[Kessobahn]

Ok so mods don't do it unless game is slow. So Tennes, since the game was in no way slow on day 1 (thank you so much Telas......) why did you assume there were mod characters?

[Korlat]

Serc, on Feb 21 2009, 11:05 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 05:01 PM, said:

Korlat, on Feb 21 2009, 09:53 PM, said:

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 11:57 AM, said:

Galain, on Feb 21 2009, 11:47 AM, said:

well fener told the truth, or he is the ninja

vote galayn lord

two derailed trains. thats my case.

going to go do something with my saturday afternoon.

I'm contradiciting what I said yesterday, but i've slept on this and come to think that it doesn't make GL particularly likely to be guilty.

Speaking as someone who was voting for GL for much of day 2, I can't say i'm too happy about the case. The initial case on him was weak. The day 2 case was only marginally better. It's no great surprise that people weren't too impressed with either case.

Look at it from GL's point of view. Someone makes a weak case on him. He doesn't get lynched because the case was poor. So this is used against him the next day, which is almost as weak. So he gets out of it. And him not getting lynched is used against him again. How frustrating that must be. Do we expect that everyone with a lynch train on them should get lynched, else they're a ninja? By that logic, everyone who does get lynched is a pirate. Which suggests we've got no hope. Which is rubbish, because we can still win this despite the spam and the vig kills.

uahuahmmmm eyey ustG avvveh oneoeno ingngn tuu ayayay tuuu dat

JJJJJJJJAAAAAAAA

asec osssed

eettter to ill ememem den EEE ukerd AYyyyy aterf AYyyy

Ok erm what does that say? Got the last line, better to kill them than be (fucked?) day after day

the last part of the first sentence seems to be "one going to say to that" but don't get the first bit.

Since I seem to understand most of what he says:

"Ummm, I gots have one thing to say to that.

JA.

Case Closed.

Better to kill em, than be fucked day after day."

:gaes-orfantal:

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:39 PM, said:

I don't see what you mean about not buying the fake symping. Do you mean you don't see the symping or don't believe it could be fake? Even GL agreed Emur seemed to be symping him so I think that's pretty clear cut. If you don't believe it could be fake why the hell are you playing Mafia? One of the first things you learn is never to trust anything at face value.

I buy neither the symping nor the fake symping. Defending someone is not necessarily symping them.

Quote

I said I couldn't put my finger on it because there were several things which were kind of strange by themselves but together was a little off. The things I was picking up on were:

1. Emur was really quiet day 1, not even laying a vote because he was "catching up", then getting into rather a pissing contest with Fener. Here I will admit I misremembered when I was laying down the vote since I remembered that there was some shouty posting and thought Emur was part of that but it really seems to be Fener getting frustrated.

2. Emur jumped on Fener for claiming a vig, and one of his reasons for being so suspicious because it was too early and there wasn't enough info, conveniently ignoring Serc's claimed vig of our captain.

3. Emur seemed to be symping Galayn Lord who was under some suspicion for having had a train dissipate on him the day before.

4. Emur voted ano for annoying rp, again conveniently ignoring the more obvious candidate Korlat.

Apart from the symping which is really kind of suspicious none of the other 3 really scream scum but together they feel a bit weird, no?

You didn't mention any of these earlier, apart from the symping. If you'd really thought Emurlahn was guilty, you would have.

Quote

Also the train on Emur at that time was: Ano which seemed really a OMGUS vote, and Hood's Path, who said he was trying to put some pressure on Emur for his over pushiness with Fener. I don't really call that a case on Emur, or a proper train in fact.

Whether it was a proper case or not is irrelevent. It was convenient for you to jump on.

Quote

I can only say about the kind of that it's just a turn of phrase I use, doesn't really mean much and you can pretty much take it out of the sentence, all I meant was I felt Emur was symping GL, coupled with some possible distancing later by GL.

I don't understand why you italicized the word possibility, get back to me on that please.

I italicized possibility because you first thought Emur was "kind of" symping GL then you thought fake symping was possible. It's wishy washy. You seem to have decided to jump on a lynch, and then worked out why. It's the wrong way around.

Quote

In addition, please clarify where my case felt forced, because I don't really know which part you mean by that. If it's the whole case, you will see I had several posts discussing Emur's symping, not something I would do if I didn't feel it was there.

Finally, I know my case on Emur wasn't strong by any means, but I felt that it was the strongest case I had against anybody yesterday.

The whole case, such as it was, felt forced. But it was mostly your inital post that looks suspicious to me.

