[Path-Shaper]

It is Day 3. 15 hours remaining

10 Players still alive: Anomandaris, Anthras, Atrahal, Eloth, Fener, Gamelon, Karatallid, Kessobahn, Korbas, Silanah

6 votes to lynch, 5 votes to go to night

4 votes for Kessobahn: ( Silanah, Karatallid, Atrahal, Fener )

Players not voted: Anomandaris, Anthras, Eloth, Gamelon, Kessobahn, Korbas

[Anthras]

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 08:05 PM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:44 AM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Kesso, you can't just sling accusations at other people and call it a defense.

Why can't he. That is basically what you guys are doing to him?

He can sling accusations all he wants for his attacks, but for his defense he needs to refute what is being said about him or act like he cares about getting lynched. All I get from him is just a general "meh" as if he doesn't care or doesn't have any rebuttals.

How do you defend against an "hey guys he might be scummy" remark. It is a scum move and people are jumping all over it. There is no case against him. There hasn't been a case against anyone so far this game. Just slinging blahhh.

[Path-Shaper]

Also Eloth, we can see you

[Eloth]

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:44 AM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Kesso, you can't just sling accusations at other people and call it a defense.

Why can't he. That is basically what you guys are doing to him?

He can sling accusations all he wants for his attacks, but for his defense he needs to refute what is being said about him or act like he cares about getting lynched. All I get from him is just a general "meh" as if he doesn't care or doesn't have any rebuttals.

sounds like resigned inno. Now I'm not sure if lynching him is a good idea. i reckon, seeing how much time we have, we should look elsewhere.
Fener is being awfully pushy, and trying to befriend people like me. People who dont seem interested, and are perhaps not likely to realise he's "allying" himself with us, thus making us more likely to vote with him when the time comes.

[Anthras]

I also have strong feelings about most of the board. Which is why I haven't made a case. There isn't anything substantial out there.

[Fener]

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

anyways, my suspicions for today are Eloth and Kessobahn. The only people who can be confident in another person's innocence to the point of almost blocking a lynch on day 1, are either daft or evil.

I've done it myself as a killer in the past, thinking that defending an innocent instead of pushing a lynch (which would benefit the innos more) will make me seem more like a PI. It's a pattern that repeats itself, and that combined with their strange play, and kesso's very under the radar sort of game makes me think there's scum to be found

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:32 PM, said:

Gamelon, on Jul 17 2009, 08:27 AM, said:

Well, I agree with you on how that would be if we had general game dynamics, Sil. However, there is good reason for scum to find themselves on that train as well, this game, seeing as how they have nothing to lose in lynching either other scum or inno.

Edit: X post.

true, but that's all it gives us. Scum might be on both trains. The whole symp thing is stupid and I'm very embarassed that I brought it up early on.

We can't really find scum through the lynch trains in this game outside of fitting their participation into a pattern that fits with a sum role. Basically, we can find scum through slips, general play, or finders.

Silanah, on Jul 17 2009, 12:59 AM, said:

Well, I'm going to follow my gut on this one and vote

Kessobahn

For following a classic scum tactic by trying to CI himself through the defence of an inno when there's no reason for him to have been as confident as he was regarding Barghast's innocence.

Also on being very confident as to scum having one night action only when that's not stated by PS

If nothing else this should make him participate more

Here's the bulk of the case from Day 2, I believe. A few comments are made afterward about it, but Sil is the progenitor of the case.

[Anthras]

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 08:11 PM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:44 AM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Kesso, you can't just sling accusations at other people and call it a defense.

Why can't he. That is basically what you guys are doing to him?

He can sling accusations all he wants for his attacks, but for his defense he needs to refute what is being said about him or act like he cares about getting lynched. All I get from him is just a general "meh" as if he doesn't care or doesn't have any rebuttals.

sounds like resigned inno. Now I'm not sure if lynching him is a good idea. i reckon, seeing how much time we have, we should look elsewhere.
Fener is being awfully pushy, and trying to befriend people like me. People who dont seem interested, and are perhaps not likely to realise he's "allying" himself with us, thus making us more likely to vote with him when the time comes.

This is actually a point that I agree with.

[Fener]

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 12:11 PM, said:

sounds like resigned inno. Now I'm not sure if lynching him is a good idea. i reckon, seeing how much time we have, we should look elsewhere.
Fener is being awfully pushy, and trying to befriend people like me. People who dont seem interested, and are perhaps not likely to realise he's "allying" himself with us, thus making us more likely to vote with him when the time comes.

