[Hugin & Munin]

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM, said:

what bullshit reason, scum? fact is if someone is on and doesnt go for a lynch you can pretty much rule out american as their town faction. i had it wrong, the brits actually earn points by recieving votes but the premise is the same. it costs my faction more for me to miss a lynch and it was obvious korv was going.

@ano - this is still a town versus scum game. to me spite protected silchas and though i started the day voting for spite i decided the only way to see if he was going to break was to put the pressure on silchas again and see how hard he pushed the other way. its also amusing the only person who claims there are no symps in this game is the person suspected of being one. that little nugget made about as much sense as a bag of dicks, why would ps go to the trouble of saying scum are within the town factions if they would all cf as scum? clearly there must be symps out there.

@spite - as far as i know being in a lover style off thread comms situ and stating on thread that that is the case reveals nothing about your faction and so isnt modkillable. what you are trying to do is find the person in the scene so they will get modkilled. two very different ways of playing. much like town and scum. its funny how you keep linking me with town things yet are still voting for me. for one you think i am the russian in the scene. and for another you have linked me on numerous occassions to korvalain who came back as spy not syndicate. yet your still voting for me. you clearly believe i am russian and town, yet your still wanting to get me lynched.

Tapper here, just to clear up.

The ONLY 2 ways you can cause someone else to be modkilled is
a) by somehow forcing them to break the rules on reveals (rule 11)
breaking their code (also rule 11, 1c I think).

As is explicitly stated in the rules: you can reveal other people's alignments and abilities on thread no problemo (although direct quotage of P-S PMs will not do per the usual rules);
you can however NOT do that yourself as that is a confession of being a spy operating in foreign territory. So, you can only hint and talk about your own abilities and alignment in circumspect ways.

I am now out again, back in 3 hours or so.

This post has been edited by Hugin & Munin: 23 September 2009 - 05:52 PM

[Spite]

The more you cry that you aren't that Russian the more it seems like you are.
Also since scum are interspersed with the town roles and I saw nothing in that scene to say that the Russian wasn't also scum then he could easily be.
It does me no harm to keep the pressure on you. But the benifits have been pretty good so far. Even if you aren't the Russian slot of good info gas came out of my vote.
As it is only one vote I am constantly surprised at the amount of attention you have shown it. Which is enough reason for me to leave it where it is.

[Gamelon]

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 05:49 PM, said:

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM, said:

@ano - this is still a town versus scum game. to me spite protected silchas and though i started the day voting for spite i decided the only way to see if he was going to break was to put the pressure on silchas again and see how hard he pushed the other way. its also amusing the only person who claims there are no symps in this game is the person suspected of being one. that little nugget made about as much sense as a bag of dicks, why would ps go to the trouble of saying scum are within the town factions if they would all cf as scum? clearly there must be symps out there.

Well the actions that looked like recruitment pretty much guarantee (if we're guessing correctly, that is) that there are symps in the factions, but they weren't symps originally. If they gain symps by recruitment, how could Spite have been symping Silchas on day 1? Because they have 'no team on the island', it doesn't make sense that they already have symps until they recruit, which they couldn't have on day 1, or we would've noticed.

why are you making the assumption that symps would have to be recruited?

[Gamelon]

 Spite, on 23 September 2009 - 05:52 PM, said:

The more you cry that you aren't that Russian the more it seems like you are.
Also since scum are interspersed with the town roles and I saw nothing in that scene to say that the Russian wasn't also scum then he could easily be.
It does me no harm to keep the pressure on you. But the benifits have been pretty good so far. Even if you aren't the Russian slot of good info gas came out of my vote.
As it is only one vote I am constantly surprised at the amount of attention you have shown it. Which is enough reason for me to leave it where it is.

you think?

[Emurlahn]

People voting for Silchas in an attempt to prove that Spite may be scum. If spite was scum this is what he probably wants, I know sometimes scum will target each other in lynches so that if one is lynched or killed and they cf as scum, the other will be seen as PI. Ok in this case we are arguing that spite is either symp or has a lesser role in some way to Silchas. And that he is willing to sacrifice himself in an attempt to give Silchas PI status. So the obvious reaction is to lynch Silchas.

But if Spite is scum and is playing this smart, he would have picked someone that he wasn't sure about and then do his inconsistant reasoning of why he was voting/not voting for silchas, people see it as dodgy and that he didn't want the lynch to go through. I mean if he just picked Silchas randomly then he has a chance it an inno, and that plays into scum hands.

I'm of the view that if we suspect spite of being scum or a symp, especially if he was a symp, a good symp will symp the wrong person, ensuring that his "master" and him takes the heat allowing his true master to avoid possibly two more lynches in this case.

