[caladanbrood]

Today has seen the first vaguely interesting piece of transfer news, with Sunderland accepting an offer for Jordan Henderson from Liverpool. It's thought to be around £20million. Two words... Massively Over-priced. He had half a good season, then what? I appreciate what Dalgleish is trying to do, with English players, and I think it can only be a good thing, but they're paying way over the odds for that sort of player.
What do the Liverpool lot think?

Also, any other good rumours you've heard? What do you think your team needs to do over the summer?

[Cyphon]

Ngog as part of the deal, and valued at 7 million. 7 million!?!?!

[Use Of Weapons]

If N'Gog goes the other way as part of the deal, then I'm happy enough. More excited by the news that we may be putting in bids for Conor Wickham.

[Cyphon]

He's valued at 15million.

I also hear 'pool going for Charlie Adam. Daglish trying to make the new spurs? Overloaded with central midfielders.

[caladanbrood]

Do you think he might go for Jenas? Please make it so!

[Tapper]

caladanbrood, on 08 June 2011 - 10:30 AM, said:

Today has seen the first vaguely interesting piece of transfer news, with Sunderland accepting an offer for Jordan Henderson from Liverpool. It's thought to be around £20million. Two words... Massively Over-priced. He had half a good season, then what? I appreciate what Dalgleish is trying to do, with English players, and I think it can only be a good thing, but they're paying way over the odds for that sort of player.
What do the Liverpool lot think?

First off, the price was that high because iirc, Henderson had a 5 year contract.

secondly, Dalglish is I think desperate to secure a deal early in the transfer period, both to satisfy the fans, to show he means business to agents and clubs, and to show he can secure young players and will give them a chance to play, too, that hopefully having an effect on other youngsters on our wishlist.
It is also a sign to those players that Kenny wants to dump: we've got new blood coming in, so you're not going to play, best tell your agent to start looking for a place somewhere else asap.
Henderson is basically a huge kick under the asses of Cole, Aquilani and perhaps also Maxi.

Also, there is the problem that several of Comolli's hyper-talented French prospects (M'Vila, Hazard) say they want to stay for at least 1 more season at their current club (which means you're going to pay anywhere between 3-10 mln more next summer), others whose names circulate in the rumor mill(Perotti, Mata, several Italians) are way too expensive or downright impossible to get for Liverpool - or get attention from CL playing clubs, who will be stiff competition.

My main gripe with the price we pay for Henderson is this: even if he proves himself worthy of the price tag, there is little profit to be made if we sell him to Chelsea in 2-3 years, which I thought was one of the other goals of the FSG, unlike for example Eden Hazard, our number 1 choice - his price tag of 25 mln could easily lead to a 10 mln profit.

Then again, Henderson's English so the price is inflated anyway, and with Ashley Young being more and more linked with United, Eden Hazard staying at Lille and Downing having a 16 million price tag or thereabouts and Liverpool needing multiple wingers, we could do much, much worse then Henderson... and even if he gets the salary that is mentioned, which is huge, it is always way less than what Joe Cole earns.

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Also, any other good rumours you've heard? What do you think your team needs to do over the summer?

Liverpool needs another (left) winger, another forward, especially if N'Gog is indeed traded for Henderson (and that would be good business), and I wouldn't mind a left side full back (although if Insua comes back, we may be more or less covered with him and Robinson). A centre back is welcome as well (Scott Dann is apparently on the list) but that also depends whether or not Kyrgiakos manages to talk someone into purchasing him, and Kelly's and Danny Wilson's development.

I don't think we need Charlie Adam. Lucas, Gerrard and Mereiles can all cover the defensive mid position and all three have more movement, and people moving into the box has been one of the most significant changes of Dalglish's takeover. I also hope we stay as far away as possible from Joey Barton....

I'd really love for the club to contract one massive international talent - the aforementioned Mata fits the bill perfectly and the cool thing with Spanish players is that if they perform well, you can sell them to Real or Barcelona for a massive profit after a few years (we did that with Alonso and Arbeloa already, after all).

Such a signing would mean to everyone that we look to improve on an international level - the signings we (are looking to) make are definately talented and/or good premiership footballers, but I doubt they'll make much of a dent with European football in mind for the 2012/2013 season.

[Macros]

well, if the total value of the deal is with ngog included id call that a 14m purchase, ngogs not worth 7 in my eyes, nor anywhere near it.
I'd love us to pull in a marquee signing but if had to take a left back and a solid youth squad member instead I will.
Never mention selling Alonso as good business ever again, or I will find you and hurt you.

I think the pool jumped the gun a bit, they stepped from 8.5 to 18 in one negotiation and finished at 20, Ithink with more careful work it coulda been done for 16.

Modric to united? Hopefully not. Rumours of Cole to spuds for 3m, take him
I can't believe I'm saying this, but i hope we keep maxi as a squad member.
Mirror yesterday reckons hiddinks gonna bring sneider in

[Cyphon]

Phil Jones to Man U for 16 million.

Not seen a tonne of him, but I think Man U have their replacements ready for Vidic/Ferdinand.

