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Marcone SPOILERS up to / including CHANGES

#1 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 02:19 PM

View PostChaeone, on 07 May 2010 - 01:51 PM, said:

...also, marcone has a valkyrie on call, i mean seriously, thats gotta score him some serious kudos.



I always figured part of the deal with Gard is that if Marcone dies she takes his soul.

Marcone is too badass to let a little thing like death mess with his business.
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#2 User is offline   acesn8s 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 05:34 PM

View PostAbyss, on 07 May 2010 - 02:19 PM, said:

View PostChaeone, on 07 May 2010 - 01:51 PM, said:

...also, marcone has a valkyrie on call, i mean seriously, thats gotta score him some serious kudos.



I always figured part of the deal with Gard is that if Marcone dies she takes his soul.

Marcone is too badass to let a little thing like death mess with his business.


I wonder is Marcone realizes who Gard's boss is. :bs:
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#3 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 05:51 PM

View Postacesn8s, on 07 May 2010 - 05:34 PM, said:

View PostAbyss, on 07 May 2010 - 02:19 PM, said:

View PostChaeone, on 07 May 2010 - 01:51 PM, said:

...also, marcone has a valkyrie on call, i mean seriously, thats gotta score him some serious kudos.



I always figured part of the deal with Gard is that if Marcone dies she takes his soul.

Marcone is too badass to let a little thing like death mess with his business.


I wonder is Marcone realizes who Gard's boss is.


CHANGES certainly suggests he does.

Marcone's been in the loop on the supernatural for a while, to the point of even becoming signatory to the Accords and recognized as a player.

Plus Odin's running a business and Marcone is after all a (criminal genius) businessman. He knows what he's dealing with.
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#4 User is offline   acesn8s 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 06:38 PM

View PostAbyss, on 07 May 2010 - 05:51 PM, said:

View Postacesn8s, on 07 May 2010 - 05:34 PM, said:

View PostAbyss, on 07 May 2010 - 02:19 PM, said:

View PostChaeone, on 07 May 2010 - 01:51 PM, said:

...also, marcone has a valkyrie on call, i mean seriously, thats gotta score him some serious kudos.



I always figured part of the deal with Gard is that if Marcone dies she takes his soul.

Marcone is too badass to let a little thing like death mess with his business.


I wonder is Marcone realizes who Gard's boss is.


CHANGES certainly suggests he does.

Marcone's been in the loop on the supernatural for a while, to the point of even becoming signatory to the Accords and recognized as a player.

Plus Odin's running a business and Marcone is after all a (criminal genius) businessman. He knows what he's dealing with.


But does he really get it. I guess I'm focusing on Harry's meeting with Odin. Harry was shocked that he was dealing with "the All Father." If a wizard is surprised at meeting an honest to goodness deity, does Marcone really get it? I don't have doubts that Marcone is capable of comprehending the fact that it's Odin and yes he is a god. But does it occur to him to consider that fact or does he just think, "Boy this guy has a real Norse affectation."

I can't wait to find out.
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#5 User is offline   Obdigore 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 06:54 PM

I think Marcy Marc knows who is in charge at Monnonoc, and to a vanilla-ish mortal, there is no difference in the speed Odin or Dresden can destroy your physical body.

As long as Odin plays straight (not too up to date on that mythology, but I think he generally does), then they will continue their business dealings.

One thing I noticed as I was re-reading small favor last night... (SPOILERS FOR SMALL FAVOR)
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#6 User is offline   Imperial Historian 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 09:20 PM

Thorned nashed's coin .. the thorny hand sorceror dresden slapped around with his soulfire hand. That always interested me, as it was suggested that thorned was linked to the black council, and now odins come out for the grey council it makes you wonder is there a traitor among the valkries, or if one of marcones men picked up the coin.
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#7 User is offline   Chaeone 

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Posted 07 May 2010 - 10:48 PM

View PostAbyss, on 07 May 2010 - 02:19 PM, said:

View PostChaeone, on 07 May 2010 - 01:51 PM, said:

...also, marcone has a valkyrie on call, i mean seriously, thats gotta score him some serious kudos.



I always figured part of the deal with Gard is that if Marcone dies she takes his soul.

Marcone is too badass to let a little thing like death mess with his business.






marcone had Gard at his side well before he was a signatory of the accords, and seeing as he's literally got her as security i thought that was bad ass, not that he gets to command her about here there and everywhere, its cool in the same sense that owning an original star wars action figure still in its original packaging is cool, but its not gay cos its out of the packaging, its an original valkyrie, and it doesn't have tom cruise in its all star ensemble cast.

so do u mean this as in Gard is Marcy Marc's (who attributed Marcone the wahlberg stautus btw? if i knew who to attribute rep to i would) life insurance policy? cos that would be very very interesting. or do u mean that Odin will get his soul as part of the payment for services rendered? actually, thats also a very interesting idea right there.

