[Weave]

Read a certain sentence that caused me to puzzle over this, as it's not specifically mentioned in the books (read uo to HoC so far). Asking in this forum as it's the most relevant to Kallor.

[Sindriss]

Afaik he is just a vanilla human with alchemies and recipies.

[iRFNA]

half human, half evil

[Silencer]

Specifically, Kallor is most likely to be a native of the continent of Jacuruku, which we see him destroy in the prologue of this book. So, human, but from a certain place (like being from Quon Tali, Seven Cities, or Genabackis).

[Ulrik]

He is Badass

[Dolmen 2.0]

A) he is from jacuruku

Spoiler

B ) so is Ereko sp?

C) so are the cabal of longevity/ ascension mad mages

D so are (I assume)the people who brought down the crippled God

Thus three core assumptions.

• Kallor is born from a particularily advanced race of humans.
  
  
• They are either generally long lived or generally good at alchemies i.e
  similar to the moranth
  
  
• They may or may not possess some kind of link to the first children of Wu...
  
  (*)His vendetta with the first thel might have something to do with his particular
  lineage

This post has been edited by Dolmen: 16 September 2010 - 09:17 AM

[Garak]

A bunch of loons brought down the CG in an attempt to rid themselves of Kallor (yes he was THAT evil).

[Aptorian]

Actually you have to think of the Kallorian Empire not just as Kallor but as a continent size empire with its own armies and navies and mage cadres. Kallor wasn't the only problem, he was the figure head of mighty military empire. Think of it like creating the A-bomb, they didn't develop it to kill Hitler likewise the CG wasn't being pulled down just to kill Kallor.

EDIT: Clarity

This post has been edited by Aptorian: 16 September 2010 - 09:43 AM

[HoosierDaddy]

If Kallor wasn't the problem, the solution was drastically overboard.

Kallor was the problem. Without Kallor, there is no Kallorian Empire that had driven people to such drastic extremes. It's why the Elder Gods were interested before knowing he had murdered his entire empire in a preemptive move.

This post has been edited by H.D.: 16 September 2010 - 09:40 AM

[Aptorian]

Okay, yeah, that came out wrong.

But we know practically nothing about Kallors reign or his empires power structure. I think it is safe to assume that he had a military/religious staff with dozens of very capable men and women under him.

This post has been edited by Aptorian: 16 September 2010 - 09:45 AM

[HoosierDaddy]

Aptorian, on 16 September 2010 - 09:43 AM, said:

Okay, yeah, that came out wrong.

But we know practically nothing about Kallors reign or his empires power structure. I think it is safe to assume that he had a military/religious staff with dozens of very capable men and women under him.

It's an interesting scenario, but posit this: Everyone was dead but Kallor. What power did he have to murder those who he could have ordered to murder everyone else?

[Dolmen 2.0]

H.D., on 16 September 2010 - 09:48 AM, said:

Aptorian, on 16 September 2010 - 09:43 AM, said:

Okay, yeah, that came out wrong.

But we know practically nothing about Kallors reign or his empires power structure. I think it is safe to assume that he had a military/religious staff with dozens of very capable men and women under him.

It's an interesting scenario, but posit this: Everyone was dead but Kallor. What power did he have to murder those who he could have ordered to murder everyone else?

I'm thinking it was alchemical genocide.

Again I stress kallors intimate knowledge of destructive
and restorative science. Perhaps kallors people developed the
malazan worlds equivalent to the Megaton Bomb( a moranth GTFO
bomb). they could Set it up near a few wards and he may have
charismatically gathered his entire empire together...
(well the remainders at the very least)...then blew everything sky
high.

I don't think kallor killed everyone single handedly. I think
He schemed it out as is befitting a maniacle megalomaniac of
Kallor calibur. Likely those who aided him stood no chance
against him. with Kallor its not really raw power but rather
raw malice that wins the day.