Shrug, I see some mild support coming from Anthras and nobody wanting to actually lay the hammer down. Don't think I'm looking to make friends, I'm looking to push people around and see what they do in response.

And really, why do people think being pushy is scummy in a game where scum have to be the last person standing?

[Silanah]

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 09:07 PM, said:

Gamelon, on Jul 20 2009, 07:48 PM, said:

What are your thoughts Anthras?

Well right now I see people willing to follow Silanah because of his day one case against Emu and that is :Surprise: .

I also see some suspicious behavior coming from Eloth and I have mixed feelings about Fener.

Come on now, you've read the thread and you very well know that my case on Kesso is a little more than that.

[Silanah]

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 09:11 PM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:44 AM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Kesso, you can't just sling accusations at other people and call it a defense.

Why can't he. That is basically what you guys are doing to him?

He can sling accusations all he wants for his attacks, but for his defense he needs to refute what is being said about him or act like he cares about getting lynched. All I get from him is just a general "meh" as if he doesn't care or doesn't have any rebuttals.

sounds like resigned inno. Now I'm not sure if lynching him is a good idea. i reckon, seeing how much time we have, we should look elsewhere.
Fener is being awfully pushy, and trying to befriend people like me. People who dont seem interested, and are perhaps not likely to realise he's "allying" himself with us, thus making us more likely to vote with him when the time comes.

You know what, we should get this out in the open right away so that it'll finally be explained to me. Why is it in any way shape or form wrong to be pushy?

[Eloth]

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:13 AM, said:

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 08:11 PM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 11:05 AM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 11:44 AM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Kesso, you can't just sling accusations at other people and call it a defense.

Why can't he. That is basically what you guys are doing to him?

He can sling accusations all he wants for his attacks, but for his defense he needs to refute what is being said about him or act like he cares about getting lynched. All I get from him is just a general "meh" as if he doesn't care or doesn't have any rebuttals.

sounds like resigned inno. Now I'm not sure if lynching him is a good idea. i reckon, seeing how much time we have, we should look elsewhere.
Fener is being awfully pushy, and trying to befriend people like me. People who dont seem interested, and are perhaps not likely to realise he's "allying" himself with us, thus making us more likely to vote with him when the time comes.

This is actually a point that I agree with.

i've been playing quiet and low in this game, for a number of reasons. 1) Cautious. Don't know anything about the mechanics, lots of vague hints, etc.
2) Not a lot of time.
3)To see how things play out without interference.
now, you don't seem to be particularly out to befriend anyone, but at the same time, you have noted suspicious activity coming from almost everyone, afaik.
that strikes me with a nice chord than "Well, he's inno, he's inno, he's inno, because theyre quiet. He's scum because he's being a little strange."
korbas got my wick a while ago, but he seems just as confused as me, which leads me to be less wary.
its playstyles where you try and make friends with everyone that are dangerous in a game like this.
who we lynch doesn't matter for any scum on the train.
they win no matter the outcome, really.
so, i think im gonna have to say, to my eyes, fener and silnah look a little suspicious to me

[Korbas]

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:12 PM, said:

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

anyways, my suspicions for today are Eloth and Kessobahn. The only people who can be confident in another person's innocence to the point of almost blocking a lynch on day 1, are either daft or evil.

I've done it myself as a killer in the past, thinking that defending an innocent instead of pushing a lynch (which would benefit the innos more) will make me seem more like a PI. It's a pattern that repeats itself, and that combined with their strange play, and kesso's very under the radar sort of game makes me think there's scum to be found

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:32 PM, said:

Gamelon, on Jul 17 2009, 08:27 AM, said:

Well, I agree with you on how that would be if we had general game dynamics, Sil. However, there is good reason for scum to find themselves on that train as well, this game, seeing as how they have nothing to lose in lynching either other scum or inno.

Edit: X post.

true, but that's all it gives us. Scum might be on both trains. The whole symp thing is stupid and I'm very embarassed that I brought it up early on.

We can't really find scum through the lynch trains in this game outside of fitting their participation into a pattern that fits with a sum role. Basically, we can find scum through slips, general play, or finders.

Silanah, on Jul 17 2009, 12:59 AM, said:

Well, I'm going to follow my gut on this one and vote

Kessobahn

For following a classic scum tactic by trying to CI himself through the defence of an inno when there's no reason for him to have been as confident as he was regarding Barghast's innocence.

