[Sukul Ankhadu]

I can´'t really be mad at you for being wrong, your avatar is too cute.

[Sukul Ankhadu]

I'm considering the possibility that Korbas and Ruse is fake symping Lio to divert attention from the Spite case. Can't imagine why though, since I didn't get the Spite case the first time around.

[Telas]

This to me screamed distancing.

Meanas, on 10 February 2010 - 03:42 PM, said:

I'd also like to state that I do, otherwise, agree with the sentiment that Spite is the most likely person to be on Ano's faction, and thus the least likely to be on mine, but I know the pain of being in a leaderless faction all too well and it is NOT easy to win.

edit: Fix'd

Although thats not quite enough going through his posts i think he was the first in the new day to suggest Spite as an Ano but he then went on to push for the leader lynch, and voted for Liosan as a low poster. To me this definitely suggests that he put out spite as a symp because people were going to go for him, so he might as well put him out in the spotlight and then move it off of him onto other people so as to not leave suspicion on either him or Spite.

So yeah, Spite could be Meanas' master but im not that sure about it.

[Korbas]

Sukul Ankhadu, on 11 February 2010 - 10:02 PM, said:

I'm considering the possibility that Korbas and Ruse is fake symping Lio to divert attention from the Spite case. Can't imagine why though, since I didn't get the Spite case the first time around.

What about the possibility that Meanas made his case to do so?

I mean, he's now voted Spite, but Spite doens't seem that likely a lynch now what with all the discussion centred around Meanas' reveal, so it's an easy distance vote to throw on, and he even says that he's voting Spite to prove that he's not his symp.

[Telas]

and with that , im out nowbut there's plenty of time left so il see if more comes to light to connect either Sukul and Omtose or SPite and Meanas.

[Telas]

oh and id just like to say that that Spite vote form Meanas just doesnt seem sincere at all, with the tag "because people think im symping him" ...

[Sukul Ankhadu]

It's funny Telas, yesterday I connected you and Meanas - as being in the same team - in my mind, but now that doesn't seem right either.

There's no connection between me and Omtose, but there's a possible connection between Spite and Omtose, maybe even Meanas and Omtose. I don't think both is possible simultaneously though.

Edit: even if Omtose could be my team mate, but he's not my leader that's for sure (duh).

This post has been edited by Sukul Ankhadu: 11 February 2010 - 10:27 PM

[Ruse]

Sukul Ankhadu, on 11 February 2010 - 10:02 PM, said:

I'm considering the possibility that Korbas and Ruse is fake symping Lio to divert attention from the Spite case. Can't imagine why though, since I didn't get the Spite case the first time around.

Why would I be diverting from the Spite case when I was one of three people that had a vote on him all day yesterday, and wrote a half page write-up on why we should lynch him, and then today, in a post I blatently say that I Still think Spite is a leader. please please please start a Spite train. I will be right there with you.

Notice how he has vanished now that the heat is off him?

I have a lot of work to do for the next few hours. I will be back in a few.

[Liosan]

Well, Spite's vanishment could just be RL-related. I know that I'm normally busy all day and sleeping the rest of the time.

[Sukul Ankhadu]

Ruse, on 11 February 2010 - 10:41 PM, said:

Sukul Ankhadu, on 11 February 2010 - 10:02 PM, said:

I'm considering the possibility that Korbas and Ruse is fake symping Lio to divert attention from the Spite case. Can't imagine why though, since I didn't get the Spite case the first time around.

Why would I be diverting from the Spite case when I was one of three people that had a vote on him all day yesterday, and wrote a half page write-up on why we should lynch him, and then today, in a post I blatently say that I Still think Spite is a leader. please please please start a Spite train. I will be right there with you.

Notice how he has vanished now that the heat is off him?

I have a lot of work to do for the next few hours. I will be back in a few.

Then why isn't your vote on Spite? It's not adding up. I'll see if I can find that post though.

[Sukul Ankhadu]

Okay I didn't find the case post on Spite yet, Ruse, but your post today where you said you still thought Spite was a leader, you voted Tennes.

[Sukul Ankhadu]

Ok I found the posts you were talking about Ruse. You seem very confident in both posts that Spite is a leader. Yet today you vote Tennes instead. At the time you voted Spite, the Okaros train was on a steady course, and there was no real danger of Spite getting lynched, imo. I find the fact that you haven't voted Spite today, despite voicing such confidence in your own assertion that Spite is a leader yesterday. Fairly obvious case of possible distancing. See for yourselves.

Ruse, on 10 February 2010 - 05:57 PM, said:

Ok caught up and it seems some teams are forming. For the people advocating a "lets let spite slide because we should be going for leaders" I think you are being a bit daft. Spite himself said it was coincidence and that Ano wasn't his leader.. take that as you will, In my posts yesterday I stated that its possible spite was just middle of the roading . (as a possible leader would do). I also believe that when you have a team down.. you kill it. That way there are no mistakes. From the way post lynch has shaken out, it looks to me, in the way the Okaros train has gathered steam alarmingly quickly, that we have a leader in the front part of this train, directing his followers.