Hehe, Marcy Marc, loving it. :bs:

This post has been edited by Chaeone: 07 May 2010 - 11:05 PM

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#8 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 09 May 2010 - 09:14 PM

If i recall my Norse Mythology correctly, souls gathered by the Valkyries went to hang out at a big kegger party in Valhalla until they were to be summoned for Ragnarok. I vaguely think the mercs Dresden and Gard see on arrival at Monnonoc are ref'd as these maybe. Point being a soul taken by a Valkyrie is going wherever Odin has planned for it, as opposed to the great thereafter. I wouldn't put it beyond Marcone to have made a deal that, along with her services as a bodyguard and consultant, if he's taken out, Gard takes his soul and Marcone has a deal in place for a new body or something.
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#9 User is offline   Sindriss 

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 08:29 AM

If my sleepy mind recalls right, valkyries only took the best warriors from the battlefields and sent them to valhalla, where they could drink mjød, have women and fight until ragnarok comes. Which is part of the reason that vikings were pretty scary i guess :kallor:

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#10 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 10 May 2010 - 01:56 PM

View PostSindriss, on 10 May 2010 - 08:29 AM, said:

If my sleepy mind recalls right, valkyries only took the best warriors from the battlefields and sent them to valhalla...



...and i could just see Marcone sitting down in front of Odin and saying 'Look, you provide a service. I am willing to pay you for it.'

Plus Marcone is hardly a lightweight. In DEATHMASK he confronted the Denarians more than once iirc, and he stepped up again in WHITE KNIGHT.
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#11 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 09:56 AM

One of Marcones greatest interests and assets seems to be information. I have no doubt that he knows quite a bit and Gards main job, besides magical security, is to serve as an advisor on the magical. Within reason, I think she provides him with all the information he could want on the magical world. As such I think that Marcone knows who Monoch Inc's boss is, but doesn't necessarily comprehend "what" he is.
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#12 User is offline   Animace 

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 04:37 PM

For me, Marcones storyline has been progressing towards a gradual, dresdenverse version of "ascension". Not anything too major, but him getting some extra status or mojo from somehow or somewhere (besides being a signatory, or maybe as a result)
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#13 User is offline   Aptorian 

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 04:39 PM

I think that one of the books will see Marcone dead and Harry having to figure out who done it.
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 04:41 PM

View PostAnimace, on 13 May 2010 - 04:37 PM, said:

For me, Marcones storyline has been progressing towards a gradual, dresdenverse version of "ascension". Not anything too major, but him getting some extra status or mojo from somehow or somewhere (besides being a signatory, or maybe as a result)


On a certain level this would make sense but i would be dissappointed - part of the awesome that is Marcone is that he's a 'normal' human, playing on the supernatural level with for the most part only human resources.
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#15 User is offline   Animace 

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 04:42 PM

Hmm, would be a great storyline, but he's such a major character to kill off. I always pictured Marcone there at the end, with Dresden or even being one of the final bad guys. Hes an unpredictable character, one of his greatest assets really.
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#16 User is offline   acesn8s 

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Posted 13 May 2010 - 05:12 PM

View PostAnimace, on 13 May 2010 - 04:42 PM, said:

Hmm, would be a great storyline, but he's such a major character to kill off. I always pictured Marcone there at the end, with Dresden or even being one of the final bad guys. Hes an unpredictable character, one of his greatest assets really.


How crazy would it be if Marcone ended up with one of the swords?
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#17 User is online   Tsundoku 

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 10:44 AM

View PostAptorian, on 13 May 2010 - 04:39 PM, said:

I think that one of the books will see Marcone dead and Harry having to figure out who done it.


Hmmm, I hope not. Gentleman Johnny is easily one of my favourite characters. Plus I think JB has already done the "attack on Marcone" thing. Still ... maybe an attempt on Marcone's life with him saved by Harry, or owing him big time would be very interesting.

View PostAbyss, on 13 May 2010 - 04:41 PM, said:

View PostAnimace, on 13 May 2010 - 04:37 PM, said:

For me, Marcones storyline has been progressing towards a gradual, dresdenverse version of "ascension". Not anything too major, but him getting some extra status or mojo from somehow or somewhere (besides being a signatory, or maybe as a result)
On a certain level this would make sense but i would be dissappointed - part of the awesome that is Marcone is that he's a 'normal' human, playing on the supernatural level with for the most part only human resources.


Abso-tively! Although I believe if Marcone could somehow get a powerup that he figured out wouldn't come back to bite him on the arse, he'd take it. Or maybe not so much a powerup, but an ace up the sleeve/ shaved knuckle like that discussed upthread is an interesting concept.

