[alt146]

Having a bit of a dilemma at the moment and I want to know what the rest of you avid readers think. I've recently gotten quite disheartened at the state of bookstores here in South Africa. Big name new releases (like Towers of Midnight for example) have crept up above the R200 mark and not-so-big name releases (like Stonewielder) take forever to get here. Add to that the fact that there are rarely specials and books that retail for a couple of quid in the UK still cost more than R120 on any given day. Shipping costs from both the UK and the US to here are ridiculous and can take 3+ weeks for the (no-so) cheap option, so just importing books doesn't work out that well either.

With all this in mind I am seriously considering going digital, but I have a couple of concerns. I'm ok reading off a PC/phone, so that isn't an issue (and I can probably afford a kindle or nook if I really want to), but I do still prefer hardcopy. Price and availability seem to be an issue though - the quick survey of books I'm planning to buy showed some cheaper as ebooks, some more expensive and some not out yet. My biggest issue though is I'm a pack rat - I have most of the series that I have really enjoyed in hardcopy on my bookshelf. It will annoy me not to have all the books from the series that aren't finished, but I also don't really want to have to buy each book more than once just to satisfy my OCD.

Any thoughts on the matter? Have any of you moved over to digital, and what has your experience been, especially with regard to SciFi and Fantasy titles? Anyone else overcome debilitating book-collecting compulsion?


And btw rule of thumb for exchange rates at the moment is R/7 for dollars, R/10 for pounds and R/9 for euro.

Edit - my other concern is DRM. Most of my books get read by my girlfriend and Pathos once I'm done, so it makes them a bit more worthwhile in terms of money spent. I also don't want to not be able to reread a book in a couple of years because I've changed computers or something.

This post has been edited by alt146: 23 December 2010 - 05:26 PM

[Astra]

Sony Reader PRS-650

ePub is rapidly becoming de-facto ebook format that more and more ebook readers support.
Kindle is tied to Amazon only.

Anyway, my opinion is only my. Go to Mobileread
It is the best of the best sources for information regrading any ebook reader or ebook format. No exaggeration.

[QuickTidal]

I love books as a physical manifestation so I always discounted the Kindle/Nook/Kobo eReaders....

Then I heard that there are other people like me who just find the ease of use and quick availability of books to buy and read invaluable....add to this the fact that you can LITERALLY carry your entire book collection on the device and have that at your disposal means you can always stop reading a crappy book and have an old one you love or a new one ready to go at your fingertips. That's impressive. It would also be great for traveling since it doesn't weigh too much...and if you are reading in your bed you can hold up a copy of THE WAY OF KINGS without it threatening to bust your arms off at the elbows.

Then I also think about it this way...I used to love having CD's and how they looked on my shelf...and eventually I got used to not having them and having digital downloaded albums from iTunes instead, and I really haven't looked back.

I am starting to think that I WILL switch over and get one in the next year maybe....but I will say this. There are certain books I will STILL buy from the store cause I don't think I'd be satisfied otherwise...but the eReader is a good idea for ease of price and use. You don't need to get every book that way, but it may save you if you do like half your books that way and save the extra funds for ABSOLUTE hardback purchases (ie. Erikson and Esslemont books)

[cerveza_fiesta]

I was researching this before xmas as a possible gift from my wife to me (she asked which kind I wanted)

