[Sapper JHall]

I have to admit that I was confused with what ICE was trying to accomplish with his novels after I finished NOK about a year ago. At first I think I viewed them each individually as stand alone stories (which they are) but with barely any connection to each other. Obviously, this would be unlike SE because his work is collected into the Malazan Book of the Fallen. However, after finally finishing Stonewielder it clicked for me. Before I get into how it "clicked" for me I want to emphasize that it seemed that the majority of the readers of this book were very disappointed in the ending because it didn't answer a lot of the questions that were posed in the book. The most notable being the Stormriders (though I know there were complaints about other story lines as well but it has been awhile since I have been on these boards).

I could be dead wrong about this but this is just my intuitive reaction to how a lot of people seemed to be responding to ICE and Stonewielder. This may be plainly obvious for some of you but like I said this finally "clicked" for me after Stonewielder. It seems to me that ICE is writing his own Malazan series just as much as SE has done. He is writing a series as opposed to stand alone stories which is what I thought he was doing. It is my belief that the question of the Stormriders, in particular who or what they are and where do they come from, will be answered in one of the last ICE books.

Think about it...at the end of NOK we learn that the Stormriders are not what they seem. In fact we find out that they feel as threatened as the humans feel. Then we find out a little more about their history in Stonewielder but when we don't find out all of it people get very upset because they are not viewing ICE writings as a series.

It is obvious to me now that ICE is dealing with certain storylines and themes which are going to expand across the whole of his series ending in Assail. Many of you reading this may think that this is completely obvious but it seems that enough people were disappointed in Stonewielders ending that they either a) don't see the big picture or don't believe that ICE has one. Anyways this has been the forefront of my mind lately because in my mind's eye I can picture ICE pulling this off. Think about it. You have the mega-complex Malazan Book of the Fallen. Then interweaving in that series is another series revealing some things from the first but also with its own history and over arching themes and stories. I think the first we hear of the craziness of Assail was in Memories of Ice and that is where ICE is going to finish. It is just blowing my mind how well thought out and plotted this whole course has been.

Sorry if I am not being completely clear here. As I said before this may be self-evident to most people but I just wanted to mention it because it seemed that enough people were disappointed by the ending of Stonewielder especially in relation to the stormriders that I had to say something. I honestly think that we will find out all about them by the end of ICE series of Malazan books.

[worry]

You're right, I hope. It does seem like he's writing a series after all. But I'm not necessarily confident that it's not a little of both, and some things will remain a mystery (in a bad way). I think it's a legitimate worry that he's missing his opportunity to expand the reader's insight on some of the places and people, and might not revisit them. But I agree it's not a foregone conclusion, and he certainly might revisit some of these things before it's over, so I'm gonna give him the benefit of the doubt until it's over.

[Khellendros]

Essentially, exactly what Worrywort said above. I hope things will be carried forward, and there's a reason why ICE is being so cagey about things we thought would be answered in the novels already released, but a (significant) part of me fears it won't pan out like that.

I think the reason I fear that is because I've never seen this actually being billed as a series. Rather, I've seen it referred to as standalone novels designed to expand upon the Malazan universe. And even if we don't go by what's being advertised, and go by what's been revealed in the books thus far, there are still very few (any?) connecting themes.

For instance, in SE's series, even in the more standalone novels like Midnight Tides, there were thematic motifs that recurred across the series: Compassion; tragedy; the danger of certainty, etc.

And with ICE...what? What is it that connects the books thus far? I don't mean having a few characters reappear under different circumstances, but I mean where is the overarching span?

[Studlock]

I don't know about theme, but Assial looks like it could be a hell of a final. Honestly here about to enter a universe of wild mass guessing up to Stonewielder. Let's start with people or groups that have made two or more appeances in the four books, namely CG, Storm Riders and Kyle. The CG break into two, Iron Bars and co and Skinner and co. In Stonewielder we see Skinner steal a piece of the Lady/Cripple God/Baby Monster Thing. This is now a common motive for both the Storm Riders and the CG to hunt down Skinner and co, the SRs to destory the last piece of the Lady and the CG to kill/capture Skinner. Also chasing Skinner the Segluh two, another recurring group in ICE's play. Now what if Skinner ends up on Assial, here both Kyle is and the T'lann Imass and fucking human Tyrants. Malazans somehow get pulled in, mostly like something to do with the 5th novel. This also wraps up the Kiska storyline (unless it already has in the 4th book which I haven't read). And if add in the weird magebot things and how ICE loves to shoe horn Monrath into everything I think we're seriously under estimating ICE's plotting ability. He has left clues, as small as they are (or alternatively how delusional I am). The big thing here is in CG the FA are said to come from Wrecker Coast which is located on Assial, which would explain the Tyrant thing (voice) and would tie it into SE series by having the big bad the same. I can totally see how it all comes together into a big old battle. The main problem I have with ICE is that his books are so short, I could have seen this as another ten book series. I know some people would hate it but I see it way allow ICE enough time to explore each area.

P.S. My own little theory on the SR is that they were the original fisher people of the Korel and the tidal wave in the beginnig of the book was to show how the SR came into being (being corrupted by the CG chunks) and answer why they hate the Lady AND why they only attack Korel (because they only want their original home back and no where else). Haha it's a bit of a stretch but it works for me.

[D'rek]

The one thing that gives me hope that ICE has some sort of end-game in mind is that he has made veiled Crimson Guard = T'lan Imass comparisons in both RotCG and SW. That, combined with setting up the Disavowed as a possible final antagonist (or one of/part of) and the last book being on Assail, where all the T'lan Imass went... well *fingers crossed*

[huezang]

At the end of the book Dujek assigns the Bridgeburners to go back to Darujhistan and do whatever they can to help Baruk with a mystery man that has recently come under his service or whatever. Was he referring to Duiker's new person? In the afterlogue they own a bar and Duiker is there but never says anything until the final words of the book, so it makes it seem as tho that is who Dujek was referring to, but i dunno...was there someone eles I forgot about?