The reason he can compete on the spooky playing fields is his fantastic (juicy?) brainzzz give him the ability to conceive of possible threats or advantages, and either come up with ways to neutralise them or get them on his side. He is an awesome strategist. Like Harry's frequent references to wizards, I believe if Marcone has the ability to be aware of a possible threat, and the time to prepare, he could come up with some sort of plan to either win/buy more time/stalemate/find threat's weakness/etc.

View PostAnimace, on 13 May 2010 - 04:42 PM, said:

Hmm, would be a great storyline, but he's such a major character to kill off. I always pictured Marcone there at the end, with Dresden or even being one of the final bad guys. Hes an unpredictable character, one of his greatest assets really.


Yeah, as much as I love the character, much of the appreciation comes from the unpredictability, even though he is a self-confessed proponent of stability himself. Who knows where his strategies may lead?

View Postacesn8s, on 13 May 2010 - 05:12 PM, said:

How crazy would it be if Marcone ended up with one of the swords?


Wow, that's really a left-field one. Cool.

But with the example of Sanya, I think it demonstrates the possibility that for the Almighty, nothing is impossible when it comes to the desire for redemption. One more reason to love the unpredictability of Marcone is that I believe that is a very real - if lower probability - possibility. Simply because of the brilliant way he is written, I think we the readers would NOT be dismayed (startled maybe) if that happened, because JB wouldn't just pull it out of a hat, there would be some sort of leadup. A deal with Uriel or one of his ilk maybe? It's not beyond possibility that God will work through whatever resources he can find that fit the bill - even an atheist former Denarian henchman. Could Marcone fulfill the critical criteria (heh) of remorse/redemption? Anything is possible with a character like that.
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#18 User is offline   Abyss 

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Posted 28 May 2010 - 02:13 PM

As far as Marcone and the supernatural go, back in the early books before Gard ever showed up Marcone 'forced' a soul-gaze with Dresden, so he's been aware of the supernatural to some extent for a while. Since he got into the accords, i suspect he's keeping well informed, by Gard and other sources.

[quote name='Sombra' date='28 May 2010 - 06:44 AM' timestamp='1275043456' post='766464']
[quote name='Aptorian' date='14 May 2010 - 02:09 AM' timestamp='1273768759' post='760928']
I think that one of the books will see Marcone dead and Harry having to figure out who done it.
[/quote]

Hmmm, I hope not. Gentleman Johnny is easily one of my favourite characters. Plus I think JB has already done the "attack on Marcone" thing. Still ... maybe an attempt on Marcone's life with him saved by Harry, or owing him big time would be very interesting. [/quote]

I'm kind of expecting that the end point of Marcone storyline in the Dresdenverse will be Harry wiping out some massive big bad, turning to Marcone and saying something like...

"Marcone. Remember when i said i'd save you for last?"
"Are you actually paraphrasing Arnold Shwazenneger from 'Commando', Dresden?"
Cut to Harry's internal monologue: 'How, in good conscience, can you kill a guy who knows that?'




[quote name='acesn8s' date='14 May 2010 - 02:42 AM' timestamp='1273770721' post='760933']
How crazy would it be if Marcone ended up with one of the swords?[/quote]

Wow, that's really a left-field one. Cool.

But with the example of Sanya, ...[/quote]

Yep. Sanya was a frikkin Denarian and now he's a Knight, so anything's possible. And Susan semi vampire was able to use a Sword.

Relatedly i don't think we've ever seen Marcone use a sword or even suggest he knows how to. Not that i would for a second be surprised if he did, i'm just saying we've had no hint, as opposed to Murphy who is still being coy about the whole thing but was pretty clearly being set up for the role.

Hey, off topic but isn't that new FBI guy ('Tilly'?) character a fencing instructor too...? hmmm...


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#19 User is offline   drinksinbars 

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Posted 07 June 2010 - 07:47 AM

strangely in a few of the books i was waiting for marcone to take up the sword. especially at the end of turncoat i expected harry to bring the sword and see marcone take it up. despite his obvious evil side there is always a sense of code and honour about marcone and the man knows his business and has some serious faith in his own power and ability. he would be great as a knight!

This post has been edited by drinksinbars: 07 June 2010 - 07:48 AM

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#20 User is offline   polishgenius 

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Posted 21 September 2012 - 11:56 PM

Of course Marcone knows exactly who and what Odin is. He wouldn't be involved with him otherwise- his entire thing is based on always knowing what's going on. And playing vastly more powerful characters than himself like fiddles. He's probably the most competent person in the entire series so far - I'm fairly sure that the only reason he's away during Ghost Story is because he'd have solved the entire business in about ten seconds and we wouldn't have had much of a book.

If Bruce Wayne had taken up organised crime instead of vigilantism when his parents got killed, he'd have turned out a lot like Johnny Marcone.

Also: thread necro! Sorry, I was just browsing the forum randomly and this discussion caught my eye.
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