[QuickTidal]

I was just at the store and they no longer have the old SCARAB PATH cover...which I TOTALLY loved more than the new version. Blerg.

[Mentalist]

Having read 1-8, I'm not sure i'm seeing the "3 arc" structure the same way it was visible in Malaz.

spoilers for book structure, keeping plot to minimum, but still spoilers up to and including "Air War"

Spoiler

I mean, 1-4 were a self-contained "first war with Wasps/Darakyon/Shadow Box" story. It was understandable.

then we've got 3 books "between wars"--there's definitely that feeling of buildup, but the books are so different (Khanapes/Che gets magic/discovery of oil, then Sten/underwater Kinden/spider conflicts and then Commonweal/Che learns her magic/Seda goes crazy) I wouldn't consider them a definitive "Arc". In "Air War" the war resumes, as we all knew it would, and its an awesome book, but still, I don't see a super-deep connection to previous books that would identify it as an "Arc". It's the whole story, and it's a cool story, but I feel that describing plot as arcs does it injustice

[Sinisdar Toste]

i'd have to agree with your breakdown of the 'arcs' there mentalist. in so many ways, this story mimics the story of europe from the beginning of the first world war to the end of the second. looked at in this light, i'd have to say that the story is really better described as a whole, or if you must break it apart, break it in two.

Spoiler

the three peace-time books are basically a more interesting version of the decade stenwold spent rousing the lowlands after the first capture of myna, and serve the same function of leading up to a war.

[QuickTidal]

Nearing the last 100 pages of SALUTE THE DARK

Spoiler

I swear if Thalric dies I'ma be pissed. I'll be okay with either Tisamon dying (his death has been kind of telegraphed from day 1) or Felise (though I'd really rather she got a chance to shine as something other than haunted-survivor...especially considering how badass her Kinden can be.

I'm still not loving the Solarno bits, but everything else flows quite well. I think my only complaint with the series so far are the time/location jumps. A good example was one chapter we have Teornis griping about the failed defense of Seldis, and in the next we have him already back in Collegium for the impending attack. SO unless I miss my guess Tchaikovsky is merely skipping large portions of travel and time...which is fine, it's just a bit jarring.

Otherwise I'll speculate on the final 100 pages, just for fun.

1. Seda sees her brother killed (either by Thalric or Tisamon) and becomes Empress with Brugan in charge of the military.

2. Uctebri's power hungry nature has overshadowed his plan and made him too convinced of himself, and he's killed as well, forcing the Mosquito's back into hiding.

3. Tynisa finds out about Latrimae and goes hunting for where she is trapped (cover of HEIRS OF THE BLADE anyone?)

4. Acheos dies. I have no other reason for this other than I find him fucking ANNOYING...and I'd rather see Che with Thalric.

5. With the Lowlands shored back up, and the new Wasp Empire no loner interested in conquest, the rest of the characters need new plotstrands to follow so they are established.

6. The new Wasp Empire is ACTUALLY just lying in wait and the final book arc will be WWII to the first 4-book arcs WWI.

How did I do?

[Mentalist]

 QuickTidal, on 29 November 2013 - 06:40 PM, said:

Nearing the last 100 pages of SALUTE THE DARK

Spoiler

I swear if Thalric dies I'ma be pissed. I'll be okay with either Tisamon dying (his death has been kind of telegraphed from day 1) or Felise (though I'd really rather she got a chance to shine as something other than haunted-survivor...especially considering how badass her Kinden can be.

I'm still not loving the Solarno bits, but everything else flows quite well. I think my only complaint with the series so far are the time/location jumps. A good example was one chapter we have Teornis griping about the failed defense of Seldis, and in the next we have him already back in Collegium for the impending attack. SO unless I miss my guess Tchaikovsky is merely skipping large portions of travel and time...which is fine, it's just a bit jarring.

Otherwise I'll speculate on the final 100 pages, just for fun.

1. Seda sees her brother killed (either by Thalric or Tisamon) and becomes Empress with Brugan in charge of the military.

2. Uctebri's power hungry nature has overshadowed his plan and made him too convinced of himself, and he's killed as well, forcing the Mosquito's back into hiding.

3. Tynisa finds out about Latrimae and goes hunting for where she is trapped (cover of HEIRS OF THE BLADE anyone?)

4. Acheos dies. I have no other reason for this other than I find him fucking ANNOYING...and I'd rather see Che with Thalric.

