[masan's saddle]

I just spent ages typing a response to this thread only for an error to occur, how very annoying.

Anyway it matters not as looking upthread Mac and SM have hit the nail on the head and covered pretty much everything I had to say on the matter.

One thing however, the star of this movie is the cgi so why didn't they spend a few extra quid on sorting out Rosie whasserface's footwear ? The wife and I counted 6 consecutive scenes where she went from 4 inch heels, to flats, to nothing, to something resembling cowboy boots etc etc. This little game was one of the highlights of the movie.

Oh and as to why I went to see it in the first place ? It was the only thing on that fitted into a time slot in my rather busy schedule. It was also the first time I have been to the cinema since I saw Inception !

I am disapoint

[Morgoth]

I was going into this thread writing a rather long and dull rant about the utter awfulness that was this movie. Thankfully Macros and SM covered everything already.

[blackzoid]

Its the difference between Batman and Robin and at least Batman Begins, possibly The Dark Knight.

The latest theme in the Transformers IDW comics is the idea that the transformers embody the concept of "change". (From vehicle to robot) Yet they have fought the same war for the same way for 4 million years. They are a contradiction. They cannot "transform" themselves in a thematic sense. Its an echo of the idea of the First Ones (Vorlons and Shadows) from Babylon 5 being locked in an ever ending pointless struggle. Its a gold mine of ideas that is being currently explored.
But do we get any hint of this from Bay? Not a chance. No money diverted from the special effects budget to the script. Nolan's scriptwriters looked at all the best stories in the Batman universe to help him with his films.
Bay? Fuck that shit he says.

Malazan fiction has often been alleged to be mindless Ascendent action/sword them ups/non-real deaths on other message boards.
We of course know that the themes of the Malazan sequence are deep and very emotional. They connect to us on a deeper level, beyond the DBZ-like action sequences. Its a case of looking beyond the surface level (The multiple re-reads are a goldmine for this)

Now imagine Michael Bay filming the Chain of Dogs.

Don't lie to me and say that he would catch the emotional depth. Don't lie to me and say that he would catch ANYTHING of substance from that story.

How would we feel if people claimed that Malazan is only about mindless action? (as has been accused)
Don't celebrate mediocrity. Demand excellence from the films you see. Even if you don't know anything about transformers and you only want giant robots beating the crap out of each other.

This post has been edited by blackzoid: 02 July 2011 - 02:27 AM

[Macros]

I will freely admit I have been drinking.
my only regret is that I cant rep sm's post twice.
so articulate and concise, I wish I could achieve such clarity without vulgarity and phallic imagery. but that just wouldnt jive, im a spade is a spade kinda guy



Yes people want to see the occassional mind dump action film.
die hard 4 was entertaining for me but lets face it, the plot was a bit over the top and the action sequences, and john's wolverine ability, obviosuly beggar belief.
but it was entertaining.
you know why?
characters were engaging
eveyone love john, end of
and comedy moments were well enoguh timed, if not operfect then enough to encourage a chuckle
this action film was shite because it tiucked none odf the boxesm, but tried.
if it hdn't tried, that would be fine, justmake it a robot gore fest, its the piss poor attempt at tryin to sell it as sometheng else that annoys me

oh lord

[QuickTidal]

Macros, on 01 July 2011 - 04:27 PM, said:

I sell the best fucking lemonade ever.

LOL. My lemonade fuels giant robots emotions.

[Beezulbubba]

If it's any consolation, Shia LaBeouf (who is one of the worst actors I've ever had the misfortune of seeing ply his craft), had sex with Megan Fox (probably the defacto worst actor/actress to appear in a movie that grossed over one million dollars) . . .. so there is that.

[QuickTidal]

blackzoid, on 02 July 2011 - 02:18 AM, said:

Its the difference between Batman and Robin and at least Batman Begins, possibly The Dark Knight.

