[rhulad]

I'm glad to hear that Bleach is going away. It just keeps getting worse.

[QuickTidal]

A fellow Blogger has written up a Bonus Anime Wednesday post for us, about a show airing on Crunchy Roll. Enjoy!

http://icebergink.bl...d-reviewer.html

[LinearPhilosopher]

thoughts?

For those of you who are unaware, everytime an add on the above mentioned videos is watched, they get $.

This post has been edited by BalrogLord: 02 March 2012 - 05:08 PM

[QuickTidal]

BalrogLord, on 02 March 2012 - 04:56 PM, said:

thoughts?

For those of you who are unaware, everytime an add on the above mentioned videos is watched, they get $.

Even if this happens and the industry dies over here (which I kind of doubt), he's right in saying it will continue to exist in Japan, since it's a MUCH bigger industry over there permeating their culture to a much higher saturation level. It's fairly unstoppable as a source of media/entertainment. That said, IF for some reason more NA licensers close up shop or what have you, or even all of them do, then the media simply reverts to the way it was mostly when I was a teenager, that of watching subbed versions of the official shows, fansubbed or not where you can find it. The addendum to that being that in this day and age old-school fansubbing is entirely obsolete (video taped and tediously subbed by someone with an editing lab)...and replaced with sites like Crunchy Roll where a few folk with a Mac and Final Cut Pro can easily edit in subbing and there are literally HUNDREDS of shows to choose from, including the most current TV content straight from the Japanese companies. Therefore the fandom will never cease, and if the NA companies no longer support licensing and dubbing, then we simply have to become the type of ninja-anime fans we all used to be, finding it how we can, when we can...and those streaming sites will always give us the goods so there's no worry that it will always be fast, free and plentiful.

I'm not worried, and I take issue with the name of the video being "Anime is Dying". It should be called "Large American Corporations Lose Faith; Japanese Companies Reap The Winfall" and quite frankly nothing in that statement surprises me.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 March 2012 - 05:24 PM

[Silencer]

What QT said. And hell, bear in mind that we can actually buy the licensed dubs/subs here in NZ. In NZ. In NZ. If something is popular enough to warrant import to our tiny little utopia, how the hell can it not be doing awesomely enough to justify its continued existence overseas? O.o

[LinearPhilosopher]

http://online.wsj.co...4260925714.html

http://www.projectharuhi.net/?p=5053

http://www.cnngo.com...de-anime-682165

Because anime exploded oversea in terms of popularity it is now relying on foreign markets for it's continued survival. I woudln't be so dismissive of this issue. Fact is many great series were made recently due to foreign capital, and as someone who has an interest within this industry i'd like to see it continue to grow, not to slow down.

Those who listen to ANN podcats, the general consensus is that the anime industry both home and abroad is hurting, badly.

http://en.wikipedia....inancial_issues

Gonzo, one of the bigger animation studios had to re-structure itself since it went into receivership. Just a symptom of the problem at large.

This post has been edited by BalrogLord: 03 March 2012 - 03:52 AM

[Silencer]

Is there a general consensus as to WHY? /colour me curious...

[LinearPhilosopher]

Silencer, on 03 March 2012 - 03:45 AM, said:

Is there a general consensus as to WHY? /colour me curious...

According to those working in the industry it is dying. Hell anime giant bandai (the ones who produced the iconic Gundam franchise amongst others) discontinued its anime/manga division.

This post has been edited by BalrogLord: 03 March 2012 - 03:54 AM

[amphibian]

BalrogLord, on 03 March 2012 - 03:52 AM, said:

According to those working in the industry it is dying. Hell anime giant bandai (the ones who produced the iconic Gundam franchise amongst others) discontinued its anime/manga division.

So many things are hurting in Japan right now. The MMA industry just received a huge shot in the arm from the UFC putting on a show there (there's always going to be local kakutogi organizations in Japan, but they weren't keeping the scene alive in a way that shows continual improvement and future prospects). There's actually quite a few industry giants in all levels of Japanese business that are showing that they've cooked the books for a while or aren't doing as well as stated.