[Serc]

Korlat, on Feb 21 2009, 05:06 PM, said:

Serc, on Feb 21 2009, 11:05 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 05:01 PM, said:

Korlat, on Feb 21 2009, 09:53 PM, said:

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 11:57 AM, said:

Galain, on Feb 21 2009, 11:47 AM, said:

well fener told the truth, or he is the ninja

vote galayn lord

two derailed trains. thats my case.

going to go do something with my saturday afternoon.

I'm contradiciting what I said yesterday, but i've slept on this and come to think that it doesn't make GL particularly likely to be guilty.

Speaking as someone who was voting for GL for much of day 2, I can't say i'm too happy about the case. The initial case on him was weak. The day 2 case was only marginally better. It's no great surprise that people weren't too impressed with either case.

Look at it from GL's point of view. Someone makes a weak case on him. He doesn't get lynched because the case was poor. So this is used against him the next day, which is almost as weak. So he gets out of it. And him not getting lynched is used against him again. How frustrating that must be. Do we expect that everyone with a lynch train on them should get lynched, else they're a ninja? By that logic, everyone who does get lynched is a pirate. Which suggests we've got no hope. Which is rubbish, because we can still win this despite the spam and the vig kills.

uahuahmmmm eyey ustG avvveh oneoeno ingngn tuu ayayay tuuu dat

JJJJJJJJAAAAAAAA

asec osssed

eettter to ill ememem den EEE ukerd AYyyyy aterf AYyyy

Ok erm what does that say? Got the last line, better to kill them than be (fucked?) day after day

the last part of the first sentence seems to be "one going to say to that" but don't get the first bit.

Since I seem to understand most of what he says:

"Ummm, I gots have one thing to say to that.

JA.

Case Closed.

Better to kill em, than be fucked day after day."

:gaes-orfantal:

If you're a girl, I love you too.

[Korlat]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 11:05 PM, said:

Ok so mods don't do it unless game is slow. So Tennes, since the game was in no way slow on day 1 (thank you so much Telas......) why did you assume there were mod characters?

uuud qeston

[Korlat]

Serc, on Feb 21 2009, 11:09 PM, said:

If you're a girl, I love you too.

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

By the way, are mod characters common in Mafia here because I haven't played much here so I don't know. Because if not I would like Tennes to explain why his first conclusion to the discovery we had more alts than players was that they were mod alts, rather than what seems to me the more obvious conclusion, that ninjas were given extra alts.

Sorry if it sounds OMGUS but I was reading over the part where you took my posts from and that struck me as a bit weird.

No, i've never seen mod characters in any form of mafia. It was just the first thing that came into my head. 18 players, 20 characters.... It just seemed to fit.

I have no idea which is correct. We have no reason to assume 1 over the other, IMO. I'm not going to worry too much about it since they're dead. They clearly weren't pirates, anyway.

[Tennes]

Korlat, on Feb 21 2009, 10:05 PM, said:

Telas, on Feb 21 2009, 11:02 PM, said:

uahuahmmmm eyey ustG avvveh oneoeno ingngn tuu ayayay tuuu dat

I just have one thing to say to that?

JJJJJJJJAAAAAAAA

JA?
Yes?

asec osssed

Case closed?


eettter to ill ememem den EEE ukerd AYyyyy aterf AYyyy

Better to kill(?) them than be fucked(?) day after day

Is that close?

I still don't understand. Was Korlat agreeing or disagreeing with me?

[Kessobahn]

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:08 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:39 PM, said:

I don't see what you mean about not buying the fake symping. Do you mean you don't see the symping or don't believe it could be fake? Even GL agreed Emur seemed to be symping him so I think that's pretty clear cut. If you don't believe it could be fake why the hell are you playing Mafia? One of the first things you learn is never to trust anything at face value.

I buy neither the symping nor the fake symping. Defending someone is not necessarily symping them.

It wasn't just the defending, he votes Ano for being annoying virtually straight after GL questions Ano on exactly the same thing. I guess it's up to you if you feel it was symping, but both GL and I obviously felt it was.

Quote

I said I couldn't put my finger on it because there were several things which were kind of strange by themselves but together was a little off. The things I was picking up on were:

1. Emur was really quiet day 1, not even laying a vote because he was "catching up", then getting into rather a pissing contest with Fener. Here I will admit I misremembered when I was laying down the vote since I remembered that there was some shouty posting and thought Emur was part of that but it really seems to be Fener getting frustrated.

2. Emur jumped on Fener for claiming a vig, and one of his reasons for being so suspicious because it was too early and there wasn't enough info, conveniently ignoring Serc's claimed vig of our captain.

3. Emur seemed to be symping Galayn Lord who was under some suspicion for having had a train dissipate on him the day before.