The latest theme in the Transformers IDW comics is the idea that the transformers embody the concept of "change". (From vehicle to robot) Yet they have fought the same war for the same way for 4 million years. They are a contradiction. They cannot "transform" themselves in a thematic sense. Its an echo of the idea of the First Ones (Vorlons and Shadows) from Babylon 5 being locked in an ever ending pointless struggle. Its a gold mine of ideas that is being currently explored.
But do we get any hint of this from Bay? Not a chance. No money diverted from the special effects budget to the script. Nolan's scriptwriters looked at all the best stories in the Batman universe to help him with his films.
Bay? Fuck that shit he says.

Malazan fiction has often been alleged to be mindless Ascendent action/sword them ups/non-real deaths on other message boards.
We of course know that the themes of the Malazan sequence are deep and very emotional. They connect to us on a deeper level, beyond the DBZ-like action sequences. Its a case of looking beyond the surface level (The multiple re-reads are a goldmine for this)

Now imagine Michael Bay filming the Chain of Dogs.

Don't lie to me and say that he would catch the emotional depth. Don't lie to me and say that he would catch ANYTHING of substance from that story.

How would we feel if people claimed that Malazan is only about mindless action? (as has been accused)
Don't celebrate mediocrity. Demand excellence from the films you see. Even if you don't know anything about transformers and you only want giant robots beating the crap out of each other.

dude, WTF is this rant even about? When did Malazan books come into this discussion? WTF? LOL

First off, no one would choose Bay to direct something like a malazan movie simply cause it's just not his forte...he's action man...not subtlety man. No one would ever give him a movie like that, better yet he wouldn't choose to do that....you want proof? Go back and run the list of his movies....are ANY of them that style of story? NO. LOL. He does big, over the top action movies. Bringing that into your argument is just stupid brother, as no one was comparing the two.

and as to this sentence: "Demand excellence from the films you see. Even if you don't know anything about transformers and you only want giant robots beating the crap out of each other."

Can you see which finger I'm holding up? LOL. I don't have to demand excellence from films I see. Sometimes I watch campy bad movies just to see how campy and bad they are...and you want to know the difference between you and me? I can find the good things in those bad movies and tell you what I liked, and even find stuff to enjoy.


So don't sit there and try to tell people their opinion is shit and they should demand more. Do me a favor and don't act like you're some film aficionado that knows whats good and whats not cause as we established that's it's all subjective.

At least Macros and I have rival lemonade stands.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 July 2011 - 04:26 AM

[QuickTidal]

stone monkey, on 01 July 2011 - 08:08 PM, said:

quite hatefully racist.

Sorry where? what racism?

(Pssst, don't refer to Brains, the little transformer with the hair....that's Reno Wilson...he's African American and that's how he talks in most of his roles...or Dino the red ferrari...that's Francesco Quinn...and he's Italian and that's his accent)

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 July 2011 - 04:36 AM

[champ]

The films that Michael Bay has directed...

Bad Boys 1 & 2
The Rock
Armageddon
Pearl Harbor
The Island
Transformers 1-3

Um... Do any of these actually have emotional depth? Pearl Harbor to some extent but it's in the minority! Blowing shit up is his forte...

It's laughable if I am honest... I don't buy an apple in secret hope that it's an orange... what did you honestly expect to see in a Transformers movie, especially after the way the first two films were made?

Just enjoy them for what they are...

This post has been edited by champ: 02 July 2011 - 06:40 AM

[Morgoth]

The problem is even enjoying them for what they are. I really enjoyed Transformers 1. It was great, comic book like action with giant robots fighting and occasionally amusing jokes. Transformers 2 on the other hand was just awful, lacking everything that made the first one interesting. Equally, the third seems to be better than Transformers 2 purely because being worse would be impossible.

[Primateus]

I have to agree with Champ. Demanding or expecting more from Bay is laughable.

I stand by my argument that you would be a fool to expect more, especially from Bay.

And this is not Malazan. We ALL know that Bay would ruin the Chain of Dogs sequence.