I seriously think something's up with Japan in general if the anime industry is tottering. Cartoon animation is perhaps the single best outlet for artistic creativity in any audiovisual medium and Japan has more than its share of hugely influential, awesome and/or popular animated shows. If that engine isn't generating enough output, either there's something wrong with the fuel source (pool of past, present and future artists), the engine itself (creating the shows, advertising them and finding the right time slots) or the output (the people watching them aren't paying attention, pirates are overbalancing the profit/loss ratio, the shows just flat out suck).

TV in general is tottering, with some giants falling, others cruising along and some rising, but animation should be a steady source of revenue + viewers. There's nothing coming out that's revolutionizing the mechanical/technical production of animated shows. It's basically finding the right creative fit - which is often a headache, but less of one when there's only one headache to be worried about.

[QuickTidal]

I simply think that the entire media/entertainment industry is changing. Due to our own technological leaps forward, and the rest of the world is going to have to lurch to catch up and some things will stumble along the way. We also have to remember the world-wide economy is still shit, that includes Japan...not to mention they had to deal with the nuclear thing, AND the tsunami.

That said, I am dismissive of it because they said the same thing about anime in the 80's...and then again in like 2003...like everything else, interest ebbs and flows.

[LinearPhilosopher]

QuickTidal, on 03 March 2012 - 12:38 PM, said:

I simply think that the entire media/entertainment industry is changing. Due to our own technological leaps forward, and the rest of the world is going to have to lurch to catch up and some things will stumble along the way. We also have to remember the world-wide economy is still shit, that includes Japan...not to mention they had to deal with the nuclear thing, AND the tsunami.

That said, I am dismissive of it because they said the same thing about anime in the 80's...and then again in like 2003...like everything else, interest ebbs and flows.

The anime industry, yes it subject to the same externalities as most other companies but those aren't the sole cause of the downtown. Much of it has to do with outdated business models that allow piracy to come in and deliver a better service free of cost. Japanese companies are still at odds as to how to deal with this. Hence why Bandai, anime giant that's been around for decades has discontinued its anime/manga arm. Whenver you have business cycles, its usually the small companies that go bust during the downturns, not the big giants. Its symptomatic of a larger problem. Anime grew to huge proportions during our decade, and now that bubble is shrinking back, to reach an equilibrium point. Now i'm doubtful the entire industry will go the way of the dinosaurs in a few years, but were seeing cutbacks to productions. That means very few risks being taken, and companies going bankrupt mean less anime, meaning the odds of getting a good series shrink even more. WHy do you think the majority of the new releases last few years, the majority of them have been moe/romcoms/slice of life series. Cause they're a safe investment.

This is a very real problem and i wouldn't brush it off citing previous precedents, that are in all likelihood not applicable in the least.

[amphibian]

BalrogLord, on 04 March 2012 - 04:18 PM, said:

WHy do you think the majority of the new releases last few years, the majority of them have been moe/romcoms/slice of life series. Cause they're a safe investment.

That's exactly why I think anime might be more of a dependable source of revenue than live action TV shows. All you need to do is get a good story with good characters, get your animators going and schedule it at the right time. You don't have to worry about casting, show-running a live production and dealing with the headaches that real people necessarily entail on top of making sure the right audience gets to see it.

If that base can be relied upon for a long while, then the experimental/better shows can be good risks for the production companies. That's why Bandai shutting down was a headscratcher for me. They're not Studio Ghibli - they can put out some mega-popular stuff and drive all the merchandising themselves and reap the profilts.

[LinearPhilosopher]

amphibian, on 04 March 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

BalrogLord, on 04 March 2012 - 04:18 PM, said:

WHy do you think the majority of the new releases last few years, the majority of them have been moe/romcoms/slice of life series. Cause they're a safe investment.

