[Grief]

Remember, much of his flesh and power is caught up in the great ravens.
For him to heal, it seems likely they would have to rejoin him.

[Aptorian]

Grief, on Mar 14 2009, 11:57 PM, said:

Remember, much of his flesh and power is caught up in the great ravens.
For him to heal, it seems likely they would have to rejoin him.

Where do you have this from. The Ravens were maggots that emerged from his mangled bits. I don't remember any mention or even indidcation that states they took anything from him or that they are connected in any other way.

[Grief]

Their power is his power, iirc. They drew it from him.

Mentioned in MoI by Korlat, I think.

[Aptorian]

So you're saying the CG eats magic?

[HoosierDaddy]

Perhaps the otataral that surrounds things from the C.G.'s original realm (JG) (or only those involving the CG himself) is an aspect of their affecting the objects around them due to their anathema to magic? Could be why the other God's were at war with him there?

This post has been edited by HoosierDaddy: 14 March 2009 - 11:26 PM

[Grief]

Not sure it's mentioned if he does. The ravens do, so it stands to reason he does. Would explain why he's so damn hard to kill.

The ravens certainly do.
To a point, korlat mentions crones "capacity"
Or, certain kinds anyway, for example, not chaos, so possibly not some of the older kinds of magic aswell.

So yes, i'd say he probably does. His magic is chaos, so it can devour the younger more ordered warrens thrown at it.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

It seems odd to me that the CG has not mentioned the Ravens once. When they could quite possibly be a crucial part of him. Say if all the Great Ravens were to end up in his lap, would he "absorb" them and become even more powerful? /crazy theory

[Aptorian]

I maintain my position that there is no link between the CG and the Ravens. This is like saying that Mother Dark is weaker because she birthed the Andii or made KG. It doesn't compute.

[Grief]

Aptorian, on Mar 15 2009, 08:44 AM, said:

I maintain my position that there is no link between the CG and the Ravens. This is like saying that Mother Dark is weaker because she birthed the Andii or made KG. It doesn't compute.

Or like saying K'rul is weaker cause he made a warren for Jackurucku...

Memories of Ice, on page 131, said:

But wait! Have we not been honourable guardians of the Crippled God's magic? And were we not the ones who delivered to one and all the news of the Pannion Domin, the threat it represents?
A magic we can unleash, if forced to. Ah, child, you threaten so much with your careless words...

They hold his magic.

Fairly sure there is a link there.

[Sinisdar Toste]

there must be some kind of link, i mean, the great ravens started out as maggots in the CG's broken flesh did they not?

[Ain't_It_Just_]

Aptorian, on Mar 15 2009, 07:44 PM, said:

I maintain my position that there is no link between the CG and the Ravens. This is like saying that Mother Dark is weaker because she birthed the Andii or made KG. It doesn't compute.

You forget yourself Apt. I am the Bot here.

I remember Crone sayingin MoI "Have we not been honourable guardians of the CG's magic?" Hmm. Could have a couple of intepretations.

[lord of tragedy]

so how is then that crone and her companions were able to be wounded by the birds that were warped by the panion into flying around coral as surveilance? were they warped by the panion seer, the matron or the CG using either as a conduit? maybe i'm confused?

didn't paran sanctify the CG into the deck of dragons because leaving him outside it meant he had more power? i always thought that by doing this it ensured that the CG was part of the pantheon, part of WU, and by being bound to something he can no longer simply destroy it. thus my greatest fear. paran and kalam and quick ben walk away from the prone form of the CG realising you can't kill part of yourself, muttering that the CG is part of us all. thus ends book 10.

[ritchiediaz]

I've always been partial to the theory that in many ways the CG is a pawn in the maneuverings of all the other gods in the pantheon.

Why?

OK, the CG is alien, and it's fair to say that things were changed by a huge amount for Wu when the CG was brought down.

Prior to that (130,000 years or so) what were the gods up to?

What is their end-game? It's all about the Azath and power at the end of the day.

I contend that the CG was chained because some gods, ascendants figured that keeping the CG around might just play out in their favour before the end.

I alsothink there is a fair amount of Karma at play with the fact that Kallor was indirectly responsible for the CG's prescence. Or was it indirect? Kallor knew about KCM tech? Maybe he knew about the CG and saw what was going to happen?

Another key thing to consider is Gothos quote regarding Rake:-

'More than anyone else Anomander Rake made the correct choices' (paraphrasing)

Does the chaining count in this? What was Rake's involvement in the Chaining and what was his choice/views regarding the CG?

[lord of tragedy]

so the gods have some game in play that precludes the crippled gods arrival? i don't think that the azath are the path to power. they are the force that ensures that no power can arise to dominate all. i think thats how they are explained in DH. if anything then the fact that the azath have not taken the CG must mean that he is now somehow integral to WU and the balance of powers that arise there. the ramifications of that would probably make your point about him being pawn more pressing. why was he chained to burn? and who thought it would be a good idea? why would krul allow that unless he recognised that the warrens were flawed by the absence of chaos? chaos being essential for creativity and change.

again i get the feeling that it will all end with the realisation that we can't destroy whats part of ourselves. :Surprise:

[foolio]

Quote

again i get the feeling that it will all end with the realisation that we can't destroy whats part of ourselves.

I dont disagree but I sure will be dissapointed if that is how it ends...

This post has been edited by foolio: 17 March 2009 - 12:21 PM

[lord of tragedy]

me too. but i'm sure my anxiety is misplaced.

it is misplaced. isn't it?

[RangerSG]

I think part of the reason the CG hasn't been able to be killed is that the gods always wanted him "outside." I think Paran "blessing" the House of Chains was a necessary step to a permanent solution. I think it minimizes the degree of his "otherness" which may have been an issue in the past.

I also think he's clearly powerful enough that it takes a concert of ascendants working in agreement to deal with him at all. And most ascendants don't trust each other enough to actually work that way until the crisis is upon them. In that they're not different from most people. They'll scheme their schemes until something big from outside knocks over enough apple carts that they have to act.

[Tiger_sword]

Impressive Clergyman, on Mar 7 2009, 03:49 AM, said:

Well, look at other Elder Gods (the CG isn't the same definition of EG, but is certainly treated as one by people, Cotillion even calls him one). K'rul was gone for a while but then just magically reappeared the day his temple was resanctified. Nightchill was "killed" but continues to live as a seperate entity in Silverfox, one that can still reach out, affect stuff and remember all of herself.

It is apparently just damn hard to kill an EG, and in fact we don't really have any examples of one of the true EGs dying... whatever keeps them going could very well be the same thing keeping the CG going, and hence he can't be put down in the traditional way. Dragnipur would be an answer (sure works on Draconus for a while) but as said, he'd poison it or some crazy thing...

Actually in MoI it is said that there used to be many Elder Gods but the fall of the crippled god killed them all, K'rul, Nightchill and Draconus where the last (supposedly) though I'm sure there were others that survived but are unaccounted for Edgewalker? Maybe?

This post has been edited by Tiger_sword: 20 March 2009 - 09:58 PM

[Aptorian]

The Errant, Mael, Ardatha, MD, FL, Osserc, Killy, etc. etc.

I think that specific quote is just plain wrong or it is only taking into account the EGs currently active in "world politics" and hadn't retired/been imprissoned/been forgotten.

[D'rek]

Apt is right in that it does not take into account inactive Elder Gods or is just plain wrong. Certainly Killy, Sechul Lath, Mael and the Errant are all still out and about, the Errant even likely being still worshipped and active, but only in Lether/the HFE.

That passage doesn't specifically say others were wiped out by the Fall though, just that they are the only 3 left.