[gandrin]

I'm not flaming on the series by any means. I've read the first two and loved them, finished DG last night. I'll try to be vague enough to avoid any spoilers. I need a little faith.

I've been thinking about DG all day today and I'm beginning to wonder--was there a point to the story? The Chain of Dogs was amazing, but everything else seemed like it was, in the end, essentially pointless. Are these things going to have meaning later on? All those things that happened to the characters from GotM, a bunch of new characters, people get gifts that aren't explained or used, make decisions that seemingly complete story arcs.... ..... PLEASE tell me there was a point to it. I just need some encouragement. From my perspective, it's easy to think it was all a waste of time (theirs and mine).


As somebody who's lived through LOST, I think I have the right to know if there are important things going on, or if, for instance, Walt (from LOST) is just going to disappear next season (ie. later Books) and never be important again. Or will this be (forgive me, but it's a very good example) more like Harry Potter, where decisions and acquaintances made along the way will all have meaning in the end.

This post has been edited by gandrin: 27 June 2011 - 09:17 PM

[Aptorian]

Feel free to discuss anything from GotM and Deadhouse Gates in this forum. No need to worry about spoilers. That's what the forum is for.

There are some story lines that begin and continue after this book and there are others that are wrapped up.

The war against the army of the apocalypse continues in House of Chains. Fiddler and Kalam get involved. Various minor character from this book will get bigger parts in the next books. Generally, if a section of the book does not connect with the central story line it has one or two purposes. A) It is world building. It is showing the world outside the main setting. or B ) It is building up for later revelations. Erikson likes to take the long view in his story telling. There are character in DG that wont really come in to their own before Dust of Dreams.

But it's definitely worth it. This series is all layers.

[Seatiger]

Read on to find out

[Kanese S's]

Deadhouse Gates sets the stage for House of Chains. Felisin's story continues in that book, and the story of her sister, Tavore, comes to the foreground. Fiddler and Kalam are back in House of Chains as well. Icarium and Mappo also continue being important later in the series.

And, this may be bad news to you depending on whether you like the character, but Iskaral Pust also continues later in the series.

[amphibian]

I acknowledge your concerns as valid, but to my eyes, the Malazan books are not like the Lost series in terms of how they both end.

The conclusion of Lost pissed me off so much that I basically disowned it - despite a mostly fantastic series arc. With the Malazan series, I felt affirmed and very much still enthralled with the full arc and conclusion of the main series books.

[worry]

If your main concern is that the books are "loosely connected" by being in the same world and sharing a few characters, then you can be reassured that ultimately it is one long story with a beginning, middle, and end more or less. It's not just a collection of snapshots of the world. It does sometimes appear to be made like a patchwork quilt, but it forms a big picture, and events (such as Chain of Dogs) reverberate down the line.

[gandrin]

Ah.... you have all reassured me. I've avoided reading Wheel of TIme because of warnings of "filler material" that means nothing. I'm in the middle of Song of Ice and Fire (aren't we all) due to a slow author.... I got the sense that Malazan is NOT like WoT, that everything has meaning and is part of a big story.

Nothing during the story itself concerned me. It was the next day, contemplating the fact that Kalam and Fiddler took two immense trips, and realizing what it was they actually accomplished on those trips (ummm nothing?), and where they ended up at the end..... On the surface it looked like a waste of time.


I just wanted to make sure. Comments like "big picture" and "long view" make me anxious to get onto the next one!!


And Iskaral Pust??? One the most original and enjoyable characters I've seen in any book. I've been doing the "mumbling my secret thoughts" thing to my wife this weekend. What a riot. Glad he'll be back.

This post has been edited by gandrin: 27 June 2011 - 11:03 PM

[Tyr]

gandrin, on 27 June 2011 - 10:58 PM, said:

Nothing during the story itself concerned me. It was the next day, contemplating the fact that Kalam and Fiddler took two immense trips, and realizing what it was they actually accomplished on those trips (ummm nothing?), and where they ended up at the end..... On the surface it looked like a waste of time.

Thats what I thought. Chain of Dog's is great, Felisin's story is good for the most part, but everything else was a little bit "what the hell?" for me.

Pust was fantastic. So much better than that guy in GotM.

[Kanese S's]

gandrin, on 27 June 2011 - 10:58 PM, said:

Ah.... you have all reassured me. I've avoided reading Wheel of TIme because of warnings of "filler material" that means nothing. I'm in the middle of Song of Ice and Fire (aren't we all) due to a slow author.... I got the sense that Malazan is NOT like WoT, that everything has meaning and is part of a big story.

Nothing during the story itself concerned me. It was the next day, contemplating the fact that Kalam and Fiddler took two immense trips, and realizing what it was they actually accomplished on those trips (ummm nothing?), and where they ended up at the end..... On the surface it looked like a waste of time.