And I came up with a few useful points

• Anything that says it has a colour sceen is NOT E-ink. It is like reading a phone or any other LCD screen...backlight, eyestrain.
• E-ink is totally sweet and very reliable from what I've seen.
• Anything smaller than 6" screen (which is roughly the size of a trade paperback page) is useless. I think Sony makes a "pocket" version of their reader at 5" and it is total BS.
• Paying extra for wifi and 3G connection is a huge waste of money unless you're getting your daily paper through it or don't own a computer. Seriously...think about how often you buy a book...then think about how often you "just have to have it" at a second's notice and can't just wait a few hours until you're home to DL it over USB. If your chosen reader has a non-wifi or non-3G version that's cheaper, go for it.
• E-books are tiny. Paying extra for huge amounts of built-in storage is not worth it.
• Not everything (especially a lot of older titles) is available in an e-book.
• ALL the readers use a DRM-managed format specific to their associated book sales service (amazon to amazon, indigo to indigo, barnes & noble to barnes & noble). All read the public formats (EPUB) except the Kindle, but a nook cannot read a kindle's file.
• There exist easy-to-use free programs to convert EPUB to any of the digital formats, so if you don't mind a miniscule amount of hassle, the Kindle's lack of EPUB compatibility is not really an issue. Remember, ebooks are tiny and take no time (basically) to convert.
• Wiki has some excellent side-by-side charts of the different brands listing features and supported formats. Check that out.
• Sony's bookstore has NOTHING in it for fantasy except the most popular titles and their reader can't use the other proprietary formats. I would stay away from Sony's reader in particular.

After my research was done, I decided if I was going to get any, it would be the base-model kindle for the reduced price and the fact that it has a keyboard. I do a lot of journal reading in my scientific work and it's convenient to be able to do word searches. I also like that it has buttons rather than a touchscreen...cause putting a touch screen on something you have to read from is totally retarded.

Not endorsing the kindle specifically for you, just saying what fit my usage and personal tastes the best.

This post has been edited by cerveza_fiesta: 23 December 2010 - 05:44 PM

[Tsundoku]

R120 = about $AU18 since we're almost at parity with the $US. That's cheap for a new release in MMPB here in Oz where only discount stores run that low, or the odd new release special, or maybe the 35% off at Big W, Target and Kmart, who only do the more popular titles. Most these days are $AU20-25. Consider yourself lucky.

I only buy hard copy, but then again I'm a notorious bibliophile. I'd only ever really consider getting digital copies for stuff I can get free (thank you Baen books), but I may get them in hard copy later if I like them, or stuff I couldn't care less about (unlikely). I just don't trust digital copies not to get fried by a hard drive crash, or have viruses etc. I need something tangible for my hard-earned. Maybe if digital copies were absurdly cheap ...

[Yellow]

I've had a PRS for 18 months or so, and am now determined to go electronic completely (apart from completing the series I'm part way through reading, which I'll still get in hardcopy). Run out of bloody space.

If cost is the most important aspect for you, I would go with the Kindle (bear in mind though that ebooks are not generally cheaper than paper). Amazon can drastically undercut the competition when it comes to the big fantasy releases.

If you want freedom of format and some escape from the Amazon death grip, I would recommend a Sony PRS. The epub format is pretty good, you can swap out data cards and once you've bought it you don't ever need to suck at the Sony teat again if you don't want to (unlike the permanent ties to Amazon that come with the Kindle).

Find some review and comparison videos on YouTube. If you can try before you buy, I would advise that. Waterstones sell the Sony so I'm sure you can walk in and give it a go. Probably the same with B&N's Nook. Amazon will probably laugh in your face.

[cerveza_fiesta]

Astra, on 23 December 2010 - 05:33 PM, said:

Sony Reader PRS-650

ePub is rapidly becoming de-facto ebook format that more and more ebook readers support.
Kindle is tied to Amazon only.

Anyway, my opinion is only my. Go to Mobileread
It is the best of the best sources for information regrading any ebook reader or ebook format. No exaggeration.

Are you sure...My reading suggested EPUB formats for the indigo and Barnes & noble e-readers are EPUB with DRM and that a sony reader cannot read them.

That's directly from the Sony site too.

The big sellers are NOT going anywhere near EPUB. They all have their own formats and DRM variations on EPUB and pdf.

EDITED based on other comments by actual users above.

UNEDITED the big sellers are NOT going anywhere near EPUB. They all have their own formats and DRM variations on EPUB and pdf.

Now I'm not sure.