If we want to know Spite's colour, the sure way is lynching him and not another player.

Vote Spite

[Spite]

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:53 PM, said:

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 05:49 PM, said:

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM, said:

@ano - this is still a town versus scum game. to me spite protected silchas and though i started the day voting for spite i decided the only way to see if he was going to break was to put the pressure on silchas again and see how hard he pushed the other way. its also amusing the only person who claims there are no symps in this game is the person suspected of being one. that little nugget made about as much sense as a bag of dicks, why would ps go to the trouble of saying scum are within the town factions if they would all cf as scum? clearly there must be symps out there.

Well the actions that looked like recruitment pretty much guarantee (if we're guessing correctly, that is) that there are symps in the factions, but they weren't symps originally. If they gain symps by recruitment, how could Spite have been symping Silchas on day 1? Because they have 'no team on the island', it doesn't make sense that they already have symps until they recruit, which they couldn't have on day 1, or we would've noticed.

why are you making the assumption that symps would have to be recruited?

Probably for the same reason that everyone else keeps thinking that there are any symps in this game to begin with.

[Anomandaris]

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:53 PM, said:

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 05:49 PM, said:

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM, said:

@ano - this is still a town versus scum game. to me spite protected silchas and though i started the day voting for spite i decided the only way to see if he was going to break was to put the pressure on silchas again and see how hard he pushed the other way. its also amusing the only person who claims there are no symps in this game is the person suspected of being one. that little nugget made about as much sense as a bag of dicks, why would ps go to the trouble of saying scum are within the town factions if they would all cf as scum? clearly there must be symps out there.

Well the actions that looked like recruitment pretty much guarantee (if we're guessing correctly, that is) that there are symps in the factions, but they weren't symps originally. If they gain symps by recruitment, how could Spite have been symping Silchas on day 1? Because they have 'no team on the island', it doesn't make sense that they already have symps until they recruit, which they couldn't have on day 1, or we would've noticed.

why are you making the assumption that symps would have to be recruited?

Like I said, they say they have 'no team on the island', which implies that that only people they are sending in are the infiltrators, who we know aren't symps, but scum. Couple that with the fact that we have what looks like recruitment going on, and that one line is 'betray your country to the cause' (note: not other country), it makes me think that there were no symps on day 1. Yes, I realise I am making assumptions that might very well be false, but the RP and language just doesn't fit. In my mind, anyway.

[Spite]

 Emurlahn, on 23 September 2009 - 06:03 PM, said:

People voting for Silchas in an attempt to prove that Spite may be scum. If spite was scum this is what he probably wants, I know sometimes scum will target each other in lynches so that if one is lynched or killed and they cf as scum, the other will be seen as PI. Ok in this case we are arguing that spite is either symp or has a lesser role in some way to Silchas. And that he is willing to sacrifice himself in an attempt to give Silchas PI status. So the obvious reaction is to lynch Silchas.

But if Spite is scum and is playing this smart, he would have picked someone that he wasn't sure about and then do his inconsistant reasoning of why he was voting/not voting for silchas, people see it as dodgy and that he didn't want the lynch to go through. I mean if he just picked Silchas randomly then he has a chance it an inno, and that plays into scum hands.

I'm of the view that if we suspect spite of being scum or a symp, especially if he was a symp, a good symp will symp the wrong person, ensuring that his "master" and him takes the heat allowing his true master to avoid possibly two more lynches in this case.

If we want to know Spite's colour, the sure way is lynching him and not another player.

Vote Spite

THIS IS A MERC GAME not a normal game. WOULD you stop refering to people as symp and masters. If you want to lynch me cause you think that I am scum then do so. But for gods sake fucking realize that in a merc game especially one were (from the looks of it) lots of people can change sides there is no fucking SYMPS.

[Spite]

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 06:04 PM, said:

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:53 PM, said:

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 05:49 PM, said:

 Gamelon, on 23 September 2009 - 05:39 PM, said:

@ano - this is still a town versus scum game. to me spite protected silchas and though i started the day voting for spite i decided the only way to see if he was going to break was to put the pressure on silchas again and see how hard he pushed the other way. its also amusing the only person who claims there are no symps in this game is the person suspected of being one. that little nugget made about as much sense as a bag of dicks, why would ps go to the trouble of saying scum are within the town factions if they would all cf as scum? clearly there must be symps out there.

Well the actions that looked like recruitment pretty much guarantee (if we're guessing correctly, that is) that there are symps in the factions, but they weren't symps originally. If they gain symps by recruitment, how could Spite have been symping Silchas on day 1? Because they have 'no team on the island', it doesn't make sense that they already have symps until they recruit, which they couldn't have on day 1, or we would've noticed.

why are you making the assumption that symps would have to be recruited?