I just wanted to make sure. Comments like "big picture" and "long view" make me anxious to get onto the next one!!


And Iskaral Pust??? One the most original and enjoyable characters I've seen in any book. I've been doing the "mumbling my secret thoughts" thing to my wife this weekend. What a riot. Glad he'll be back.

Oh good.

Well, in addition to Fiddler and Kalam's journeys not being complete yet, one certainly should consider that the events they went through during Deadhouse Gates were probably pretty important to them, as characters, as people.

[Kanese S's]

Tyr, on 28 June 2011 - 05:14 AM, said:

gandrin, on 27 June 2011 - 10:58 PM, said:

Nothing during the story itself concerned me. It was the next day, contemplating the fact that Kalam and Fiddler took two immense trips, and realizing what it was they actually accomplished on those trips (ummm nothing?), and where they ended up at the end..... On the surface it looked like a waste of time.

Thats what I thought. Chain of Dog's is great, Felisin's story is good for the most part, but everything else was a little bit "what the hell?" for me.

Pust was fantastic. So much better than that guy in GotM.

I dunno, I'm more of a fan of Kruppe than Pust, though I find both of them highly amusing.

[Urizen]

Kanese S, on 27 June 2011 - 10:00 PM, said:

And, this may be bad news to you depending on whether you like the character, but Iskaral Pust also continues later in the series.

How can you not like Pust? He's one of the high points in the entire series. He's for more amusing and interesting than Kruppe.

[Kanese S's]

Urizen, on 28 June 2011 - 08:43 AM, said:

Kanese S, on 27 June 2011 - 10:00 PM, said:

And, this may be bad news to you depending on whether you like the character, but Iskaral Pust also continues later in the series.

How can you not like Pust? He's one of the high points in the entire series. He's for more amusing and interesting than Kruppe.

I never said I didn't like him. I think he's hilarious (though he doesn't amuse me as much as Kruppe does). Just some people I've heard don't like him.

[Kanubis]

I think you'll be fine gadrin. If you like Pust, he actually gets funnier in the next couple of books he's in.

As far as introducing an entirely new setting goes, it happens once more in the fifth book, but all three 'continent' storylines tie together. It's going somewhere, there's a definite destination.

[gandrin]

I just realized this morning that, for Kalam at least, his journey had drastic (good) consequences---he saved that army guy, who recognized "Jhistal" and (I assume) convinced his commander to stay behind and save the walls.

[Seatiger]

Been a while who and what walls are you talking about?

There are only 2 really high points ive seen where pust is amazing and I really would like to see him more active magicaly since hes clearly skilled. Otherwise there generally other characters I feel shine/stand out better as favorites.

Kruppe reminds me of the mages in a soldiers son trilagy by Robin Hobb (the more they ate / fatter they got the more powerful they got) and man he eats ALOT

[Jade-Green Pig-Hog Swine-Beast]

gandrin, on 27 June 2011 - 10:58 PM, said:

Ah.... you have all reassured me. I've avoided reading Wheel of TIme because of warnings of "filler material" that means nothing. I'm in the middle of Song of Ice and Fire (aren't we all) due to a slow author.... I got the sense that Malazan is NOT like WoT, that everything has meaning and is part of a big story.

If anything, I'd say it's the other way around entirely. While WoT may drag on a little, at times, I've never felt there to be anything I'd really call irrelevant to the story line -- everything seems to have it's own purpose and everything is connected with everything else, if occasionally in less obvious ways than others.

With MBotF, however, I feel that there are a lot of plot lines that get started but then trail off, especially as the series progresses and the main plot lines join together and become more prevalent, and then there are some plot lines that you thought were important but get put on the sideline to make way for something else. I find it easier to view the series (as mentioned a while ago in a different thread) as roughly three separate sections which (aside from the connections between characters and the main theme of the series) are mostly independent from each other.

It would be my opinion that if you want one main, obvious, consistent story arc, you're better off reading WoT (don't let others put you off -- it's a great series). If you enjoy reading about the history of a world (which is the best way to view this series, as opposed to a conventional story) that you wish to immerse yourself in, and you enjoy the digressing of story lines, regardless of it's apparent irrelevance, in order to expand your knowledge of said world, then MBotF is for you.

[worry]

I'm no authority figure at all, and have no power whatsoever to enforce any threat/whim/wish I care to make, but all that said, anyone who engages in a Pust vs. Kruppe debate shall be banned from the entire internet henceforth and always.

[sappers rule]

^{why we all know who would win in this titanic duel}

[Kanese S's]

I think both Pust and Kruppe are hilarious. Don't see why it needs to be a "versus" thing.

[Sinisdar Toste]

just to give you something to obsess over, guess which tiny scene in fiddlers journey becomes one of the most important events in the series