This post has been edited by cerveza_fiesta: 23 December 2010 - 05:45 PM

[Yellow]

cerveza_fiesta, on 23 December 2010 - 05:40 PM, said:

[*]E-ink is totally sweet and very reliable from what I've seen.

This man speaketh the truth. E-Ink is another level above LCD/backlit screens (you can keep your ipad, thanks). It's hard to describe, but it's great for reading. It's like the words are printed on plastic rather than reading them off a screen.

Colour E-Ink is currently in development, but it's a way off yet (the latest gadget I saw on the web takes something like 8 seconds to change page) and current tech doesn't look great in terms of colour quality.

Personally all I would want colour for is to get rid of the "dark grey on slightly lighter grey" feel to current E-Ink. I would prefer something that looked like a real page (maybe slightly yellowed even!).

EDIT - on the subject of DRM, there are ways around that whole issue if you don't mind *ahem* sailing the seven seas.

This post has been edited by Yellow: 23 December 2010 - 05:48 PM

[Yellow]

cerveza_fiesta, on 23 December 2010 - 05:40 PM, said:

[*]Sony's bookstore has NOTHING in it for fantasy except the most popular titles and their reader can't use the other proprietary formats. I would stay away from Sony's reader in particular.

Waterstones in the UK have always been good to me. WHSmith UK also sell the epub format, but they don't even have an SFF section online. Dicks.

Don't know about other countries.

[cerveza_fiesta]

I got that info from the SONY reader forum after a few good hours of research. I thought EPUB was the same everywhere, but the more you research it (and they hide that information from you so you need to consult user forums) it's increasingly apparent that the "stranglehold" is not unique to Amazon. The other two major sellers I mention above have identical things called EPUB or PDF but with embedded DRM that lock the file to a single user.

One of them (can't remember which at the moment) allows a certain amount of "loans" before locking up. Indigo maybe?

I doubt any of them will ever go full non-DRM EPUB even if all the sellers eventually agree on a common format.

This post has been edited by cerveza_fiesta: 23 December 2010 - 05:55 PM

[zenMichael]

everyone else here has great points about the e-reader question in general, so just to add a personal note:

i thought the kindle was way too pricey, but really envied the e-ink thing (i have an astigmatism that makes reading on an lcd device for prolonged periods of time REALLY painful, so i've never had any interest in using a smart phone or whatever for that, tho I think it's pretty cool that they can). I got Kindle for a Christmas present last year & have totally loved it. And I wouldn't worry so much about format. I've gotten a ton of stuff not in Kindle format that I still just read pretty easily. As someone pointed out, there are ePub converters online & I use a small simple program to convert to mobi format, or just throw a .txt on there. I think most of the readers out there have a certain flexibility.

I'm still getting MBotF in hard copy as well as digital, but only because it's by far & away like my favoritest reading experience ever. I've over the past year sold/donated about 90% of my books (and holy crap do I have more than I realized) because I'm like ANTI-pack rat and hate having space taken up by things. So yeah, DRM is not that big of a deal since conversion is out there & fairly simple. Which one you buy is up to you (I love my Kindle but assume others are comparable).

Anyone know anything about Google Books? Supposedly it's going to revolutionize the industry and kill the Kindle (they'll pry it from my cold, dead hands!), essentially screwing over those of us with astigmatisms (also, 3-D movies don't work for me. So I haven't seen a new movie in like 2 years ...), but in theory it sounds cool.

[alt146]

Which ebook reader to get is a story for another day - I like the look of the Nook but the Amazon bookstore has a much better selection than Barnes and Noble anyway, both have applications for PC and android, so for now I will just use that. Like I said my main issue is the thought of not buying hardcopy, but the fact that I can have The Way of Kings for R100 right now as opposed to R220 next time there's stock is going a long way to making up my mind.

[alt146]

And I don't mind messing about with converters and stuff - fair use is fair use. So long as the authors get their money somewhere along the way, else I would just have torrented all the books by now

[cerveza_fiesta]

the converter I was referring to wasn't a DRM-breaking converter (though I'm sure those exist too.....probably within the same software)

It's more to convert already non-DRM stuff into formats usable by your DRM-only machine. I think Kindle is the only one of the major brands that refuses to do non-drm EPUB at all anyway....but whatev.

