[D'rek]

Keep in mind, though, the tower the Builder built was not of the usual design. He said he usually made them a certain way but in order to do it in the place Nimander suggested he couldn't fit it all, so Nim suggested building something different, a taller but narrower tower, and the Builder did. So it may not be the same layout as the usual Azath. Additionally, no trees or anything like that, but if the Azath is brand-spanking-new and hasn't absorbed any entities yet, nor been 'initiated' by Gothos (if he does such a thing), then maybe it wouldn't have any grounds yet. Even the Finnest House had Raest right off the bat to expend some power making a garden or such...

[Ain't_It_Just_]

I wonder why that Azath tower (assuming that's what it was) was in Kurald Liosan...Maybe nothing seriously bad has happened and that is why there are no grounds/gardens.

[Mcflury]

 Ain't_It_Just_, on Jan 14 2009, 05:30 AM, said:

I wonder why that Azath tower (assuming that's what it was) was in Kurald Liosan...Maybe nothing seriously bad has happened and that is why there are no grounds/gardens.

If that tower was indeed an Azath tower, I must confess I don't see any other possibility but the Builder having stumbled inside that realm and decided he'd invite Gothos over for a 'welcoming gift'. At least that's what I would do if I was the builder

Elseway, if it truly and azath, I really don't see any reason what the hell it would be doing there. But of course, we're not sure it's an azath... it could be just some communication tower indeed (but then what the f*ck was that thing coming up, shitting skinner skitless and screaming "you are not he!!!"? Who is 'he'?)

[Aptorian]

What if it was... *gasp* just a tower!? omg omg omg.

Not everything the in the books need to be linked, or at least not in any sense as direct as this.

Nothing about this thing looked or sounded like an Azath.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

True...but we all remembered Knuckles house in RG and Gothos's little hole in TtH. Besides, a voice appeared out of nowhere-we Malazites are a capricious lot.

[Aptorian]

Yes, but for people in the know. An Azath is easy to spot, if not feel if it is awake. Cowl would have known it for an azath and kept his distance if it had been an azath. And the just walked right into it, there wasn't any door.

It wasn't an Azath, it was some kind of bizarre communication tower for gigantic godlike globs of grumpy light.

[D'rek]

Kallor didn't recognize the one in TtH until Gothos told him... now that one was dormant, but assume that Gothos usually performs some sort of "azath activation" when he teleports them away from the Builder, then one could think that perhaps the Builder teleported the azath into KL (the teleport function is built-in, he just doesn't know how to aim it like Gothos can) and, not having been "activated" the Azath was not awakened, like the one in TtH. If Kallor couldn't recognize one, why couldn't Cowl have made the same mistake?

[Ain't_It_Just_]

Good point...maybe the Azath in KL was dormant, and didn't have anyone inside.

[Tattersail_]

maybe the azath will not "activate" or come to life until the builder leaves? it's a good point, only if it was an azath, the azath play a big role in this series so it could definately well be.

[The Seguleh 46th]

"You are not he!". I always assumed it was meant to refer to Osserc, since he's been gone for ages from his realm. I like the Builder/Gothos theory though.

[The Seguleh 46th]

Anyways...came to this thread thinking we were gonna be talking about Jaghut rituals. I wanna know more about some of their "experiments", being mainly the creation of the Boles and their like. At least i think it has been stated that they were the product of a Jaghut ritual gone "awry", as much as walking chunks of internalized Otataral with maces for fists can be considered going "awry"!

This post has been edited by The Seguleh 46th: 06 September 2010 - 11:28 PM

[Tattersail_]

46th, can you list all the attributes/features of the boles? Like, can they do magic? are they bane to magic? are they super strong etc etc etc

[The Seguleh 46th]

 Tattersail, on 07 September 2010 - 07:50 AM, said:

46th, can you list all the attributes/features of the boles? Like, can they do magic? are they bane to magic? are they super strong etc etc etc

Not really a quote fu master guy, but it's mentioned that they were a Jaghut ritual (maybe experiement is a better word) gone awry somewhere late in the series (thinking RG or DOD). The Jaghut witch throws some sorcery at them during the Wrecker's Coast story, and it affects them not one bit. Plus the crazy fast fists via one of the High Marshalls in MOI (during a scene where they are stealing dung from the Rhivi perhaps? Might be wrong there), and the Bole brothers pretty much beating the shit out of the Shi-Gal - or however-you-spell-it - K'Chain assassin thing with their fists. Plus they seem deceptively smart, at least in terms of battle (which is mostly just an assumption on my part, i'll admit) via the Bridgeburners and WJ's dialogue regarding them with respect and how it seemed like they only were seen when they wanted to be. And the Pannion mages being taken out by them in MOI, where it appeared they were already inside the walls very shortly after Brood's forces arrived without either side knowing. I wanna know more about these crazy bastards! And why the Jaghut felt the need to create them, if that is truly the case, which ya never know for sure.