[Leanoric]

It's been a while since I read up on this, but I have it my head that Kallor had been using/rediscovering K'chain technology, and this is what he used to create, rule, dominate and ultimately destroy his Empire. Assuming he kept at least the best of this knowledge to himself, then Kallor himself really was the problem.

Or I might be completely mis-remembering. Can anyone verify this, or tell me how wrong I am?

Leanoric

[ShadowRaven]

Leanoric, on 16 September 2010 - 11:30 AM, said:

It's been a while since I read up on this, but I have it my head that Kallor had been using/rediscovering K'chain technology, and this is what he used to create, rule, dominate and ultimately destroy his Empire. Assuming he kept at least the best of this knowledge to himself, then Kallor himself really was the problem.

Or I might be completely mis-remembering. Can anyone verify this, or tell me how wrong I am?

Leanoric

I don't think it was explicitly stated anywhere, but while traveling in the Imperial Warren in DG Kalam & co find a pit with a rusted mechanism similar to those of Icarium. So it could be K'Chain tech, or just advanced machinery. Either way his empire was probably quite advanced in terms of tech.

[Abyss]

Kallor's 'just' human, but he's used alchemy to maintain his health and the EGs' curse keeps him alive.

The Kallorian Empire was all about Kallor, as was every other empire he ever started. Sure he probably had lackies, flunkies, filthy assistants, thanes, slaves, lawyers and so on, but ultimately it's all about him. He was no mere figurehead.

The Fall was the result of a cadre of mages trying to find the power to oppose him.

As for how he dust-busted his entire continent, unknown but we've speculated it was K'chain tech that he found, or that he worked som sort of really nasty ritual.

[Weave]

See i Seriously doubt he is human, took me a while to find the quote, but here it is:

Quote

Kallor shrugged. 'If that would help. More directly, however, you seem to forget my… experience. For all that I seem to grate upon all of you, I have walked this land when the T'lan Imass were but children.

Me ereader tells me it's 85.5% of the way through MoI, where Kallor is convincing Brood to allow him leave to ride to Whiskeyjack and Korlat.

He walked the land when the T'lan Imass were in their infancy as a race? A race humans descended from? So surely he predates humans.

This post has been edited by Weave: 16 September 2010 - 02:01 PM

[beru]

or he lied... ether way

[Gothos]

Or he's just full of shit in that sentence.

[Abyss]

Or it goes to the theory that neanderthals/Imass didn't pre-date homo erectus/humans, rather, they were two parallel races and thus Kallor, an 'ordinary human' could very well have had a massive empire while the Imass were running around throwing spears at furry things.

Plus, as Raest discovers when he wakes up, the concept of 'empire' is pretty flexible and the Imass First Empire was nothing like Dessimbelackis' human First Empire, neither one of which was actually 'First' in any real sense except their own egos.

By the end of MoI we know the world is hundreds of thousands of years old and all manner of civilizations have risen and fallen by the time Kallor is exaggerating how wonderful he is to Brood. We also know there have been at a minimum, 'Empires' of K'chain, Jaghut, Imass and human, al of which is to say, whether Kallor is full of it or not, there's no reason to think he's lying entirely.

- Abyss, ...Flintstones, meet the Flintstones...

[Weave]

I'll admit to being very hazy here, I've just REread the 1st 3 books in the last 2 months and yet I still manage to forget all but the biggest points; but is it not repeatedly said from different (i.e varifiable evidence) that the Imass has the 1st ever true Empire?
I agree that the KCCM would seem to predate theirs, making that statement untrue, but its mentioned more than once I seem to recall, which would seem to authenticate it's voracity.

I'm confused. Kallor seems human. But if he was, I feel certain an Empire of his brutality (EG ffs) then if current, the Imass would surely of given him some attention, so to speak. (or was this continent seperation?)

Edited to emphasise my own retardeness.

This post has been edited by Weave: 16 September 2010 - 02:45 PM