted yourself.

For example, say that:

Quote

player A is on the Mirror and moves to the Nepeth Barracks at the 5.34 timestamp. He targets player B with a Retainer action while on the Barracks.
Player B is on the Square of Camels and moves to the Road to Ishktar at the 5.36 timestamp.

For the purpose of resolving actions, Player A is on the Mirror AND the Nepeth Barracks. Player B is at the Square AND at the Road. Because the road is adjacent to the Mirror, the action will go through.
So, movement extends the possibilities of some of your actions, and also increases the chance you'll be targeted yourself.

Since movement is a use of your action for that phase, for the majority of you this will be a negative effect (being targeted more) unless you have a lot of Items/ Retainers, of course, so that you can target more people.

Do the timestamps matter? Sorry, I'm having trouble understanding. So, essentially, you can hit someone (or be hit by someone) two tiles away, not just one?

If you were at one point was at the same location/ only 1 location removed from him during that phase, yes.

[Telas]

What do you think about the price on that Doctor's Pupil Atrahal?
I sure wish I could buy it.