[Mentalist]

yup

also, the Avatar was a Big Ben mechanic, he got taken over when Karat died.

thoughts on balance?

[bubba]

I thought it was good ment.

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 06 October 2010 - 05:12 PM, said:

A lot of people want to see poor Meanas dead

Barghast, on 06 October 2010 - 04:12 PM, said:

Let's go ahead and set up an action, just in case.

Kill Meanas, unless he's dead, then kill Ampelas, unless he's dead, then kill D'riss, unless he's dead, then kill Tulas Shorn.

noted.

Worried about the Eldar =)

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 06 October 2010 - 06:59 AM, said:

bah!
naturally, Gavin can never catch a break:

Kalse, on 06 October 2010 - 06:55 AM, said:

OK, I'mma think on my kill, but

Provisional Kill Barghast

Unless he is dead

Then Alkend.

Just for safety.

And sweet. Will make me hard to take out if I'm careful - especially if some humans knew of me, and aren't aware of my change, because that was a bit of lynch protection in itself.

sigh....

-ment

How did I survive NIght 1? You mention (but don't repost) a PM that Eloth is going to kill me and then Kalse is also going to kill me, so how did I survive?

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 06 October 2010 - 07:03 PM, said:

Poor Gothos;

Meanas, on 06 October 2010 - 05:25 PM, said:

Now today it's just getting insulting. What the hell is wrong with these people? This starts to look a lot less like a game of wits and more like a mass gangbang of wannabe sherlocks...

Hahahahaa, that would be an accurate description. Mind you, this is a really complicated, screwy and messed up version of the game.... so people look for slips, signs, and often misinterprete, or get things right or wrong for all the wrong reasons.

Sorry pal, I figured out you were Human before the vote but it was you or GL...

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 07 October 2010 - 08:12 AM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 07 October 2010 - 07:26 AM, said:

hehe, PB makes his move.

if he survives, it'll be..interesting.

Leave it to PB to hatch awesome plans - few think as far ahead and as clearly as he does. The problem is, few think about stuff as much as he does, or contingencies come into play, so he seldom gets it entirely together - see Spycraft 2.0, where he outwitted himself continuously.

- T.

I am the cat who continually chases his own tail... lol Once in a while I have moments of utter brilliance... and frequently otherwise, I out-think myself into a corner.

[Eloth]

Bah, you can't just add in that it can be brought to four, damn it!

[Barghast]

Meanas, on 07 October 2010 - 08:38 PM, said:

Aye I've been told to only visit on alt.
Anyway, seeing this here is VERY informative. I've obviously badly failed on my first game, in a very, very embarrasing way. Should've checked the unwritten rules beforehand, and I got what I deserved.
I still have to say I'm not completely satisfied with the game, in particular players' attitudes. It's like this so OH SO SERIOUS BUISNESS. Why all the swearing and rage? I thought this would be more civilized.
In any case, I'll keep reading this in real time as much as possible. Re-reading old threads doesn't quite cut it.

It's a pity my first game was the war40k one, unlikely the next one will be as well.

Hey man, I'm with you on the RAGE that some players show... but it's a tactic and a lot of people defend its usage. Not one I'm fond of, but you eventually learn to ignore it. Keep playing, everyone has good games and bad ones.

[Barghast]

Eloth, on 15 October 2010 - 06:47 PM, said:

Bah, you can't just add in that it can be brought to four, damn it!

Sorry! I had considered an outside chance Korv was the Necron and you had killed him but that still made you scum. Just seemed way too unlikely that two Chaos were in!

[Mentalist]

Eloth, on 15 October 2010 - 06:47 PM, said:

Bah, you can't just add in that it can be brought to four, damn it!

if yo must know, originally Avatar's VC was the same as the Necron's--last man standing.

one thing you've gotta realize: some of these VCs were contingencies, in case something unpredictable happened.

for instance, the Chaos win Condition was only put in place to account for one of them dying and the other one becoming a Demon Prince which would make it impossible to win via 5 possessions.

Seriously, I didn't think the FMs would get THIS unlucky.

Also, the "last in 4" had clear grounding in my head. imagine a scenario.

day ends with a lynch, start of night. 1 avatar and 3 others.

Avatar NKs 1. Next Day, the other 2 lynch him, his BP is gone. Nighttime, he kills another one. Next day, it's 1 v.1 vote night and kill the last enemy.

it doesn't work that way with 5.

the idea being, Avatar is BAMF, but he can't do it all himself. 4 seemed a more reasonable number, without even looking at your situation.

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 13 October 2010 - 10:02 PM, said:

granted, PB's pms are so numerous it's easy to lose his train of thought.

but i'm fairly sure at one point or another he realized that you were symping GL hard.

sure made it confusing to have you both get recruited on same night.....

Hey SIlencer, I was really going to go for Osseric but you had spent several posts offering GL up for a lynch, that I moved you from "possible recruit" to "unlikely." Sorry man, I know the whole distancing act but it looked like a false read to me.

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 14 October 2010 - 12:17 AM, said:

also, Eloth wants clarification:

Eloth, on 13 October 2010 - 11:24 PM, said:

Also you say he Eldar wins with 4 players left, but in the rules it says 5?

the 5 player rule applied to the original Harlequins.

I will take up the issue with Tapper, when he's around.

it's 4 for now, untill we get back to you.

-ment

Tapper, what do you say?
should we make it 5 or keep it 4?