Also on being very confident as to scum having one night action only when that's not stated by PS

If nothing else this should make him participate more

Here's the bulk of the case from Day 2, I believe. A few comments are made afterward about it, but Sil is the progenitor of the case.

Ha, I was about to make a post quoting all these, as well.

Basically Sil's suspicions begin because he thinks the scum know each other, which he later admits is silly. The only real argument is that he was attempting to CI himself, but don't innos want to make themselves look innocent, too?

I still don't get why everyone piled on him. Looks mighty suspicious, if you ask me.

[Eloth]

pushy is scummy in this, cus if scum sit back and coast through, they have less of a chance of surviving, because we start voting off people with low content; exactly whats happening with kesso. much better to be doing the pushing than being lynched

[Fener]

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 12:22 PM, said:

pushy is scummy in this, cus if scum sit back and coast through, they have less of a chance of surviving, because we start voting off people with low content; exactly whats happening with kesso. much better to be doing the pushing than being lynched

We've lynched a high poster (Karosis) and a mid-poster-at-the-time (Barghast). In case you haven't noticed, the two scum so far were a coaster (Okaros) and a guy who spent his entire day in this game trying to get rid of Silanah for being pushy (Emurlahn).

So again, tell me why it's a bad idea to be pushy? You think scum WANT to constantly be in the limelight?

[Silanah]

Korbas, on Jul 20 2009, 09:21 PM, said:

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:12 PM, said:

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:25 PM, said:

anyways, my suspicions for today are Eloth and Kessobahn. The only people who can be confident in another person's innocence to the point of almost blocking a lynch on day 1, are either daft or evil.

I've done it myself as a killer in the past, thinking that defending an innocent instead of pushing a lynch (which would benefit the innos more) will make me seem more like a PI. It's a pattern that repeats itself, and that combined with their strange play, and kesso's very under the radar sort of game makes me think there's scum to be found

Silanah, on Jul 16 2009, 11:32 PM, said:

Gamelon, on Jul 17 2009, 08:27 AM, said:

Well, I agree with you on how that would be if we had general game dynamics, Sil. However, there is good reason for scum to find themselves on that train as well, this game, seeing as how they have nothing to lose in lynching either other scum or inno.

Edit: X post.

true, but that's all it gives us. Scum might be on both trains. The whole symp thing is stupid and I'm very embarassed that I brought it up early on.

We can't really find scum through the lynch trains in this game outside of fitting their participation into a pattern that fits with a sum role. Basically, we can find scum through slips, general play, or finders.

Silanah, on Jul 17 2009, 12:59 AM, said:

Well, I'm going to follow my gut on this one and vote

Kessobahn

For following a classic scum tactic by trying to CI himself through the defence of an inno when there's no reason for him to have been as confident as he was regarding Barghast's innocence.

Also on being very confident as to scum having one night action only when that's not stated by PS

If nothing else this should make him participate more

Here's the bulk of the case from Day 2, I believe. A few comments are made afterward about it, but Sil is the progenitor of the case.

Ha, I was about to make a post quoting all these, as well.

Basically Sil's suspicions begin because he thinks the scum know each other, which he later admits is silly. The only real argument is that he was attempting to CI himself, but don't innos want to make themselves look innocent, too?

I still don't get why everyone piled on him. Looks mighty suspicious, if you ask me.

I'd be curious to hear where you got that little piece of nonsense from.

[Eloth]

Barghast was a day one choice, and thus was more down to bad luck than a reasonabe case, so dont foist that crap on me

similarly both scum never had time to get past day one, so we have no idea how they would play properly, but presumably the other two will have learnt from their mistakes.

and yes i do; there's less chance of being hit on a lynch train, isn't there?
and its mighty suspicious that both of the most vocal players aren't yet dead.
a typical scum move is to take out the biggest threats, lynching willynilly as you have been advocating would make you a threat, because statistically you would have to hit scum
moreover, you aren't causing a fuss, which would be the only reason to leave you alive; to divert attention from scummy behaviour

[Fener]

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 12:31 PM, said:

Barghast was a day one choice, and thus was more down to bad luck than a reasonabe case, so dont foist that crap on me

similarly both scum never had time to get past day one, so we have no idea how they would play properly, but presumably the other two will have learnt from their mistakes.