5. With the Lowlands shored back up, and the new Wasp Empire no loner interested in conquest, the rest of the characters need new plotstrands to follow so they are established.

6. The new Wasp Empire is ACTUALLY just lying in wait and the final book arc will be WWII to the first 4-book arcs WWI.

How did I do?

well

Spoiler

You're pretty much spot on for almost everything. Except 3, I think.

And Solarno bits kept me going through the tedium of Book 2. But I like the whole "primitive-aircraft-rogue-pilots" trope waaay too much ever since "TaleSpins". Damn you, Disney!

 Sinisdar Toste, on 26 November 2013 - 12:52 AM, said:

i'd have to agree with your breakdown of the 'arcs' there mentalist. in so many ways, this story mimics the story of europe from the beginning of the first world war to the end of the second. looked at in this light, i'd have to say that the story is really better described as a whole, or if you must break it apart, break it in two.

Spoiler

the three peace-time books are basically a more interesting version of the decade stenwold spent rousing the lowlands after the first capture of myna, and serve the same function of leading up to a war.

I know some people here (like Apt) picked up on the Wasp=nazis thing right away. I saw the whole story in a much more Greco-Persian context from the beginning. (and I guess being born in a totalitarian state meant the whole nazi thing just didn't phase me as much).

This was before the snap-bows and Solarno, though.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 29 November 2013 - 08:18 PM

[Mentalist]

finished "War Master's Gate". Impressions: Series keeps improving.

More generally: The war is great. Collegium (especially the

Spoiler

students' uprising

was amazing. The second front with Sarn was also well-written. Che and Seda were pulled off marvelously, and Tchaikovsky shows really well how war changes people.

The underlying theme of new killing the old was also very well done without being preachy.

My only complaint would be the very ending. I'm a bit ticked off that

Spoiler

It looks like he last book will have the world uniting against the world-destroying Worm. It just seems like a waste, and I'm guessing that the Sea Kinden will provide some kind of WMD equivalent that will end up wiping them out.

Still, will definitely read the last book, and I hope to be proven wrong.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 13 May 2014 - 04:18 AM

[End of Disc One]

Finished the fourth book, Salute the Dark. I don't normally say this, but this book probably could have been twice as long and been better for it. There were so many different threads and so much going on for such a short page count. I enjoyed it quite a bit, but I thought some moments could have hit harder if the book were longer, if that makes sense.

Spoiler

I was disappointed that Cesta, the assassin bug, died. He was badass and I wanted to see more of him, but sadly there may not be another assassin bug in the series. Hopefully I'm wrong. However I was glad that Drephos turned out to be alive since he's my favorite character. I love how he doesn't seem to care when Totho betrays him.

[Mentalist]

Okay, finally finished "Seal of the Worm". To anyone that hasn't dropped the series after "Dragonfly Falling"--this book is great. IT ends the series well.

my spoilered fear was unfounded, I'm happy to say. The Worm had their own neat little story and it worked well.

Things I really liked:

Spoiler

Ernain. And the Auxillian conspiracy to reform the Empire. It cam out pretty much left field, but it felt right

The Che-Seda dynamic--I mean, I didn't really believe that Che would sanction such a genocide, but then in the end, I almost did. I really believed that she gave up.

The Sea-Kinden. They are badass and they know it. End of story.

The new reborn Mantids. I loled at the epilogue when "the translator for the Speaker" is a Mantis-Kinden speaking for a giant Mantis.

The battles, the war.

The epilogue. it was proper and gave me sufficient closure. Especially Esmail.

Minor niggles:

Spoiler

Poor, poor Totho. sniff. I hoped he'd have a better life. Tchaikovsky did good with Che's character, he killed off the whiny Salma, but Totho he never did bring around. Just as one-dimensional and miserable. The grenades were foreshadowed so intensely that that was the only part of the ending I say coming.

Lazslo. His obsession irritated me. I always hate characters whose defining characteristic is some kind of an obcession. Laszlo was no exception. Also, Milus' death seemed contrived. There were too many pages put into the Lissart/Laszlo story, and too little payoff, imho. I did like that he seems to get over it in the epilogue, but feh.

