[Cerberys]

I am re-reading the books for the first time. I have/had a habit of glossing over the snippets inbetween chapters thinking that they are non-essential like the Tad Williams poems/songs that are sometimes in the Weis/Hickman books. On page 400 of MoI there is mention of a Priest of Fener who was born in Unta and began as a thief who was waiting expectantly to become the next Destriant of Fener but was subjected to the Reve of Fener and his name was stricken from the books. Is that Heboric ?? I do not believe that the last time I read the book that I actually read this so this is a first for me. If so that is really messed up. I have to go back and read all the snippets from the first 2 books to make sure I didnt miss anything more.

[redtape]

 Cerberys, on 02 October 2009 - 05:12 AM, said:

I am re-reading the books for the first time. I have/had a habit of glossing over the snippets inbetween chapters thinking that they are non-essential like the Tad Williams poems/songs that are sometimes in the Weis/Hickman books. On page 400 of MoI there is mention of a Priest of Fener who was born in Unta and began as a thief who was waiting expectantly to become the next Destriant of Fener but was subjected to the Reve of Fener and his name was stricken from the books. Is that Heboric ?? I do not believe that the last time I read the book that I actually read this so this is a first for me. If so that is really messed up. I have to go back and read all the snippets from the first 2 books to make sure I didnt miss anything more.

i think you got it right, if i am not istaken, Heboric started out as a cut purse, and eventually joined the priest hood, what you wrote (at least for me) confirms heboric's high status within Fener's priesthood

[Pilgrim]

Yes, the passage is referring to Heboric, who was severely wronged by the empire in being cast out of the priesthood.

As far as the opening poems/passages go, I've found that while I usually can't relate on the first read, they often have significant relevance on re-read after finishing later books. There is a LOT of foreshadowing in those passages, and hints as to character's futures within the malazan world, as well as clues to char's backgrounds and history. Definitely not for skipping...

Pilgrim

[Cobbles]

 Pilgrim, on 02 October 2009 - 04:25 PM, said:

Yes, the passage is referring to Heboric, who was severely wronged by the empire in being cast out of the priesthood.

As far as the opening poems/passages go, I've found that while I usually can't relate on the first read, they often have significant relevance on re-read after finishing later books. There is a LOT of foreshadowing in those passages, and hints as to character's futures within the malazan world, as well as clues to char's backgrounds and history. Definitely not for skipping...

Pilgrim

I'm not quite done with the book, so I shouldn't read the forum, but it is actually explained that Heboric wrote a historical tractate saying that Laseen failed to kill Kellanved and Dancer. The Reve was invoked (unjustly) which eventually lead to Fener's downfall (the hands pushed). I think this is also the reason why Duiker, a fellow historian, sets in motion the rescue operation.

[dracayr]

Yeah, I noticed that too during my first (and only) reread. But.. In MoI it says: "...The last boar-cloaked Destriant was [forgot Name], who died during [...] .Another waited to claim that title..."
Also, Quick Ben notes that the last true Destriant of the cult died a thousand years ago. So, Heboric would have to be over 1000 years old

I didn't skip the poems/passages in the first books during re-read, but later on, most of all in DoD, they got increasingly obscure and lengthy (worse than Fisher), so I skipped..

[Illuyankas]

That is, as far as Quick knows. The Another you mention is Heboric, and the name you've forgotten is either Manask or Ipshank (now I've forgotten which). Keep an eye out for both of those names later on.

[caladanbrood]

Yeah, you have to make sure that you don't take everything you read as fact. None of the characters know everything (even if some know a lot). Anyway, it rather depends how you define "true". Maybe some sort of ceremony had to be gone through in the past but had since died out - it's not going to matter too much to Fener, who will just chose another one anyway, but for them to be recognised as Destriant (or mortal sword, or shield anvil, for that matter), it's another matter, and all down to interpretation. The problem with the cult of Fener is that because it was so spread out amongst soldiers all over the world, it didn't exactly have a centralised hierarchy. I mean, Rath'Fener claimed to be closer to his god than anyone, but clearly wasn't as soon as outsiders came to Capustan...

[D'rek]

 Illuyankas, on 26 January 2010 - 10:01 PM, said:

That is, as far as Quick knows. The Another you mention is Heboric, and the name you've forgotten is either Manask or Ipshank (now I've forgotten which). Keep an eye out for both of those names later on.

Pretty sure it was Ipshank, the famous healer.