-ment

I am kind of confused by this... the hidden VCs for the Avatar. How did that work exactly? Because if it won with 4 people left, then really this was going to be a Chaos or Eldar win on that last day.

[Mentalist]

Barghast, on 15 October 2010 - 07:42 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 13 October 2010 - 10:02 PM, said:

granted, PB's pms are so numerous it's easy to lose his train of thought.

but i'm fairly sure at one point or another he realized that you were symping GL hard.

sure made it confusing to have you both get recruited on same night.....

Hey SIlencer, I was really going to go for Osseric but you had spent several posts offering GL up for a lynch, that I moved you from "possible recruit" to "unlikely." Sorry man, I know the whole distancing act but it looked like a false read to me.

and in the end, that was your downfall... kinda sorta

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 15 October 2010 - 07:55 PM

[Mentalist]

Barghast, on 15 October 2010 - 07:48 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 14 October 2010 - 12:17 AM, said:

also, Eloth wants clarification:

Eloth, on 13 October 2010 - 11:24 PM, said:

Also you say he Eldar wins with 4 players left, but in the rules it says 5?

the 5 player rule applied to the original Harlequins.

I will take up the issue with Tapper, when he's around.

it's 4 for now, untill we get back to you.

-ment

Tapper, what do you say?
should we make it 5 or keep it 4?

-ment

I am kind of confused by this... the hidden VCs for the Avatar. How did that work exactly? Because if it won with 4 people left, then really this was going to be a Chaos or Eldar win on that last day.

very true.

like I said, Avatar was a contingency. I realized that the Eldar VC was very hard (the original, which called for them both to be lynched), but I liked the idea of paired jesters too much.
so I came up with the Big Ben-type Avatar mechanic. I think I might have lifted it from the Gozer in Yellow Ghostbuster's game, or maybe it was a pure BB.
point being, when figuring out HIS VC, 4 seemed a much more realistic number than 5, which is what the VC would be if the original Harlequin survived that long.
and, to be honest, I forgot to put the Avatar thing in the main rules post,

so yes, due to the fact that I didn't specify for chaos if it had to be day or night, it was coin toss between Chaos and Eldar in the end. If I made it more specific (as in, Chaos has to have numerical parity at the start of a day), then your recruit on alkend would've went through, and the next day would've had 2 'nids vs 1 chaos and 1 human.

but, I didn't specify that in the rules, so I had to call it for chaos.

[Barghast]

Path-Shaper, on 15 October 2010 - 05:32 PM, said:

I suppose I should call it now, despite the fac that come morning there will be two cult and one 'nid, no?


lol.
-ment

The VC didn't say anything about "in the morning" for the Chaos, so I figure it ended immediately when Eloth was lynched.

If you intended it to be "in the morning" then shouldn't I have successfully lynched Alkend? Since the recruit-proof was used up earlier.

[Barghast]

OK, I see that new post from ya, Ment.

Hey man, FANTASTIC game. Big mistake from me was not recognizing that GL wanted Osseric gone. I just was so damned sure Kalse wasn't a recruit I pushed it in the wrong direction. I wish Gavin had given us more direction. I'm also not sure why he tried to recruit Karat a second time... if he had ignored Karat, we may have had another recruit. I think they had a BP against my vig, but that would have been fine.

I'd say the balance was just fine. Bent REALLY screwed us badly by wasting his kill pointlessly and then disappearing to be modkilled.

Chaos winning seems so improbable because they basically did nothing all game other than survive and kill one guy! But hey, a win is a win, and they did fantastic.

No shame here, great game!

[Barghast]

Also, and I know you noted this to yourself, Ment, but I have personally found town-killers to be one of the worst possible roles for town... it's basically worse than an RI. They always cause more trouble than they help.

[Mentalist]

I believe I may have told him he was guarded, when he tried the first time.

[Mentalist]

Barghast, on 15 October 2010 - 08:02 PM, said:

Also, and I know you noted this to yourself, Ment, but I have personally found town-killers to be one of the worst possible roles for town... it's basically worse than an RI. They always cause more trouble than they help.

i noticed,

I felt the town needed more power, though.

in the end, not the best decision

although I stand by my 1-shot day vig, despite how Bent played it.

[Bent]

Heres my deal. I read my role as a once per day , day-killer. Working for town. When I blew my wad 2 hours into day one, and later found out that I was in fact a complete and total moron for not knowing how to read, I left the game. I did so for 2 reasons -

first - on day one I made a fool of my self in thread, on purpose, trying to draw night actions (fail!, lol) After I found out that I had only voting power from that point on, I realized that I would be too dangerous to be recruited, of FMed, or anything, because I was an obvious lynch target, later in the game. So I removed myself, as I had no way to help town other than voting, and thats really weak, considering it was multi faction, and eventually I would be the last townie left anyway (this is my theory and I stand by it)


Second - I was pissed. So much so, that I nearly revealed on thread, who I was, and what I had done, and why. This would have resulted in my mod kill anyway, and I think it would have hurt towns chances moreso because they would linger on the idiocy of what I had done.

So I faded away to calm down, and didnt log back in. I dont like being a whiney ass, and I certainly dont like shooting a vig 2 hours into day one, making it look like I need help wiping my ass after I shit my pants. So embarassment as much as anger caused me to quit the game. Hopefully I didnt do more harm that way, and I hope you all understand. Ment, sorry if I hurt your set up, or lowered anyones opinion of me.