[PainBringer]

Hi everyone, I am new here. I have recently discovered Steven Erikson and his books - and since the first book, I have really enjoyed the series. Right now, I'm reading "Bonehunters". But one of the characters I liked the most was Trull Sengar. So, after I finished "midnight Tides" I made a few sketches featuring Trull. When it comes to drawing and illustration, I do this as a hobby - I do something entirely different as my day job. I published a few things here and there, but nothing too special. So after a bit of experimentation with haircuts and tattoos, this is finished drawing. Hope you like it!

[Sinisdar Toste]

wow! such an awesome depiction! i especially love the way you've done his features. the tiste are not human and shouldn't look it, so kudos on that.

[Puck]

I love the style, well done!

My only critique: that's the perfect Karsa Orlong, not Trull Sengar. For me, they're kinda on opposite sides of the spectrum lookswise.

[PainBringer]

Puck, on 28 May 2012 - 07:38 AM, said:

I love the style, well done!

My only critique: that's the perfect Karsa Orlong, not Trull Sengar. For me, they're kinda on opposite sides of the spectrum lookswise.

Actually, my next drawing is going to be Karsa

[Dolmen 2.0]

As grim would say : Holy linework batman!

Excellent, glad to have you on the forums!

[Abyss]

I like! I initially had a similar 'looks like Karsa' reaction, but the Letherii Edur are supposed to be barbarians and you really captured it, with an inhuman note to the face.
Trull is a spear fighter and likely the best of the best.... he SHOULD look like a badass.
The furs and stitched hides are perfect.
I like how the spear passes out of the frame, but might be nice to see more of it just to be clear on what it is. It looks like you had more detail there that was cut off.
The tattoos on the head and arm are a nice non-canon touch.

One thing the pic needs... Trull mentions more than once he has silly big ears.
Great work. welcome and give us MORE!

[PainBringer]

Glad you like it, people.
I have just realized that I have somehow missed that the Trull has big ears. Oh, well
I was thinking about who am I going to draw next - that will probably be Karsa, or maybe Greyfrog - because I have always liked drawing demons.

If you are interested, please check out my DeviantArt gallery, there is a lot of other stuff there (but not realted to Malazan books). The link is here.

[Puck]

To make it clear: my gripe was not about the barbaric outfit, it was about the fact that I can't imagine spear wielders having that particular body shape. Muscles come in different shapes and spear wielders tend to be lithe rather than heavily muscled.

That said, imagine Fear saying to the figure in the drawing:
'There is reluctance in you, Trull. You hide it well enough, but I can see where others cannot. You are a warrior who would rather not fight.'

Or Seren going all fluffy..
[…] Fear's brother, not Binadas, but the other one, who'd counselled reason, he... interested her. Physically attractive, of course. Most Edur were. But there was more. There was... intelligence. And pain. Seren scowled. She was always drawn to the hurting ones.

Or Trull himself going:
A pang of sympathy struck Trull, and he dropped his gaze, no longer wanting to witness his brother's discomfort. […] He was not unused to helplessness; some feelings one learned to live with. He had none of Fear's natural, physical talents, none of his brother's ease. It seemed his only true skill was that of relentless observation, fettered to a dark imagination. […]

Sorry about being a pain, but things are as they are.

Edit to make something else clear: I really do like your style, PainBringer. But the image and Trull just don't connect.

This post has been edited by Puck: 28 May 2012 - 04:25 PM

[PainBringer]

Hey, everything's fine. I completely understand that probably each of us imagines every character in a different way. I have many times looked at various character sketches/illustrations and sometimes - it just felt "wrong" (it did not match my idea of how that character should look like).
When it comes to style, a lot of the characters I draw are muscular. I just like it that way On the other hand, I can imagine him having doubts and questioning everything. I imagined Fear as even more savage - looking, more powerful, almost feral.

[Abyss]

When we first 'see' Trull in HoC he's been chained to the wall for a while, wasted and starving. Full of self doubt.

But the first visual of Trull in MT is this fierce barabarian Edur running along a seashore and stopping for lunch and then a quick massacre of illegal seal hunters.
I think the visual works just fine. It may not convey the character's inner turmoil, but it hits the right outer badass note that we see more than a few times in the series.

[Puck]

Oh well, I feel like I'm barking against the wind again.. I give up.

[Lizradusa]

I agree with Puck. When I look at the picture I think of Karsa, not Trull.

Never mind the babarian part, but a spear wielder is not a body builder and that's what Trull looks like in your picture, imho.

Here are some photos of spearfights: 1 , 2 , 3
Yes, I know that you can't really see their upper arms, but even so they do not look as overly muscled as your pic.

btw, here is one of my favorite pictures of Trull, which shows, that babarian does not necessarily imply havy muscles.

[Geer]

I agree with Puck. Drawing is excellent, though.

[Abyss]

Iirc, Edur are typically described as shorter and more heavily muscled than Andii and Liosan, so depictions of 'typical' spear fighters are limitted by being, y'know... 'human'.

[Lizradusa]

Abyss, on 28 May 2012 - 06:16 PM, said:

[...] so depictions of 'typical' spear fighters are limitted by being, y'know... 'human'.

