[Rodders]

Hi all, great book can't wait to start the next one, could you wise ones please help me iron out a few niggling little issues.

1. The warren that Topper accesses to take Paran to Malaz, the exit portal opens into the Empresses throne room (when he's on his horse). Is this not very risky as it is an option for any assassins for easy access (I hope i'm correct in thinking others can access these Warrens albeit difficult). It just seems a bit foolish, like she's asking for trouble, not what I'd expected from someone who assassinated her way to the throne.

2. When Paran enters the warren in the sword, after he has just ben saved by Rake (when he kills the 2 hounds). Why does Paran seek to free the souls of the 2 hounds, wouldn't this upset Rake, not sure why he would try this, it seems ungrateful on Parans behalf. It doesn't sort of sit right with me that he finds himself in that strange place and thinks I must free the hound's souls. Surely Rake would not be pleased and the lengths Paran goes to to try to free them. Is it a subconscious decision, as later in the book it hints at an affinity/melding betwen Paran and the hounds (due to his touching of their blood).
Also why don't the creatures in the warren try to smash the wagon to get free, the hounds managed to damage it trying to get to Paran,and as the man says 'there are dragons among us'. Maybe I'm reading too much into this.

3. Where did the fight take place with Paran, the T'lan Imass and the finnest, (when the Azath appears and attacks the finnest). I take it the the T'lan Imass was not Tool as Tool said he would not interfere.

4. I must say again that I really enjoyed the book, the build up was great leading to an almighty confrontation between Raest against the world. But it seemed to me, to be a bit of a cop out when the Azath turns up and snuffs out the threat. I hope this isn't a common theme. Major storylines converge, you can't turn the pages fast enough, must read every last word incase you miss a clue then just as the action gets going...... hey ho some Uber force/being turns up and 10seconds later thats sorted that out.

Would love to read your thoughts on the points that stick out for me,and hopefully you will put my doubts at rest. Thanks in advance.

[worry]

1. That is the Imperial Warren, and though you learn more about it later, for now you should know access to that one in particular is seemingly more limited than some others (in terms of natural affinities), and it has a special connection to the Malazan Empire. Nothing's ever that simple of course, but keep on truckin'.

4.The Azath thing seems kinda weird to most people upon first read, and then makes perfect sense as early as reading the second book.

[Roldom]

worrywort, on 09 August 2012 - 09:52 AM, said:

1. That is the Imperial Warren, and though you learn more about it later, for now you should know access to that one in particular is seemingly more limited than some others (in terms of natural affinities), and it has a special connection to the Malazan Empire. Nothing's ever that simple of course, but keep on truckin'.

4.The Azath thing seems kinda weird to most people upon first read, and then makes perfect sense as early as reading the second book.

oh yeah, many readers were upset at home much information was spoon fed about the azath....

alot of it is Read on and find out, but that was tool in the garden, theres a line in there where he says how upset he is with himself for finding out that he couldnt lay his ancient responsibilitys aside

[Rodders]

Thanks alot both of you, some things kind of stick out for me as I'm reading and because this is a massive series, I decided I would get involved and voice my thoughts and try and give my opinion to other peoples nigglybits.

Great, thats 1, 3 and 4 put to bed. I think I'll just phase out 2 (it happened like that, get over it man).

Thanks again for taking the time to reply.

[Kanese S's]

Rodders, on 09 August 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

Hi all, great book can't wait to start the next one, could you wise ones please help me iron out a few niggling little issues.

1. The warren that Topper accesses to take Paran to Malaz, the exit portal opens into the Empresses throne room (when he's on his horse). Is this not very risky as it is an option for any assassins for easy access (I hope i'm correct in thinking others can access these Warrens albeit difficult). It just seems a bit foolish, like she's asking for trouble, not what I'd expected from someone who assassinated her way to the throne.

As Worrywort said, that's the Imperial Warren. Not many people get to use it. You find out more about it later, but for now, basically you have to be in the Malazan hierarchy to use it. Also, Laseen (AKA Surly) is probably not that frightened of other assassins at this point.

Quote

2. When Paran enters the warren in the sword, after he has just ben saved by Rake (when he kills the 2 hounds). Why does Paran seek to free the souls of the 2 hounds, wouldn't this upset Rake, not sure why he would try this, it seems ungrateful on Parans behalf. It doesn't sort of sit right with me that he finds himself in that strange place and thinks I must free the hound's souls. Surely Rake would not be pleased and the lengths Paran goes to to try to free them. Is it a subconscious decision, as later in the book it hints at an affinity/melding betwen Paran and the hounds (due to his touching of their blood).
Also why don't the creatures in the warren try to smash the wagon to get free, the hounds managed to damage it trying to get to Paran,and as the man says 'there are dragons among us'. Maybe I'm reading too much into this.

How would Rake know that the hounds were freed? Maybe Paran is just a compassionate guy and he doesn't want the hounds to be stuck pulling a giant wagon for eternity, especially since it was partly because of him that they ended up in Dragnipur. Perhaps he just did it because it seemed like the right thing to do, that even if the hounds and he weren't getting along at that point, they didn't deserve that fate.

Quote

3. Where did the fight take place with Paran, the T'lan Imass and the finnest, (when the Azath appears and attacks the finnest). I take it the the T'lan Imass was not Tool as Tool said he would not interfere.

Hmmm, can't remember about this.