[The Seguleh 46th]

Of course it could be simply speculation on part of the whoever-it-was character that said they were a Jaghut experiment/ritual gone awry. I guess it never was definitively stated as fact, yet they are definitely fun and strange characters! If it is true, maybe they were created for the intention to be a potential Tellan-negating army for Omtose Phellack? And by creation, i'm obviously alluding to not a Adam and Eve type of way, but much more as a genetic manipulation craziness thing. The simple fact that the Boles were human (again, an assumption on my end) probably is what fucked it up for the Jaghuts, as we tend to play by our own set of rules and standards in the Malazan universe. Also, them Jaghut were known for their arrogance, as well as intelligence, if i have it right. Deadly combination there, so it would not surprise me one bit to see them as wanting to fiddle with evolution and/or gene pools a bit.

This post has been edited by The Seguleh 46th: 08 September 2010 - 05:38 AM

[Tattersail_]

aren't they mentioned about mott wood as well? Something about being able to disappear into the trees and not be found and then they are great at "digging holes" and filling them up

[Bauchelain the Evil]

I think at one point Shard or Cord asks Ebron if Jamber Bole can do magic and if that's the reason he's winning everything at that game the Malazan soldiers and Ebron says that it's actually the opposite and that the Bole are famous for it. This would indeed implicate, along with QB's comments at the end of MoI, that the Bole brothers are somehow walking magic repellent.

[Use Of Weapons]

 Bauchelain the Evil, on 08 September 2010 - 08:51 AM, said:

I think at one point Shard or Cord asks Ebron if Jamber Bole can do magic and if that's the reason he's winning everything at that game the Malazan soldiers and Ebron says that it's actually the opposite and that the Bole are famous for it. This would indeed implicate, along with QB's comments at the end of MoI, that the Bole brothers are somehow walking magic repellent.

Or, like Karsa, they call bull their way through magic because of an inherent warren? Seems like the kind of thing that would be the subject of a Jaghut experiment, based on trying to replicate the warren of the Thelomen Toblakai. Maybe.

[Silk]

 The Drum, on 11 January 2009 - 04:26 PM, said:

QUOTE (Aptorian @ Jan 11 2009, 04:13 PM) Looking for is a weird phrase. As far as I remember he wasn't looking for anything.

He had been toying with the Azath for some time and when Nimander and co came along he saw the oppertunity to capture some pawns he could use later.

It's what gods and ascendants do, play their little games with the lives of mortals.

OK maybe 'looking' for something was the wrong phrase, but he did want Nim and co to achieve some task for him but they failed, even though he didn't say what the task was as far as i could tell.

I wouldn't say he failed, as he specifically says after Nimander is freed that Rake chose right

[Roldom]

didnt the jaghut also create the nachts? im sure the crippled god mentions that to withel when they 1st meet....

and as for why they did it, if u could create an army of magic ignoring super guys, wouldnt you? they jaghut were usually isolated and on there own when they did there experiments and its always good to have someone nearby who can hold a beaker while ur freezing a continent

[foolio]

 Silk, on 08 September 2010 - 12:36 PM, said:

 The Drum, on 11 January 2009 - 04:26 PM, said:

QUOTE (Aptorian @ Jan 11 2009, 04:13 PM) Looking for is a weird phrase. As far as I remember he wasn't looking for anything.

He had been toying with the Azath for some time and when Nimander and co came along he saw the oppertunity to capture some pawns he could use later.

It's what gods and ascendants do, play their little games with the lives of mortals.

OK maybe 'looking' for something was the wrong phrase, but he did want Nim and co to achieve some task for him but they failed, even though he didn't say what the task was as far as i could tell.

I wouldn't say he failed, as he specifically says after Nimander is freed that Rake chose right

actually , I think it is right before he is freed, Gothos wants the others to tell Anomander he chose well.