[caladanbrood]

Oh good lord 'arry, stay away from Joe Cole!!

[Tapper]

Macros, on 08 June 2011 - 01:05 PM, said:

Never mention selling Alonso as good business ever again, or I will find you and hurt you.

Oh, I agree that the sale hurt us more than it did good, especially as he left because Benitez wanted Gareth Barry. But, if we're going to be a 'buy dear sell for even more team', then you've got to eye the figures.

Spurs can have Cole for free,as far as I am concerned... the amount of money that saves per year will afford near an entire youth squad. Sneijder is also linked to ManU but the only reason why Inter would sell him, is if they have to raise 50 mln for either Tevez or Edison Cavani.

I have no clue why ManU would also buy Jones if they just bought Varane, but apparently the deal is (nearly) sealed. According to dutch press at the least.

This post has been edited by Tapper: 08 June 2011 - 04:23 PM

[Tapper]

caladanbrood, on 08 June 2011 - 01:20 PM, said:

Oh good lord 'arry, stay away from Joe Cole!!

Oh good lord 'arry, save us from Joe Cole!!

[Tiste Simeon]

I heard Man U are after Nasri from Arsenal...

[Macros]

I have to strongly disagree on this one Tapper.
Selling alonso and replacing him with Aquilani was dogshit business regardless of the figures involved. One could easily argue (given his influence in the previous season) that that bit of business cost us Champions League football. And that deal simply doesn't pay.

Jones is a done deal for 16, never seen anything of him, but hes being touted as a replacement for ferdinand, get that man a drug test dodging kit stat! I think the two big deals done so far reflect the ridiculously over inflated english player prices. Only a big team cvan justify them, to snatch a player up in the pre window to stop a mid table team buying the talent up with promise of first team on a regular business

[Tapper]

Macros, on 08 June 2011 - 07:35 PM, said:

I have to strongly disagree on this one Tapper.
Selling alonso and replacing him with Aquilani was dogshit business regardless of the figures involved. One could easily argue (given his influence in the previous season) that that bit of business cost us Champions League football. And that deal simply doesn't pay.

Buying an injured player who was not suited for Alonso's position and therefore planning to move Gerrard one line back was bad. Thinking Barry was better than Alonso was bad. Letting Alonso go was bad. It has cost us on the field, especially since the replacement was injured (and sucked).

But none of that detracts from the fact that when an accountant looks at the books, Liverpool made an €8 mln or thereabouts profit on Alonso.

And if the new fair play financial rules come into play, that is the way Liverpool is going to have to keep its head up. A 45k stadium, or even a new 55k one at Stanley Park will never allow Liverpool to get stadium profits like United.

As long as we don't regularly play CL (and even then there is a lot of competition to get in there, and once there, there are currently more appealing teams) Liverpool will never get the fanbase in new markets (Asia, USA) that Real Madrid, ManU and Barcelona and perhaps Arsenal currently entertain.

[Macros]

an million profit on arguably your most valuable asset (we'll take the stadium out of the equation, and the Torres 50m sale was over inflated due to january and ambramovich facotr) for an 8 million profit when it takes you out of a competition that can net you that from group stages alone doesn't balance the books, we will not agree on this.
I know what you're trying to say about buying and selling and financial viability but Alonso is the absolute worst example of this.<--- thats a fullstop It would be akin to suggesting United selling christiano for 23m would have been sterling work.

[Tapper]

Macros, on 08 June 2011 - 09:02 PM, said:

an million profit on arguably your most valuable asset (we'll take the stadium out of the equation, and the Torres 50m sale was over inflated due to january and ambramovich facotr) for an 8 million profit when it takes you out of a competition that can net you that from group stages alone doesn't balance the books, we will not agree on this.

I agree it was a very bad move, and I agree on the possible after effects in this case. However, Alonso was just an example (that we both pulled out of the context I tried to provide) of selling Spanish players back to Spain being financially profitable, in a large part due to La Liga's rules for squad composition.

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I know what you're trying to say about buying and selling and financial viability but Alonso is the absolute worst example of this.<--- thats a fullstop It would be akin to suggesting United selling christiano for 23m would have been sterling work.

I agree with you that letting him go was bad. I disagree that the end-result would have been so bad as it turned out if Benitez had found an adequate replacement that was slightly worse than Alonso but effective, and whose price also allowed him to invest another part of the financial gains in a reinforcement of another part of the team, but 'pool didn't manage that. Anyway, no crying over spilt milk.

[caladanbrood]

I've seen Phil Jones play a few times, and he really wasn't that great. Not even as good as Smalling, I don't think. Silly money.

[Cyphon]

Apparently Ferguson didn't want to move for him for another year, but had to push forward his plans due to other club's interests.

[caladanbrood]

Fergie does like wasting money on potential. Sometimes it works, like with Nani, but often it is wasted (Tosic and Obertan spring to mind...)

[Cyphon]

A £12m bid from Sunderland for John O'Shea, Darron Gibson and Wes Brown accepted? Sheesh, no surprises there.