Like I said, they say they have 'no team on the island', which implies that that only people they are sending in are the infiltrators, who we know aren't symps, but scum. Couple that with the fact that we have what looks like recruitment going on, and that one line is 'betray your country to the cause' (note: not other country), it makes me think that there were no symps on day 1. Yes, I realise I am making assumptions that might very well be false, but the RP and language just doesn't fit. In my mind, anyway.

Finally someone who sees sense.

[Anomandaris]

Geez Spite, indoor voice please, some of us are trying to think. By the way, this is a town and scum game first, and a merc game second. Excluding the possibility of any symps at all is fairly narrow-minded. Do we now ignore scum symping and instead hunt factions that symp? Gee, scum would love that.

[Spite]

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 06:12 PM, said:

Geez Spite, indoor voice please, some of us are trying to think. By the way, this is a town and scum game first, and a merc game second. Excluding the possibility of any symps at all is fairly narrow-minded. Do we now ignore scum symping and instead hunt factions that symp? Gee, scum would love that.

The only way that there can be symps is if someone is recruited. From the OP it looked like the scum were in the same position as everyone else.

[Spite]

Well that was a fun filled way to go up to the next level.

[Spite]

Who hasn't joined in on the fun yet?

[Silchas Ruin]

All right, so now I go from getting votes for stating the obvious to getting votes because people think I am being symped. Sweet.

I realize I am kind of the crux of this discussion, but I have to say, from a point of view that is undoubtedly biased, of course, that Spite is making more sense than Gamelon at the moment. It is weird that he had to justify removing a joke vote, but I can at least follow his arguments. Gamelon, however, keeps throwing straight-up falsehoods into his arguments and it's ringing alarm bells to me.

I guess they've already been pointed, but just to reiterate:

1. The only way to get someone modkilled by outing them is if you cracked a code that they made. The scenes are there specifically for us to get information from.

2. Knowing someone's nationality tells you very little about their town/scum alignment. Just because Spite thinks Gamelon's Russian, that doesn't preclude Gamelon from also being scum.

Gamelon, I'm not convinced you're scum by a long shot, but you were also confused yesterday about the information given to us, so I do think you need to go read the OPs carefully again, take a deep breath, think about them for a bit, and then come back and start posting.

Also I have to agree with Ano's logic on the symp issue. So often people get caught up in symp/master logic when there is no evidence that it even pertains to the situation. This isn't a meat and potatoes game. If you think Spite is scum, then vote him, not me. Thanks.

[Anomandaris]

 Spite, on 23 September 2009 - 06:19 PM, said:

Well that was a fun filled way to go up to the next level.

You must have some pretty awesome level ups Spite. You're paying by far the most attention to it.

[Spite]

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 06:33 PM, said:

 Spite, on 23 September 2009 - 06:19 PM, said:

Well that was a fun filled way to go up to the next level.

You must have some pretty awesome level ups Spite. You're paying by far the most attention to it.

Actually the next 2 levels don't do shit for me. I need to go to level 4 to be able to do anything. But I do love that you can seriously spam in this game and it is counts toward something. Shame that the other spam lords aren't playing we could have gotten this up to 2000 by now.

[Anomandaris]

Well, two levels after two days is fairly decent.

[Anomandaris]

And as was said before, it's not wholly beneficial to level as quickly as possible. The scum might be better advantaged in the later levels as they become easier to spot towards the end of the game.

[Galain]

I gotta be a little wishy-washy here.

1- Spite

Spite has been really defensive when really the pressure has been on Silchas. Spite did in fact defend his joke vote, which is a very strange thing to do. He also blatantly OMGUS'd Gamelon and pretty much just went full on trying to get the attention away from (someone)


2- Gamelon - Started in on Spite yesterday, followed-up today. This could be seen as possibly setting up day 2's lynch. He said ' Fuck it, he ain't on my team" then quikly posted "At least I hope not" about the Korv lynch. 3 people including myself saw and commented on it, but never really followed up. At the time I could almost hear the pm being sent to SH "Oh shit, what did I just do!" He has also made a fairly decent case against Spite, and voted Silchas. Which would mean that if Silchas comes up inno, the Day 3 lynch might be set-up or visa versa, Spite comes up inno.

Right now I am just up in the air, but I have to say that Gamelon is definately the one I am more worried about based on the above.

[Spite]

 Anomandaris, on 23 September 2009 - 06:39 PM, said:

Well, two levels after two days is fairly decent.

yeah I thought so too. Although truthfully I don't know how long I will be able to keep up this pace. RL is about to hit in a painful kind of way.