Here is a quote by spite throwing out his list of Possible Leaders. Notice he latches onto Okaros at the end soley based on the fact that he was early in the train and that people followed him ( by that logic, anyone that isn't the lead vote is a sub..) Meanas uses this later as well.

Spite, on 10 February 2010 - 03:04 AM, said:

I think that we need to be reading more into the lower posters than in previous games. Both for the fact that important characters tend to hide among them the first few days and because I think the ME mafia trend of continually lynching the high posters is doing bad things to the game. So far we have four people with five or fewer posts, two of whom still managed to vote on Ano (Telas and Korbas - Omtose voted on Sukul):

Telas 5
Omtose 4
Korbas 4
Liosan 3

And three with 6 posts (all of whom still managed to vote on Ano):

Ruse 6
Sukul Ankhadu 6
Okaros 6

Of those, Ruse was the one who made the actual case that Ano was a leader. The most thought out of the votes and a decent case (whether or not I agree with it). I doubt he is a leader (or at least doesn't deserve the lurker title) at this point just due to the amount he contributed in that one post alone.

Korbas, Sukul and Telas were pile on votes.

Okaros was the second vote.

I would not be surprised to find a faction leader among Okaros, Korbas, Sukul and Telas. I would also not be surprised to find that Okaros was a faction leader and at least one of the later voters was a sub to him. I'll reread the posts from all those six and under and see if anything sticks out.

Then look who pops on and immediately votes Okaros. Based on that "analysis" above. What analysis. He is voting him because he was second on the train.

Tulas Shorn, on 10 February 2010 - 05:35 AM, said:

Well, the analysis of Okaros above, and my misgivings about him yesterday makes me want to go ahead and vote him again - just to get things rolling.

And I agree, low posting has been the MO of faction leaders in recent merc games.

Vote Okaros

Then on comes Meanas sayig that we shouldn't be trying to knock off a team, but instead looking for leaders. I'm sorry, but I think this is a bad idea. We don't KNOW that spite is a Ano follower. WE strongly suspect based on yesterdays interactions, but we don't know. As myself and a couple others pointed out yesterday before the lynch, he might have been middle-of-the-roading. Which is a leader tactic. I am just pointing out here that I don't agree with Meanas' opinion.

Meanas, on 10 February 2010 - 03:31 PM, said:

Good morning!

I'm not sure that I agree with hunting down a weakened faction for two reasons. It 1) allows every other faction to try and win an arms race against my faction. And 2) it does nothing to help me determine who else is in my faction. Ano's faction is completely crippled. I don't know how many starting factions there are, but I'd imagine it's in the neighborhood of 3-6 (each faction having 2-4 members, maybe a lone wolf faction in there). A faction of a few people that has already lost its leader is going to have an absolute nightmare of a time trying to win the game.

It's much more prudent to hunt down other leaders, IMO.

But then this one takes the cake for me. Meanas is basing his vote on the fact that a player folloed soeone twice in a game... if thats the case then if I vote for Okaros, does that mean I am a Subordinate of Meanas? I will have followed him both days. Actually, by Spite's logic. Meanas is a likely leader as he was the first person on the Ano bandwagon, and the third person on the Okaros train.

Meanas, on 10 February 2010 - 03:40 PM, said:

Current votes:

Okaros (Tulas)
Liosan (Meanas)
Spite (Okaros, Liosan)

So Liosan has popped out of the woodwork to drop a second vote on Spite. And Korvalain, although he hasn't voted, hasn't committed to voting anyone else, and has soft-spoken some support for Spite as a back-up candidate. This kind of behavior just pisses me off. Why are people still saying "We should consider lynching this guy" and not either 1) voting them or 2) offering some alternative(s)? This looks like an attempt to offer support of Okaros's case, without committing to it too early and starting a train.

Here's a kicker for me.

Yesterday's votes:

8 votes Anomandaris (Meanas, Okaros, Korvalain, Ruse, Telas, Tennes, Korbas, Sukul Ankhadu)
2 votes Okaros (Tulas Shorn, Anomandaris)
1 vote Sukul Ankhadu (Omtose)

Korvalain followed Okaros onto the train. It's safe, IMO, to say that Tulas is not a sub of Okaros, since he voted him both days (yesterday may have been a signal, today unlikely). Ano obviously wasn't a sub of Okaros. So if we're looking at yesterday's votes as any form of signal, I'd be extremely dubious about people that vote on the same train who seem to have similar interests in the following days.

Today, Korvalain follows that pattern.

Remove Vote
Vote Okaros

Do I think the Okaros case has merit... yes actually. I do. the Korv votes are suspect, but it could also be a crafty player trying to get someone killed. I think we need to look at voting patterns but not to the exclusion of other player interactions. Would I vote Okaros. Absolutely. He's not my big dog so I could care less.but...

vote Spite

why?

He might be the last person of Ano's faction thus eliminating a possible victor over my team.
He might be a leader, and from the way Tulas and Meanas have jumped on his initial vote they are prime suspects for last nights recruiting or possible original member.
Unless he is your leader I see no reason why a person trying to win for their team wouldn't vote Spite.