4. Emur voted ano for annoying rp, again conveniently ignoring the more obvious candidate Korlat.

Apart from the symping which is really kind of suspicious none of the other 3 really scream scum but together they feel a bit weird, no?

You didn't mention any of these earlier, apart from the symping. If you'd really thought Emurlahn was guilty, you would have.

If you read through my posts, you will see that I did call out emur on both 2 and 4 when they actually happened. I didn't call him on 1, that's true, but it was a feeling I had.

Quote

Also the train on Emur at that time was: Ano which seemed really a OMGUS vote, and Hood's Path, who said he was trying to put some pressure on Emur for his over pushiness with Fener. I don't really call that a case on Emur, or a proper train in fact.

Whether it was a proper case or not is irrelevent. It was convenient for you to jump on.

My point was you said I jumped on a case but I didn't because there wasn't a case and I didn't even use either case as my reason for voting for him.

Quote

I can only say about the kind of that it's just a turn of phrase I use, doesn't really mean much and you can pretty much take it out of the sentence, all I meant was I felt Emur was symping GL, coupled with some possible distancing later by GL.

I don't understand why you italicized the word possibility, get back to me on that please.

I italicized possibility because you first thought Emur was "kind of" symping GL then you thought fake symping was possible. It's wishy washy. You seem to have decided to jump on a lynch, and then worked out why. It's the wrong way around.

That in no way explains why you italicized possibility, symping can be fake symping. Like I said "kind of" is just a turn of phrase I use. I am sure if you go through my posts you will find more times I have used that.
I decided to jump on a train with a whole two votes on... wow that's definitely a lynch going on there.

Quote

In addition, please clarify where my case felt forced, because I don't really know which part you mean by that. If it's the whole case, you will see I had several posts discussing Emur's symping, not something I would do if I didn't feel it was there.

Finally, I know my case on Emur wasn't strong by any means, but I felt that it was the strongest case I had against anybody yesterday.

The whole case, such as it was, felt forced. But it was mostly your inital post that looks suspicious to me.

You say the first post is suspicious, but in what way did it seem forced? Me saying that I feel there is something off with Emur is forced? I really don't feel that seems forced at all.

[Korlat]

Telas, on Feb 21 2009, 09:19 PM, said:

I believe the main accusation against GL was pushing stuff and being agressive?
I think the cases on him weren't great, and that he is most likely innocent.

The one thing I find suspicious about him is that, when it got near the end of the day, even though he had the most votes, lots of people went onto other people for the sake of a lynch, even though GL had more votes so would be an easier lynch to get, which kept the lynch away from GL. I believe silanah was involved both times, and switched both times, iirc?

[Kessobahn]

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:12 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

By the way, are mod characters common in Mafia here because I haven't played much here so I don't know. Because if not I would like Tennes to explain why his first conclusion to the discovery we had more alts than players was that they were mod alts, rather than what seems to me the more obvious conclusion, that ninjas were given extra alts.

Sorry if it sounds OMGUS but I was reading over the part where you took my posts from and that struck me as a bit weird.

No, i've never seen mod characters in any form of mafia. It was just the first thing that came into my head. 18 players, 20 characters.... It just seemed to fit.

I have no idea which is correct. We have no reason to assume 1 over the other, IMO. I'm not going to worry too much about it since they're dead. They clearly weren't pirates, anyway.

You have never seen it but it's the first thing that comes into your head? Even I have seen extra alts for scum and I haven't even been playing that long. Your answer now seems forced.

IMO it is something to worry about because we might be able to garner some information if they were in fact extra alts rather than mod characters by looking at who they seemed to be supporting etc.

[Galayn Lord]

I am more concerned about the players choosing the easy vote than the ones changing their votes. Take Omtose for instance - he voted for me 'because Korlat did'. I don't know if Omtose is scum or not, but it's the kind of reasoning I find very suspicious. It's not a bad thing to listen to reason - it's a good thing.

On the other hand changing votes could mean wanting to stay under the radar, I realize that. Scum tries their best to hide and do nothing suspicious, it's why it's so hard to find them. We pirates on the other hand doesn't win by being inconspicuous. So finding scum is not as easy as looking at the players making the loudest noise.

Players staying under the radar, that are not willing to go out on a limb for the team, and not really contributing - and possibly just going with the flow - is the players I'd look at.

Making lousy cases is NOT helping us here. Making easy targets is NOT Helping. If you're trying to make a case just to save your own skin, to try to impress us, and try to get anyone lynched because you think you can, think twice. It won't be allowed.

The stuff some people have been up to the latest days, making cases and pushing lynches because you think it's easy, is not a smart move, because sooner or later it's gonna bite you in the behind.

I suggest everyone take a deep breath and try to actually find a good case here, not just one that will save your ass. Capisce?