That's exactly why I think anime might be more of a dependable source of revenue than live action TV shows. All you need to do is get a good story with good characters, get your animators going and schedule it at the right time. You don't have to worry about casting, show-running a live production and dealing with the headaches that real people necessarily entail on top of making sure the right audience gets to see it.

If that base can be relied upon for a long while, then the experimental/better shows can be good risks for the production companies. That's why Bandai shutting down was a headscratcher for me. They're not Studio Ghibli - they can put out some mega-popular stuff and drive all the merchandising themselves and reap the profilts.

However live tv-shows in north america generally have much bigger budgets and audiences, same as the UK id imagine. They appeal to a far larger demographic. Not only that but most revenues from anime comes from merchandise, so its profitability is directly impacted by its ability to move merchandise.Also casting is still very much an issue, you can have great VA and still have a bad performance. (take the gundam 00 dub, it isn't until episodes 20~ that the main characters nail their roles.) And the guy voice light yagama was the one voicing the lead. Producing an anime while not having all the headaches of a live performance, does have many.

Ultimately the costs of an animated series are lower, but the people making anime also don't have anywhere near the amount of resources live tv shows have.

This post has been edited by BalrogLord: 06 March 2012 - 05:42 PM

[QuickTidal]

BalrogLord, on 06 March 2012 - 05:40 PM, said:

However live tv-shows in north america generally have much bigger budgets and audiences, same as the UK id imagine. They appeal to a far larger demographic. Not only that but most revenues from anime comes from merchandise, so its profitability is directly impacted by its ability to move merchandise.

None of this is true. Sorry Balrog.

I have family in Japan (being part Japanese) and have had various friends who have lived there over the years. I am informed by them: Anime is given almost as much respect in Japan as live-action stuff is, if not sometimes more (for example, Studio Ghibli...most especially directly Miyazaki stuff... is treated with nearly nation-wide holy reverence). The art that was the precursor to modern Manga and Anime goes back as far as the 4th century I believe. All the major dynasties have been very artistically minded, and modern manga is believed to have gotten its initial feet from pre-Meiji era painting and art, which had an exaggerated style and nature. It took the 1940's and post WWII Japan to develop it into what it eventually became, but there is no getting around the fact that art has always been a big part of Japanese society. In fact, the majority of things in the grocery store has some form of garish Kanji-oriented spalshy art on the package, and more often than not manga/anime-style mascots. Its ingrained in the culture. My one friend said that on any given weekend (throughout the year) he could wander by the local movie theatre and at least HALF the films playing were Anime.

As to TV...Case in point: Of the 6 major television networks (and their subsidiaries) 5 of them show anime on a regular basis at different intervals of the day, up to and MOSTLY including prime time. Now compare that with North American TV...where the only real place to view animation regularly (not including stuff like The Simpsons and Family Guy) is on specialty channels like Cartoon Network, Syfy or the like. The only time large banks of animation show on regular networks is in the morning (usually Saturday), and it is intended solely for kids.

In Japan animation has NEVER been treated as a child's medium exclusively. In fact, grandfather of Anime himself Osamu Tezuka said something like "In America, men like Walt Disney deemed that animation was a medium for children, and that's not something we do here in Japan".

So no, in Japan animation is treated as good monetarily or better than live action. The very first place to look at the difference...is on Japanese TV. They have drama's, comedies, game shows, reality TV and the like, but the saturation level is nowhere NEAR what it is for anime. You don't often hear about a lot of original live action Japanese programming, because it's slim pickings. In fact their biggest output is NHK's news service.

The demographic in Japan for anime is HUGE. Hell, my great aunt who ran a bookstore in Japan used to watch anime on a daily basis...before she passed away...and she was over 70 when I found that out.