I understand that in a merc game it is dangerous, to defend someone, and it looks like I am doing that to Okaros. But whatever, i am going to say what I think and i think its a real tactical error to let spite wander around free when he is a known enemy. I have been bit in the ass way to many times to leave someone at my backside like that.

If it comes down to make or break,lynch/no lynch, I will swap over to Okaros, but I think Spite is the better choice.

Ruse, on 10 February 2010 - 06:04 PM, said:

Meanas, on 09 February 2010 - 06:38 PM, said:

Ano, it's quite possible to argue without going straight to the "U DUM" line. But I'm not going to further justify my vote on you.

Ruse... that is a mighty day 1 case, sir. And that would be equally incredible if Ano were a leader. However, I am a bit worried that you're just trying to set up a second day lynch. I suppose, however, if Ano were lynched and came back with a name we expect to be a leader (one of the earlier mentioned names that someone said were likely to be powerful), that we'd have to immediately consider potential subordinates.

There's also a slight air of confidence in that case, Ruse... something to me that boils down to a "You're not my leader, VOTE" case, but in a dissertation format.

Then I came across this bold is mine. This looks like Meanas might have been an original member of Spite's team and was worried that I would come after him today. So maybe I was wrong yesterday in Spite Symping Anno. Maybe Spite is the leader. He was playing very middle of the road. That has been said by multiple people.

This Quote, combined with Spite basically directing people to Okaros in his first big post lynch post make me pretty confident. I was right yesterday that ano was a leader ( maybe for the wrong reasons.. but.. ) And I think we have found another one in Spite. I am not changing my vote today. I am more confident about this that I was about Ano yesterday.

Edit: spelling

This post has been edited by Sukul Ankhadu: 11 February 2010 - 11:16 PM

[Sukul Ankhadu]

Lets see if we can get Ruse to vote Spite on a real train.

remove vote
vote Spite

Edit: you said you wanted a Spite train Ruse, well lets have it then.

This post has been edited by Sukul Ankhadu: 11 February 2010 - 11:18 PM

[Liosan]

I think I'm still voting Spite, myself. What time do we have left? Where's the votecounts? :S

[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 21 hours and 12 minutes remaining
12 Players still alive: Galayn Lord, Korbas, Korvalain, Liosan, Meanas, Omtose, Ruse, Spite, Sukul Ankhadu, Telas, Tennes, Tulas Shorn

7 votes to lynch, 6 votes to go to night.

1 Vote for Telas ( Spite )
2 Votes for Liosan ( Korvalain, Omtose )
1 Vote for Meanas ( Tulas Shorn )
1 Vote for Sukul Ankhadu ( Ruse )
3 Votes for Spite ( Liosan, Meanas, Sukul Ankhadu )

Players not voted: Galayn Lord, Korbas, Telas, Tennes

[Liosan]

Speak of the devil. Thanks, PS!

[Ruse]

Sukul Ankhadu, on 11 February 2010 - 11:15 PM, said:

Ok I found the posts you were talking about Ruse. You seem very confident in both posts that Spite is a leader. Yet today you vote Tennes instead. At the time you voted Spite, the Okaros train was on a steady course, and there was no real danger of Spite getting lynched, imo. I find the fact that you haven't voted Spite today, despite voicing such confidence in your own assertion that Spite is a leader yesterday. Fairly obvious case of possible distancing. See for yourselves.

bold is mine- if you are going to try to make a point at least try to be accurate. it was

Okaros 3 votes
Spite 3 votes ( after my vote)

you are trying to tell me at 3 vs 2 votes the lynch is on a steady course and other votes shouldn't matter?...with 7 votes to lynch!?!?! the fuck?
by that logic we should only have voted Liosan today right? I mean, the train is on a steady course, right?



remove vote

vote Spite.

happily

You aren't off the hook though, clearly I struck a nerve with my vote for you. At the very least it made you start posting.

[Ruse]

@Sukul

of course, you are just going to say that my above vote on spite is expected, as long as it gets people off the Liosian train...right? Cause I am on his team too. heh, alright, I am done antagonizing you. I need to read up on these last couple pages a little more thouroughly.

This post has been edited by Ruse: 12 February 2010 - 12:20 AM

[Meanas]

Liosan, on 11 February 2010 - 09:35 PM, said:

Dude, I'm defensive personality, no nightkills here. As I said, I missed my night 2 action, in any case.

Re-catching up... this post here pretty much confirms that Liosan is Tactical. It's already confirmed that offensive officers have failed their NKs, so they're all rank 1. Now you're saying you're still rank 1 and defensive... and offensive > defensive. So you just told every offensive player in the game to kill you.

In other words, you are trying to draw in offensive NKs and keep everyone at that level at rank 1, since tactical > offensive.

[Sukul Ankhadu]

I'm fine thank you. I admit I was just going off memory about the Okaros train, the rest I completely still hold to though. In my book Lio and Spite both could be leaders, so I'm fine with the development.

Edit: @Ruse

This post has been edited by Sukul Ankhadu: 12 February 2010 - 12:28 AM