Also did not know Amazon has a better selection than Barnes & noble. In what in particular? For my regular authors, Amazon B&N and Indigo were pretty much equivalent. The only one that fails completely is the Sony store.

[Abyss]

if i were in the market, Warren Ellis sold me on Kindle and i do agree with his point that the wireless hookup is fairly essential so you can buy books ANY time, as opposed to just when its wired up to a computer.

[alt146]

cerveza_fiesta, on 23 December 2010 - 06:15 PM, said:

the converter I was referring to wasn't a DRM-breaking converter (though I'm sure those exist too.....probably within the same software)

It's more to convert already non-DRM stuff into formats usable by your DRM-only machine. I think Kindle is the only one of the major brands that refuses to do non-drm EPUB at all anyway....but whatev.

Also did not know Amazon has a better selection than Barnes & noble. In what in particular? For my regular authors, Amazon B&N and Indigo were pretty much equivalent. The only one that fails completely is the Sony store.

Maybe 'seems to have a better selection' would be a better choice of words - I searched for a couple of titles I am interested in an Amazon had more of them. A couple of the reviews I checked also seemed to indicate Amazon had a better selection, but I don't know what that is based on. Although if everyone else's experience has been that they are about equal then that is good news.

[Yellow]

cerveza_fiesta, on 23 December 2010 - 06:15 PM, said:

The only one that fails completely is the Sony store.

You don't have to use the Sony store, though. The PRS takes any epub (or lrf or whatever). At least, I've never had a problem.

[cerveza_fiesta]

Yellow, on 23 December 2010 - 06:24 PM, said:

cerveza_fiesta, on 23 December 2010 - 06:15 PM, said:

The only one that fails completely is the Sony store.

You don't have to use the Sony store, though. The PRS takes any epub (or lrf or whatever). At least, I've never had a problem.

Even from Barnes & Noble and Indigo?

Maybe they've stuck a deal for their newest firmware updates.

This one was as-of september 2010 and somebody was saying that they absolutely could not DL an e-book from B&N and bring it up on their reader. It was supported by other similar comments.

I believe you though if the PRS is all-good now.

EDIT

@ ALt146

I don't think it's as much about the seller as the publisher. The publisher makes the e-book or no-e-book decision for their own publications...so unless a publisher of an author you like is exclusive to one seller only, there should be little trouble in that

This post has been edited by cerveza_fiesta: 23 December 2010 - 06:32 PM

[Yellow]

Ah, ok, I've never tried to use B&N (never heard of Indigo actually). I know Waterstones and WHSmith work and I've bought epubs direct from a couple of publishers without issue, plus been given a couple from friends. I guess it comes down to the DRM.

[Obdigore]

I have Kindle on my Samsung Galaxy phone.

I was never a fan of e-ink as I wanted the physical book in my hand. After trying out the Kindle though (and buying a book for 3.99$ US for what was 15$+ on Ebay or Amazon because of its rarity, I really like it.

I bring my phone with me everywhere anyway, I can read the text fine with the e-ink, and since it is Amazon, I have faith that it isn't going anywhere and as I upgrade my devices I can re-dl (for free) any books I have previously purchased. That is awesome.

I like it. I bought Stonewielder for 14.99$ before it came out in the US. You can still purchase the hard-copies of books you want to collect the set for.

There has been nothing I wanted that is currently out that is not on Kindle. I actually got the new Cook book the Monday afternoon before the Tuesday it was supposed to be released on, which dosen't happen at local bookstores here.

I don't miss going to my library and re-shelving books every time I need a book to read, it feels much nicer to me to have them available on my phone, downloaded. I have 15 of them or so on my phone and they are taking less than 1% of system memory, much less my expansion card.

PS - I have actually been recommending these after being against them for so long.