[Emurlahn]

Path-Shaper, on 02 February 2010 - 09:43 PM, said:

For clarification: No revealing whatsoever means no revealing.

See?

[Serc]

Lol, that's not really helpful PS.

I would say that Neo would not have to comment upon someone speculating about him being neo. He could simply say nothing.

Could you clarify whether that is correct.

Does the no revealing rule obligate neo to reply to speculation about his identity?

[Path-Shaper]

If asked, Neo has to say no. Under no circumstance can he confirm or even hint that he is in fact Neo - or the win goes to the agents. Neo is only obligated to not reveal.

This post has been edited by Path-Shaper: 02 February 2010 - 09:56 PM

[Serc]

Ruse, on 02 February 2010 - 08:05 PM, said:

Serc, on 02 February 2010 - 07:39 PM, said:

Nope, I'm not neo. I just thought you were being stupid. I didn't vote because scum doing that seems, at best, like a risky maneuvre on an outside chance of PI'ing themselves(scum wouldn't do that, and you weren't lynched for being neo...). Possible, but kinda unlikely.
I also didn't think you were neo because you seemed like you wanted a way to drop the issue quietly(with the stuff about dropping it if the mod clarified). So, I felt your play was certainly wierd, but not in a way that I could see being particularly worth voting for.

Can't say I like the "come on, just vote" stuff. Pressuring people to vote seems scummy to me.

Please stand by for an important announcement.

[rant]Not having a vote down to me is Scummy. This game(mafia) has gone to shit because everybody gets on and says....Durrr,,,,i won't vote now.....duurrr.I will wait until 2 fucking hours after day times out. FUCK....yes it pisses me off.The only people to benefit from no lynches is SCUM.[/rant]

now back to your regular scheduled game.

If everyone voted when they said they would there would be no problem.
If we were harsher on those who did not vote when they said they would, there would likewise be no problem.

Votes like this:

Omtose, on 02 February 2010 - 08:31 PM, said:

vote Emurhlan

Because he already has a vote and a couple more will pretty much pressure him into talking a bit more so that we can get a read on him.

Seem to be pointless to me. If they know you are only voting to add pressure and want them to talk, and not because you actually think they are scum, then it doesn't really add much pressure, because a lynch based simply on "Pressure vote to get him to talk" votes is fairly unlikely.

If you're going to vote to pressure a reaction from someone, surely you're more likely to get a reaction if it looks like people are voting them for an actual reason, not just to add pressure.

[Serc]

Path-Shaper, on 02 February 2010 - 09:53 PM, said:

If asked, Neo has to say no. Under no circumstance can he confirm or even hint that he is in fact Neo - or the win goes to the agents.

If asked, does neo have to answer though?

Edit: Just saw your edit. Presumably neo can say nothing then.

This post has been edited by Serc: 02 February 2010 - 09:59 PM

[Ruse]

Serc, on 02 February 2010 - 09:56 PM, said:

Path-Shaper, on 02 February 2010 - 09:53 PM, said:

If asked, Neo has to say no. Under no circumstance can he confirm or even hint that he is in fact Neo - or the win goes to the agents.

If asked, does neo have to answer though?

I think he could pretend to lurk, but I think this IS cleared up at this point.

[Serc]

Emurlahn, on 02 February 2010 - 09:39 PM, said:

if you start debating whether he would *have* to deny it or not Gem will just change the rules so you can't abuse that either, you know.

This seems about right.

Because as soon as someone comes up with an idea like "Ask everyone if they're neo until someone doesn't reply" gems going to stop that by making everyone reply.

Which is fair enough, since we're not meant to be trying to figure out who neo is by exploiting the rules...

[Olar Ethil]

Guys, if Emur's response doesn't look like a big giant "I'm Neo" neon sign over his head, I dunno what is. I realize Neo can't exactly tell us who he is, but he WANTS to be lynched. What can we surmise from that information?

#1 - He probably isn't going to vote, because every vote he lays out is a vote that is not on him and is more likely to hit an inno than an agent
#2 - He probably will act scummy and not really respond much to cases made against him... he'll probably do it subtly to avoid looking like he's trying to get lynched
#3 - He probably won't get anybody rushing to defend him

Now Ampelas has rushed a bit to defend Emurlahn, but Emur hasn't really offered any kind of defense for himself, has definitely acted a bit 'useless' in the sense that he hasn't offered much to the game (even when directed, he only comments on not offering anything without then going on to offer something). And he hasn't voted Omtose (the other main candidate at the moment) in an act of self-preservation.

IMO, it's the best lead and with the dwindling time left in the day, it seems a way better option than Omtose, to me.

[Olar Ethil]

That said, if Emur is Neo, he's doing a fantastic job of making himself lynchable without really breaking any rules, and I give him mad kudos for it.

[Serc]

Olar Ethil, on 02 February 2010 - 10:12 PM, said:

Guys, if Emur's response doesn't look like a big giant "I'm Neo" neon sign over his head, I dunno what is. I realize Neo can't exactly tell us who he is, but he WANTS to be lynched. What can we surmise from that information?