and yes i do; there's less chance of being hit on a lynch train, isn't there?
and its mighty suspicious that both of the most vocal players aren't yet dead.
a typical scum move is to take out the biggest threats, lynching willynilly as you have been advocating would make you a threat, because statistically you would have to hit scum
moreover, you aren't causing a fuss, which would be the only reason to leave you alive; to divert attention from scummy behaviour

Nice card to pull out on Barghast. Hindsight is 20/20 right? I love people who act so self-righteous for not getting on Day 1 trains. Yes, we lynched an innocent on Day 1, that's how this game almost always works. Last time you had an amazing Day 1 case was... (P.S. you voted Silanah, along with Emurlahn, the scum)

If you think the other two scum would learn from their mistakes, you are basically claiming that two people will have different play styles. What about my playstyle has changed all game? (Your style is pretty much the same, too, FYI.)

Why the hell else do you think Silanah is still alive? He's a lynchable target! That's scum 101. You don't kill lynchable targets. Vocal players tend to find themselves getting lynched between Days 3 and 5 of most games. Even if Silanah is scum, you really think the other scum player is going to kill someone that's likely to get lynched? Typical scum moves ARE to take out the biggest threats and mouthy players are not necessarily big threats. That's why scum tends to kill low-posters in the beginning of the game, they tend to be the people hiding the most.

[Anthras]

Silanah, on Jul 20 2009, 07:17 PM, said:

Anthras, on Jul 20 2009, 09:07 PM, said:

Gamelon, on Jul 20 2009, 07:48 PM, said:

What are your thoughts Anthras?

Well right now I see people willing to follow Silanah because of his day one case against Emu and that is :Surprise: .

I also see some suspicious behavior coming from Eloth and I have mixed feelings about Fener.

Come on now, you've read the thread and you very well know that my case on Kesso is a little more than that.

Just a touch more but nothing that couldn't be equally pointed at several players. Which means that is a meh case.

[Anthras]

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 07:26 PM, said:

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 12:22 PM, said:

pushy is scummy in this, cus if scum sit back and coast through, they have less of a chance of surviving, because we start voting off people with low content; exactly whats happening with kesso. much better to be doing the pushing than being lynched

We've lynched a high poster (Karosis) and a mid-poster-at-the-time (Barghast). In case you haven't noticed, the two scum so far were a coaster (Okaros) and a guy who spent his entire day in this game trying to get rid of Silanah for being pushy (Emurlahn).

So again, tell me why it's a bad idea to be pushy? You think scum WANT to constantly be in the limelight?

No but I think that in this game they have been. They want and need lynches as much as the innocents do. In fact the scum would rather try to lynch the other one and not have to waste a kill on their competition.

[Eloth]

Fener, on Jul 20 2009, 11:38 AM, said:

Eloth, on Jul 20 2009, 12:31 PM, said:

Barghast was a day one choice, and thus was more down to bad luck than a reasonabe case, so dont foist that crap on me

similarly both scum never had time to get past day one, so we have no idea how they would play properly, but presumably the other two will have learnt from their mistakes.

and yes i do; there's less chance of being hit on a lynch train, isn't there?
and its mighty suspicious that both of the most vocal players aren't yet dead.
a typical scum move is to take out the biggest threats, lynching willynilly as you have been advocating would make you a threat, because statistically you would have to hit scum
moreover, you aren't causing a fuss, which would be the only reason to leave you alive; to divert attention from scummy behaviour

Nice card to pull out on Barghast. Hindsight is 20/20 right? I love people who act so self-righteous for not getting on Day 1 trains. Yes, we lynched an innocent on Day 1, that's how this game almost always works. Last time you had an amazing Day 1 case was... (P.S. you voted Silanah, along with Emurlahn, the scum)

If you think the other two scum would learn from their mistakes, you are basically claiming that two people will have different play styles. What about my playstyle has changed all game? (Your style is pretty much the same, too, FYI.)

Why the hell else do you think Silanah is still alive? He's a lynchable target! That's scum 101. You don't kill lynchable targets. Vocal players tend to find themselves getting lynched between Days 3 and 5 of most games. Even if Silanah is scum, you really think the other scum player is going to kill someone that's likely to get lynched? Typical scum moves ARE to take out the biggest threats and mouthy players are not necessarily big threats. That's why scum tends to kill low-posters in the beginning of the game, they tend to be the people hiding the most.

my style DOES change during games, and you'd be blind not to notice it. usually the thing that gets me lynched
and mouthy players are not biggest threats, agreed.
but, however, pushy players ARE threats.