I think that is key to the whole "anime is dying" argument (that I disagree with). American society treats anime as something for youths, or a niche geek market. Seriously, numbers for anime in theatre's here are low (which is why aside from Ghibli films you rarely see them released that way here), but if you compare them with Japan (for example, the first of the new Rebuild Evangelion films made upwards of 18 million in Japan box office, and the second made more than twice that at 40 million!) then I think you'll see what I mean.What's funny, is that if Anime is dying, then how does an anime film come out last year and make more than DOUBLE its predecessors money?

In Japan, Anime is treated as simply another medium (and a main one) to tell adult stories. Bandai is simply an example of a large corporation going under. It happens in this day and age. I would never equate it to "anime dying"...and quite frankly if that is your only example, then it's kind of a thin argument.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 06 March 2012 - 06:55 PM

[QuickTidal]

I'm at around episode 56 of ONE PIECE (I'm actually surprised I have gotten so far so fast)

Spoiler

and the whole story with Luffy attempting to see the spot where Gold Roger was executed, but running afoul of Captain Smoker was really well done. Up to and including another hilarious instance of Luffy stumbling and falling down awkwardly...only to decide to have a nap there. Every time he does that I chuckle. I can't help it. I also have a notion that the old man in the empty bar who talks to Luffy and tells him of Gold Roger's execution day is more important than we think. There are too many "knowing" type framed shots of his face to make me think he's just some innocuous one-off character...I could be wrong though.

Oh and what is up with that blue-haired girl who can handle a sword who Zoro runs into (reminding him of his childhood friend)? Who is she? I am very curious. Oh and probably one of my favourite bits so far was when the wepaonsmith guy confesses that one of the swords he tries to sell Zoro is cursed and kills anyone who wields it...only to have Zoro say "I'll take it!" Man, that was awesome.

I'm not too sure of the 2nd opening song ("Believe" I think it's called) since I loved the first one so much, but it's growing on me. I will be really sad when the ending song changes from RUN!RUN!RUN! as I have grown to really dig that one and find myself singing along more often than not.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 13 March 2012 - 03:29 PM

[amphibian]

Hmm... QuickTidal, WAFO (Watch And Find Out).

Trust in Oda, like you do with Erikson.

Also recognize that the Straw Hats haven't gotten into the Grand Line yet (the place where the main body of the story takes place). What you are currently watching might be the most delicious table-setting run ever made for television.

[QuickTidal]

amphibian, on 13 March 2012 - 04:25 PM, said:

Hmm... QuickTidal, WAFO (Watch And Find Out).

Trust in Oda, like you do with Erikson.

Also recognize that the Straw Hats haven't gotten into the Grand Line yet (the place where the main body of the story takes place). What you are currently watching might be the most delicious table-setting run ever made for television.

Absolutely, I think I trusted Oda completely at around the end of the Fishman/Nami arc.

Yeah, I can't wait till they enter the Grand Line properly, something I assume happens at the beginning of the second proper season (ep 75-ish?) as everything I've heard about it so far has intrigued me.

I'll keep dropping in with my updates on my viewing every once in a while.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 13 March 2012 - 05:15 PM

[Sindriss]

Yeah, do that. It is nice to hear how fresh eyes perceive OP, especially when you have reread the entire series 3-4 times by now.

This post has been edited by Sindriss: 13 March 2012 - 05:57 PM

[QuickTidal]

Sindriss, on 13 March 2012 - 05:57 PM, said:

Yeah, do that. It is nice to hear how fresh eyes perceive OP, especially when you have reread the entire series 3-4 times by now.

I keep seeing the manga at the store and I'm always tempted to pick it up as well...but I want to hold off till I am caught up with the show. It's tough though.

[powerclaw]

Oh man, such good reading here. Thanks for the look at anime in Japanese culture. I was always curious about how its approached over there.

For anyone who like me is from around Toronto, Canada: The TIFF (Toronto International Film Festival) is featuring a plethora of Studio Ghibli stuff this year. Just about the best so far thing to happen in Toronto in 2012 so far!

http://tiff.net/spiritedaway

This post has been edited by powerclaw: 13 March 2012 - 09:02 PM