Now, if someone like Nolan had been in charge of Transformers I'll readily agree that we should expect more. But from Bay? Like other people says, he blows shit up, he's good at that and I can enjoy it without lamenting the lack of depth or any real story.

Still, it's all subjective.

[Morgoth]

Primateus, on 02 July 2011 - 09:34 AM, said:

I have to agree with Champ. Demanding or expecting more from Bay is laughable.

I stand by my argument that you would be a fool to expect more, especially from Bay.

And this is not Malazan. We ALL know that Bay would ruin the Chain of Dogs sequence.

Now, if someone like Nolan had been in charge of Transformers I'll readily agree that we should expect more. But from Bay? Like other people says, he blows shit up, he's good at that and I can enjoy it without lamenting the lack of depth or any real story.

Still, it's all subjective.

You seem to be ignoring the fact that Bay has made good actions flicks that goes boom too. Look at The Rock, or Transformers 1 for that matter. Your argument seems to be that a Bay movie should not at all be rated but just watched for explosions. If you compare Transformers 2 and 3 to Bay's other movies they're also crap.

[Primateus]

I'm not ignoring them. I'm simply saying that, given his track record of not making great movies, you shouldn't expect Transformers 3 to be a great movie either. Sure, The Rock was a good movie, I'll even say it's his best. But is it a great movie? No! So whenever I see Bay as the director of a movie I immediately lower my expectations a great deal,by doing that I don't get disapointed (often, TF2 really was horrible)

[QuickTidal]

Primateus, on 02 July 2011 - 12:55 PM, said:

I'm not ignoring them. I'm simply saying that, given his track record of not making great movies, you shouldn't expect Transformers 3 to be a great movie either. Sure, The Rock was a good movie, I'll even say it's his best. But is it a great movie? No! So whenever I see Bay as the director of a movie I immediately lower my expectations a great deal,by doing that I don't get disapointed (often, TF2 really was horrible)

Indeed. And what has been argued so far across the board is how it's missing emotional depth ect, or (for some bizarre reason) how it's not TDK.

Look I like THE ROCK as much as the next guy, but is it a great emotional film with depth of character and well written script ect? Fuck no, it's a great action movie that really likes to blow shit up. In fact, believing that it has anything more to it really is just ridiculous. It's got a somewhat decent (but mostly crap) script, but one that was cobbled together by more than 3 screenwriters (one of which was an uncredited Quentin Tarantino)...and to be honest if you go and watch the movie again...it shows. You know why THE ROCK actually resonates with people so much? Both Sean Connery and Ed Harris deliver amazing performances...that's it. The film itself stands as a great 'splodey movie but not much else. It's pretty much meat and potatoes, and you guys are looking for french cuisine, for some reason.

This post has been edited by QuickTidal: 02 July 2011 - 01:41 PM

[amphibian]

I'm not sure where you guys are getting the racism from.

This movie is odd. The action scenes are very nicely done and are waaaay better than the first two films. LeBeauf is pretty good most of the time, Ken Jeong is brilliant, as are John Turturro and John Malkovitch. The girl is a total butterface and can't act - Bay screwed up with her casting (which shouldn't have been a difficult job to do at all). Dempsey is alright, but his character's evilness was odd (what need do Decepticons have for agents of any kind?). McDormand was cool and was that the Asian girl from Gilmore Girls as her assistant? Duhamel was okay. Tyrese was useless, even if he delivered the best line of the movie: "Because those assholes killed my friends". The story should have been at least a half hour shorter (cut Tyrese altogether, make the Shockwave/Driller big scene shorter, cut Megatron destroying the Lincoln Memorial as the symbolism went over almost everybody's head - including Stone Monkey's and Macros's etc.).

It has the goofy fun/action spirit of Armageddon and The Rock at times, but the girl is so bad and the story wanders a bit too much for LeBeauf & company to carry in full. The camera work was full out Michael Bay and the scenery/settings were absurd and fun in their own way.