Speaking of contrived, the Tisamon resolution. It doesn't get more Deus Ex Machina than that. It's cute and symbolic--Tisamon's soul is waiting for his friend, so its wilder aspects get to go cause all kinds of mayhem, but yeah... I wasn't convinced.

lastly, the whole "holocaust" parallel was laid on a bit too thick. I understand why, even if it took me untill Book 8 to finally admit the "Wasps= Germans" thing--I was always a Greco-Persian parallel man, myself. But ti just seemed a bit of a token gesture--"we've got proto-Nazis, we need a proto-Holocaust" I mean, why didn't Seda just use the friggin Bee-killer on the Worm?
The fact that the Slavers rejected the plan, and it was one of the reasons Ernain's plan seemed so much more sensible actually highlights this discrepancy. I dunno, it just felt odd.

Overall, really cool series. Now that it's complete, it can rank as one of the best "lighter" epic fantasy series out there.

This post has been edited by Mentalist: 02 February 2015 - 03:58 AM

[acesn8s]

I've read up through The Scarab Path. I almost stalled out on the series with book 2. I'm glad I continued on. Now that the series is complete, I should probably pick up some more of the books.

[Andorion]

Haven't looked upthread. Is this a Spoilers unblocked thread?

[Mentalist]

 Andorion, on 27 September 2015 - 01:44 AM, said:

Haven't looked upthread. Is this a Spoilers unblocked thread?

Mostly spoiler-free, except for discussions of character progression for certain chars. All very generalized.

[Andorion]

 Mentalist, on 28 September 2015 - 05:01 PM, said:

 Andorion, on 27 September 2015 - 01:44 AM, said:

Haven't looked upthread. Is this a Spoilers unblocked thread?

Mostly spoiler-free, except for discussions of character progression for certain chars. All very generalized.

Ok, so I am going to start this series soon, I think I am going to post any questions I have here.

[Andorion]

Round 10 chapters into Book 1. I am having a strange problem. I cant visualize the characters as people. I basically think of giant humanoid insects.

[Andorion]

 Briar King, on 07 October 2015 - 11:45 AM, said:

That's weird. They are human and he says it quite a bit. Skin color is the only thing strange to grasp on some Ants.

I know. Its not the authors fault. Something wrong with my brain

[acesn8s]

 Andorion, on 07 October 2015 - 11:54 AM, said:

 Briar King, on 07 October 2015 - 11:45 AM, said:

That's weird. They are human and he says it quite a bit. Skin color is the only thing strange to grasp on some Ants.

I know. Its not the authors fault. Something wrong with my brain

I have a similar issue. I also keep thinking that he took the basic D&D races and replaced them with insect archetypes. The story is still really good.

[End of Disc One]

http://shadowsofthea...ry/world/kinden

This site shows sketches of the various kinden. There shouldn't be any spoilers on that page. The layout isn't very good and you have to click on each individual "blog post" to see the pictures.

[Andorion]

 End of Disc One, on 07 October 2015 - 01:33 PM, said:

http://shadowsofthea...ry/world/kinden

This site shows sketches of the various kinden. There shouldn't be any spoilers on that page. The layout isn't very good and you have to click on each individual "blog post" to see the pictures.

Ah these do help, especially for the Mantis.

[acesn8s]

 End of Disc One, on 07 October 2015 - 01:33 PM, said:

http://shadowsofthea...ry/world/kinden

This site shows sketches of the various kinden. There shouldn't be any spoilers on that page. The layout isn't very good and you have to click on each individual "blog post" to see the pictures.

These are a lot better than the FASA style art (Shadowrun, Earthdawn, etc) he use to have up.

[Andorion]

Having finished Book1, several things strike me:

1. The very drastic magic/tech divide has the potential to become problematic.
2. Che started off as annoying but improved. Salma and Totho are now very irritating.
3. Clearly most of the major plot points are long term and will be resolved accordingly I would have liked book1 to have settled a few more issues.
4. Thalric is my favourite PoV but he is so inconsistent. All the time he parades how loyal he is, then in the same (first) book he doesn't kill Che and Stenwold

[Andorion]

 Briar King, on 12 October 2015 - 03:04 AM, said:

1 is the thing that indeed is strange throughout the 10 books. I find it hard to take in that Inapt can't even grasp the brain power to turn a doorknob which leads to quite a few sigh moments in series.

The man knows how to write out fights/battles though.

I am about 7 chapters into Book 2.

Something else that struck me - there seems to be more inapt kinden than apt

Moth, Dragonfly, Mantis, Grasshopper, Mosquito, Spider, Butterfly

Apt are only Beetle, ant, wasp, thornbug

What are fly kinden? Apt or Inapt? Same question regarding scorpions

Regarding battles I would love to read more large scale battle descriptions as his opening descriptions of the siege of Tark are very good.