No, they are not.
You have to assume some kind of muscles arrangement and those muscles will built through training. In the picture the muscles look like someone built up muscles for the sake of looks, but if you look at fighters or any kind of sports you will see that those muscles they use a lot are strongly built, while others are weak. Now depending on whether the muscles are needed for short burst of power like sprints or long endurenace like marathons, they are heavier or leaner, but never in a way that they will hinder themselves.
So the depictions of a typical spear fighter does apply for all sorts of humaniods, unless you assume a comletly different arrangement of muscles.

[PainBringer]

FOR THE LOVE OF [INSERT RANDOM GOD FROM MALAZAN PANTHEON HERE], THIS DEBATE LEADS NOWHERE!

Guys, this is just how I see Trull. That's all. As I wrote in my previous post, every reader will end up imagining his own version of the character. Yes, the writer may provide descriptions, but ultimately, the picture we paint in our head will not be the same. There would be at least some minor differences. The "most accurate version" of the character will probably be the one created by the artist who worked closely with the author.

I also love muscles for the sake of muscles - that's just the part of my style. It's perfectly OK if you do not like that style - I don't mind it at all, because I know that different people like different things. Speaking of muscles, wait until I draw Karsa Also, I never try to be completely realistic when it comes to drawing.

Personally, I do not think there is one true Trull (when it comes to his look). I also do not say that someone else's Trull is better or worse than some other Trull. This is just how I imagined him.

This post has been edited by PainBringer: 28 May 2012 - 07:54 PM

[Abyss]

PainBringer, on 28 May 2012 - 07:48 PM, said:

FOR THE LOVE OF [INSERT RANDOM GOD FROM MALAZAN PANTHEON HERE], THIS DEBATE LEADS NOWHERE!

Since when has that stopped us?

No, seriously, disregard the debate. We could probably debate relative musculatures of fantasy lit races into the ground without agreeing.

Even tho i'm right.

[PainBringer]

Good point. I'll listen to your advice!

[Lizradusa]

Ok Abyss, you got me looking for qotes about Trull specificly and Edur in general.(Thank you, Puck, for your help )


First of, the Edur are discribed as being tall and about the same high as the Andii:

DG p. 335

Quote

'Tiste Andii?' Gesler asked in a whisper.
'They have that look,' Kulp replied softly, 'but not quite.' [...] 'Their skins are grey, not black. Nor do they look very... refined.'
[Kulp] [...] 'But these are wearing skins barely cured. And look at their jewellery...' The four bodies were adorned in bone fetishes, claws, the canines of beasts, and polished seashells. There was none of the fine Tiste Andii craftwork that Kulp had had occasion to see in the past. Moreover, all four were brown-haired, the hair hanging loose and uncombed, stringy with grease. [...]
The old man moved past Kulp, crouching down to frown at the captain's face. The high cheekbones and angular eye sockets looked Tiste Andii, as did the man's evident height. Heboric reached out tentatively

MT p. 21

Quote

A moment later he (Sacbandari) sembled into his Tiste Edur form. Skin the shade of hammered iron, long grey hair unbound, a gaunt, aquiline face with hard, close-set eyes. A broad, downturned mouth that bore no lines of laughter. High, unlined brow, diagonally scarred livid white against the dusky skin. He wore a leather harness bearing his two-handed sword, a brace of long-knifes at his hip, and hanging from his shoulders a scaled cape â€" the hide of a Matron, fresh â€" the hide of a Matron, fresh enough to still glisten with natural oils.
He stood, a tall figure sheathed in droplets of blood, watching the legions assemble. [...]

HoC

Quote

Though the warrior (Onrack) was judged tall among his own kind, the Tiste Edur was taller, by almost the length of a forearm. The T’lan Imass had the man sit down on the ground, knees drawn up, then Onrack squatted and slipped one arm beneath Trull’s knees, the other below his shoulder blades. Tendons creaking, the warrior straightened.

MT

Quote

And, despite Tiste Edur blood coursing diluted in her (Sukul Ankhadu) veins, she was not uncommonly tall, which well suited her apparent vulnerability

MT p.41

Quote

There where warriors training in the compound, and Trullsaw the tall, broad-shouldered figure of his eldest brother, Fear[...]

btw. broad- shouldered does not equal heavily muscled.

Secondly about Trull

BH p. 647

Quote

" the Tiste Edur replied with a faint smile at the sapper, that damned smile, so bloody disarming that Hedge almost spilled out every secret in his head, just to see that smile grow into something more welcoming. Trull Sengar was like that, inviting friendship and camaraderie like the sweet scent of a flower

BH

Quote

another figure, stepping close, lithe and half seen.
A spear shaft cycled into view,
The Edur warrior now stood, spear held in a guard position.

RG p.340

Quote

[...] tears streaming down the Tiste Edur's lean, dusky face.

RG p.65

Quote

[...] Rhulad's brother. One of them. The one who had left Rhulad lying on the tiles. Young, handsome in that way of the Edur both alien and perfect. [...]

Nothing here suggest that he would be as heavily muscled as in the picture, but that he has a rather lithe figure.


Sorry if I'm to stern here, PainBringer. Please don't be scared of posting further pictures. I like your style, just not your interpretation of Trull.


Edit says that people want to close the debate, which is fine by me, but I'm still going to post this, now that I have written it all out.

PS @Abyss: winning =/being right

[LaymanK]

I think this is a terrific rendition of Trull.

Currently, I am working on a fan-produced Malazan Empire card game and if you'd be interested in contributing some artwork to it, I think your style is perfect!

Let me know,

http://cheekydingo.c...-card-game.html