[Kessobahn]

Galayn Lord, on Feb 21 2009, 10:30 PM, said:

I am more concerned about the players choosing the easy vote than the ones changing their votes. Take Omtose for instance - he voted for me 'because Korlat did'. I don't know if Omtose is scum or not, but it's the kind of reasoning I find very suspicious. It's not a bad thing to listen to reason - it's a good thing.

On the other hand changing votes could mean wanting to stay under the radar, I realize that. Scum tries their best to hide and do nothing suspicious, it's why it's so hard to find them. We pirates on the other hand doesn't win by being inconspicuous. So finding scum is not as easy as looking at the players making the loudest noise.

Players staying under the radar, that are not willing to go out on a limb for the team, and not really contributing - and possibly just going with the flow - is the players I'd look at.

Making lousy cases is NOT helping us here. Making easy targets is NOT Helping. If you're trying to make a case just to save your own skin, to try to impress us, and try to get anyone lynched because you think you can, think twice. It won't be allowed.

The stuff some people have been up to the latest days, making cases and pushing lynches because you think it's easy, is not a smart move, because sooner or later it's gonna bite you in the behind.

I suggest everyone take a deep breath and try to actually find a good case here, not just one that will save your ass. Capisce?

Making easy targets like you getting Rashan taken down to save your ass from being lynched?

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:21 PM, said:

IMO it is something to worry about because we might be able to garner some information if they were in fact extra alts rather than mod characters by looking at who they seemed to be supporting etc.

Have you looked?

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:32 PM, said:

Making easy targets like you getting Rashan taken down to save your ass from being lynched?

Yeah... That was my first thought, too.

[Tennes]

Telas, on Feb 21 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

This is my case on Tennes. Suppose it may look OMGUS, but if you remember I voiced concerns about him last night too, before he voiced his concerns about me this morning.

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

Sorry if it sounds OMGUS but I was reading over the part where you took my posts from and that struck me as a bit weird.

[Kessobahn]

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:33 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:21 PM, said:

IMO it is something to worry about because we might be able to garner some information if they were in fact extra alts rather than mod characters by looking at who they seemed to be supporting etc.

Have you looked?

I have indeed, there are some links I can draw but they are a little tenuous. However I would prefer not to reveal them since if I am wrong then it's 1. misleading and 2. I might get killed to misdirect. and if I am right, then I might get killed for hitting on something.

[Kessobahn]

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:36 PM, said:

Telas, on Feb 21 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

This is my case on Tennes. Suppose it may look OMGUS, but if you remember I voiced concerns about him last night too, before he voiced his concerns about me this morning.

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

Sorry if it sounds OMGUS but I was reading over the part where you took my posts from and that struck me as a bit weird.

What? It's not our fault if you attack us... and you must expect some scrutiny back. However, then we do have to acknowledge it can look like OMGUS, even if we aren't doing it to get back at you.

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:37 PM, said:

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:33 PM, said:

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:21 PM, said:

IMO it is something to worry about because we might be able to garner some information if they were in fact extra alts rather than mod characters by looking at who they seemed to be supporting etc.

Have you looked?

I have indeed, there are some links I can draw but they are a little tenuous. However I would prefer not to reveal them since if I am wrong then it's 1. misleading and 2. I might get killed to misdirect. and if I am right, then I might get killed for hitting on something.

Does this not strike anyone else as odd? Kesso has found information from earlier in the thread, but doesn't want to reveal it?

1. All cases could be misleading. That's the nature of the game.

2. Any time you make a case you might get killed to misdirect. Live with it.

3. Since when have mafia players refrained from posting something that might lead to the killers because it might be right? That's insane.

Any info we can get is useful at this point. If you believe that Shadow and Ruse were controlled by the ninjas, as you definitely profess to, surely if you've found something that could link them to a player you'd tell us straight away?

I still think your earlier attack on Emurlahn was suspicious. But this post is a hell of a lot worse.

[Tennes]

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 10:38 PM, said:

Tennes, on Feb 21 2009, 10:36 PM, said:

Telas, on Feb 21 2009, 01:29 PM, said:

This is my case on Tennes. Suppose it may look OMGUS, but if you remember I voiced concerns about him last night too, before he voiced his concerns about me this morning.

Kessobahn, on Feb 21 2009, 09:58 PM, said:

Sorry if it sounds OMGUS but I was reading over the part where you took my posts from and that struck me as a bit weird.

What? It's not our fault if you attack us... and you must expect some scrutiny back. However, then we do have to acknowledge it can look like OMGUS, even if we aren't doing it to get back at you.

Yeah, that's pretty much the definition of OMGUS.