I'd put it squarely between a B- and a C+.

Armageddon and The Rock are fantastic movies. Bad Boys and The Island are pretty good. This movie is probably the best of his remaining ones, despite Coyote Ugly being somewhat passsable.

[Macros]

I went in for meat and potatoes
But the spuds were blighted and the meat was rancid

[Macros]

I got the memorial part straight away amp.
One bit of symbolism doesn't save this train wreck.
Had the rest of the film been as smart and coherent as that one little scene it would have been good.
People seem to be missing my point. Yes its a stupid action film, which we all enjoy from time to time. It just so piss poorly executed that its almost offensive

[Bent]

So, I guess, I now have to go watch it?


Wasn't going to, but Macros really makes me want to find out who is the better reviewer here.

Wow, reverse psychology at its finest!

[Tsundoku]

Wow, you know what's funny? I'm agreeing with QT on a film. Normally we cross swords over them, but this time I'm with him.

TF3 had flaws. Dear God, it had flaws. But for me the good outweighed the bad, which was so very much not the case with TF2.

I had my moments in the cinema of going "WTF? Why did they do that? That's just silly!" etc (ask my friend, I was making her laugh more than the film at some points), but you know, it's what I do. It's part of my fun.

EDIT: want depth and darkness? Kill his parents. PLEASE! They are a waste of screen time, and I was snarling "Tell your mum to shut the fuck up about relationship drivel because THIS IS NOT THE TIME WITH DECEPTICONS ABOUT TO GO CRAZY APE BONKERS WITH A CHAINSAW!" Seriously, if movies could just get that bit right with a simple "Now is not the time, let's deal with it if we live," movies would all be better for it. I'd lose one of my main gripes, but I'm prepared to live with that.

On a side note: it may be blasphemous on here, what with the "Chris Nolan is a God, I will suck his cock" brigade we have here, I'll let you in on a little secret.

Batman Begins is NOT a good film. It's an OK film. As a comic book film it's better than average but as well all know that isn't too difficult."Why?" I hear you ask. Because not only did he manage to fuck up the Batman origin story (update it, bull-fucking-shit, he raped it!), but he fucked up the Ras al Ghul stuff as well. No, missing out the Lazarus Pit stuff was fine, no need for the supernatural here. He just turned Ras into a fucking pussy, not the mega-smart slightly delusional ruthless badass character we know him to be.

But that's just my opinion. Stop getting all up in each others faces about how you hated TF3 more than anyone else possibly could. It's like a pissing contest for an Impotence Support Group. If you suspected you weren't going to like it - you shouldn't have gone. End of fucking story - you only have yourselves to blame. I get narky about a film being below expectations (of variable amounts, to be sure), when it fails to live up to what I hear people I respect saying about it, or they were totally off track about it to begin with. When how shit it is SURPRISES me, I think is closest to what I'm trying to say.

And racism???? WTF???? Were we watching the same film?

Oh, and in the middle of one of the biggest, 'splodiest CGI wank-fests of all time - who the fuck looks at SHOES????

Seriously, some of you should really go off and watch wankfests like that Terrence Whogivesafuck "Tree of Shit" makes and them sit around and circle jerk each other. Then you'll be happy.

TF3 wasn't your cup of tea - we get it.

Jesus fucking Christ, STOP TAKING SHIT SO GOD DAMN FUCKING SERIOUSLY THAT IS NOT MEANT TO BE TAKEN SO GOD DAMN FUCKING SERIOUSLY!

/rant

Now I'm going to go back to downloading pr0n.

exeunt

This post has been edited by Sombra: 02 July 2011 - 04:22 PM

[Macros]

pron these days just isnt what it was.
Where the heart in it anymore, its all about the angles and money shot, I want some fucking depth to the story.
why is he trying tio stick it in her ass.
how did they meet? what was the first date like?
was their first time awkward or a drunken rampage the wrecked the bedroom?