#1 - He probably isn't going to vote, because every vote he lays out is a vote that is not on him and is more likely to hit an inno than an agent
#2 - He probably will act scummy and not really respond much to cases made against him... he'll probably do it subtly to avoid looking like he's trying to get lynched
#3 - He probably won't get anybody rushing to defend him

Now Ampelas has rushed a bit to defend Emurlahn, but Emur hasn't really offered any kind of defense for himself, has definitely acted a bit 'useless' in the sense that he hasn't offered much to the game (even when directed, he only comments on not offering anything without then going on to offer something). And he hasn't voted Omtose (the other main candidate at the moment) in an act of self-preservation.

IMO, it's the best lead and with the dwindling time left in the day, it seems a way better option than Omtose, to me.

It's great Emurlahn comes on saying that we shouldn't really be looking for neo cause it's a waste of time and too hard to tell and your reaction is "I think Emur is Neo"

Anyway, I'm not really sure where you get some of those ideas.

Not sure about whether or not neo would vote. He's still going to be looking for scum remember.
I agree that he'll act scummy, but i'm not so sure that he'd avoid looking like he's trying to get lynched.
Number three makes sense, but then, most people won't get anybody rushing to defend them. The fact that no-one is rushing to defend him doesn't really tell us much. In fact, even the people who know others aren't very likely to be defending them.

[Olar Ethil]

/shrug, Dunno what you think constitutes a good case then, Serc. You have pretty much done nothing but argue with Omtose and today you're fishing from PS for info on-thread in an attempt to make you look more inno.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 1. 2 hours and 35 minutes remaining
11 Players still alive: Ampelas, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn, Gamelon, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Ruse, Serc, Tulas Shorn

6 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

3 Votes for Emurlahn ( Olar Ethil, Omtose, Tulas Shorn )
3 Votes for Omtose ( Ruse, Barghast, D'riss )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Emurlahn, Gamelon, Osseric, Serc

[Emurlahn]

No no no no a thousand times no.

Vote Omtose

[Path-Shaper]

11 Players still alive: Ampelas, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn, Gamelon, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Ruse, Serc, Tulas Shorn

6 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

4 Votes for Omtose ( Ruse, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn )
3 Votes for Emurlahn ( Olar Ethil, Omtose, Tulas Shorn )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Gamelon, Osseric, Serc

[Serc]

Olar Ethil, on 02 February 2010 - 10:23 PM, said:

/shrug, Dunno what you think constitutes a good case then, Serc. You have pretty much done nothing but argue with Omtose and today you're fishing from PS for info on-thread in an attempt to make you look more inno.

To me the reasoning behind it just seems very weak.

The first point, that neo wouldn't vote, really is something we have no way of telling.
The second, that he wouldn't look like he's trying to get lynched, doesn't make that much sense to me. I mean, surely if he looks like he wants lynched, it's quite likely that we're going to lynch him, as opposed to us deciding that, you know, he looks like he wants to be lynched so lets not do that. So, why wouldn't he? Unless you think that it would be against the rules?
The third, that no one is strongly defending him, tells us nothing, because it's not likely that anyone is going to be strongly defending anyone else.

I like how you've decided to attack me just for disagreeing with your reasoning though.

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 1. 2 hours and 22 minutes remaining
11 Players still alive: Ampelas, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn, Gamelon, Olar Ethil, Omtose, Osseric, Ruse, Serc, Tulas Shorn

6 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

4 Votes for Omtose ( Ruse, Barghast, D'riss, Emurlahn )
3 Votes for Emurlahn ( Olar Ethil, Omtose, Tulas Shorn )

Players not voted: Ampelas, Gamelon, Osseric, Serc

[Emurlahn]

Serc, on 02 February 2010 - 10:31 PM, said:

Olar Ethil, on 02 February 2010 - 10:23 PM, said:

/shrug, Dunno what you think constitutes a good case then, Serc. You have pretty much done nothing but argue with Omtose and today you're fishing from PS for info on-thread in an attempt to make you look more inno.

To me the reasoning behind it just seems very weak.

The first point, that neo wouldn't vote, really is something we have no way of telling.
The second, that he wouldn't look like he's trying to get lynched, doesn't make that much sense to me. I mean, surely if he looks like he wants lynched, it's quite likely that we're going to lynch him, as opposed to us deciding that, you know, he looks like he wants to be lynched so lets not do that. So, why wouldn't he? Unless you think that it would be against the rules?
The third, that no one is strongly defending him, tells us nothing, because it's not likely that anyone is going to be strongly defending anyone else.

I like how you've decided to attack me just for disagreeing with your reasoning though.

I have the succint feeling that this is really starting to go nowhere...

[Olar Ethil]

There's such little time left today, I don't really see the point in arguing with me, Serc. Neither one of us is getting lynched. I voted for the best possible candidate and several people currently agree with me. If you don't agree, then make a case and vote, don't waste your breath saber rattling.

[Ruse]

I think if we do lynch Omtose and he comes up as an agent, we will want to take a much closer look at Tulas. Going over the posts I see that he was the last to place a vote on Omtose(with assurances he could take it off in time)then he removes it anyway. Then I see Omtose placed a vote on tulas for a short time before removing it also. I think they may doing the dance of distances. Just an observation.

[Olar Ethil]

If that happens, I'll probably be the first vote on Tulas.