Quote

4. I must say again that I really enjoyed the book, the build up was great leading to an almighty confrontation between Raest against the world. But it seemed to me, to be a bit of a cop out when the Azath turns up and snuffs out the threat. I hope this isn't a common theme. Major storylines converge, you can't turn the pages fast enough, must read every last word incase you miss a clue then just as the action gets going...... hey ho some Uber force/being turns up and 10seconds later thats sorted that out.

Sometimes unpredictable and bizarre things happen. Also, that is exactly the kind of thing that the Azath would do. But no, not all the books end that way. In fact, most of their endings are quite different from each other.

[Rodders]

Kanese S, on 09 August 2012 - 10:01 PM, said:

Quote

2. When Paran enters the warren in the sword, after he has just ben saved by Rake (when he kills the 2 hounds). Why does Paran seek to free the souls of the 2 hounds, wouldn't this upset Rake, not sure why he would try this, it seems ungrateful on Parans behalf. It doesn't sort of sit right with me that he finds himself in that strange place and thinks I must free the hound's souls. Surely Rake would not be pleased and the lengths Paran goes to to try to free them. Is it a subconscious decision, as later in the book it hints at an affinity/melding betwen Paran and the hounds (due to his touching of their blood).
Also why don't the creatures in the warren try to smash the wagon to get free, the hounds managed to damage it trying to get to Paran,and as the man says 'there are dragons among us'. Maybe I'm reading too much into this.

How would Rake know that the hounds were freed? Maybe Paran is just a compassionate guy and he doesn't want the hounds to be stuck pulling a giant wagon for eternity, especially since it was partly because of him that they ended up in Dragnipur. Perhaps he just did it because it seemed like the right thing to do, that even if the hounds and he weren't getting along at that point, they didn't deserve that fate.

Quote

4. I must say again that I really enjoyed the book, the build up was great leading to an almighty confrontation between Raest against the world. But it seemed to me, to be a bit of a cop out when the Azath turns up and snuffs out the threat. I hope this isn't a common theme. Major storylines converge, you can't turn the pages fast enough, must read every last word incase you miss a clue then just as the action gets going...... hey ho some Uber force/being turns up and 10seconds later thats sorted that out.

Sometimes unpredictable and bizarre things happen. Also, that is exactly the kind of thing that the Azath would do. But no, not all the books end that way. In fact, most of their endings are quite different from each other.

Cheers for this, sometimes just another view from someone helps to shine a light on a scene and I can then think 'Oh yeah, I can see that' and that particular passage feels right after all. Just the sort of thing I was hoping from this forum.
My mind is now clear, on to book two.

[Kanese S's]

Great things are ahead. Also, things that will make you cry.

[tiam]

Ive read the book 3 times in the last few months and not once did i question the motivations of paran but all your questions are good ones. Parans subconscious link with the hounds could be a reason but as a favour to the stranger who he meets. Alot of the others have been covered and the rest are rafo but yes the azath is jarring. We still see a monster battle though.

[Rodders]

Thanks for taking the time to reply guys. Can't wait for these great things. Wow Jean-Claude, you've read it 3 times and recently. I too thought Paran may have freed the hounds as a favour to the stranger who saved him. The stranger mentions the hounds are too noisy and he preferred it before they arived. I guess I expected Paran to be too stunned by his surroundings to take any meaningful action. I thought the scene was brilliant, so creative, now that my friend, is a sword.

[tiam]

I was reading for the gotm quiz questions i have on another thread. Yes it could well have been a favour for the stranger whose name we arw not given though i do like the paran subconscious link theory tbh. Again rafo but also good questions though your azath and paran vs the finnest never really gets an answer othr than its a vague pocket warren related to the azath and isnt really important. Still good questions though

[worry]

Well the Hounds are actually so strong and wild that they are threatening to upturn the wagon, which would make it that much more of a burden to pull...it is definitely primarily a favor to the stranger. That said, it's not the only motivating factor for Paran, as you folks mention.

[A Demon Llama!]

2. Paran is just a nice dude and as worrywort mentioned, the hounds threatened to overturn the wagon, which would make pulling it more difficult

3. I'm pretty sure that Paran was sent was into Kruppe's dream. And yes, that T'lan Imass was Tool.

[Rodders]

A Demon Llama!, on 13 August 2012 - 06:05 PM, said:

3. I'm pretty sure that Paran was sent was into Kruppe's dream. And yes, that T'lan Imass was Tool.

What threw me about this was when Tool first appears he has his sword in one hand, so I imagined a 1 handed long sword type weapon. The T'lan Imass fighting the finnest was weilding a two handed sword and I assumed it was a different T'lan Imass. Of course you can just hold a two handed sword in one hand, I can see it now, but coupled with the fact he says he wont get involved, I just had an image of a different T'lan Imass. But it's good to be put on the right road.

[Kanese S's]

It could be a hand and a half sword.

[Kanese S's]

worrywort, on 12 August 2012 - 12:35 AM, said:

Well the Hounds are actually so strong and wild that they are threatening to upturn the wagon, which would make it that much more of a burden to pull...it is definitely primarily a favor to the stranger. That said, it's not the only motivating factor for Paran, as you folks mention.

I wonder if those within the sword would just continue attempting to pull the wagon while it's on its side, or if they'd attempt to right it.

[Rodders]

I wonder if those within the sword would just continue attempting to pull the wagon while it's on its side, or if they'd attempt to right it.
[/quote]

I thought they may try to break it open to see what was inside, I mean, they're already dead they've nothing to loose maybe even gain a bit of revenge. They could also stop pulling it altogether. It was just a very strange but brilliant concept, I can't wait to find out more about it in future books (hopefully).

[Kanese S's]

Ah, you'll see in future books why they don't do either of those things.