NoK info - SPOILERS! - Malazan Empire

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NoK info - SPOILERS!

#401 Tenaka Khan

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Posted 23 August 2005 - 02:16 PM

Abyss said:

And to use the Deadhouse to access Meanas, he needed to enter it during the Shadowmoon.

Hm, that might explain why he/they had to create the diversion. Perhaps they would still have had easy access to the Deadhouse any normal day, but during Shadowmoon, when the DH becomes a gateway to the Throne of Shadow, the Azath would try to repell any intruders. But it still let them in, even though they used the backdoor... :Erm: so maybe the DH letting them enter wasn't the issue, but the fact that during Shadowmoon all kinds of nasty fiends stroll around the courtyard, so they had to find a way to avoid those...

#402

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Posted 28 August 2005 - 08:18 AM

HUME said:

Well I just finished it then.

One thing this didnt clarify, which I wanted it too.
When exactly did Dassem Ascend ?
Did he ascend when he 'died' ?
Did hood have a hand in it ? clearly having a Patron was a popular thing in the early days of the empire and Dassem chose hood until hood took his daughter obviously. There is also the quite (forgot who said it) "Dassem's power had grown to Rival Hoods own".
Hmm Food for thought ? when was ascension for him or was it a event over time for him ?
.

Dassem as Dessembrae has probably been an ascendant for a long time. The whole knight of hood thing I don't feel is related to his position as Lord of Tragedy.

#403 Imperial Historian

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Posted 28 August 2005 - 08:55 PM

Really? i'd say that dassem didn't become dassembrae until hood had taken his daughter... after all before that was there for him to feel tragic about?

#404 Iron Bars

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Posted 28 August 2005 - 10:11 PM

Maybe he was Dassembrae but forgot because his tragidy was to great for him (something in the same style as Icarium).

#405 Guest_moomin_*

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Posted 29 August 2005 - 09:10 AM

Quote

Is Surly actually working with Kellanved? Did she execute the purge due to orders, or a plan, of Kellanved's so that the Shadow Realm/Deadhouse (I'm not sure how the two of them are connected really) would be left relatively unguarded at the crucial moment?

Just a memory from reading GotM, but didn't the T'lan Imass go wild at some point, and slaughter a city, while Laseen was the Empress? Can't rembember if it was the same as this purge of Malaz.

And we all know who sits on the Imass throne.

#406 Tenaka Khan

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Posted 29 August 2005 - 09:33 AM

I guess you refer to the slaughter at Aren. But that was still during the time Kellanved was sitting on both the empire's and the throne of the T'lan Imass (that's the First throne, no?).

#407 Guest_moomin_*

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Posted 29 August 2005 - 12:25 PM

ok, then my memory was off quite a bit

#408

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Posted 29 August 2005 - 01:24 PM

Imperial Historian said:

Really? i'd say that dassem didn't become dassembrae until hood had taken his daughter... after all before that was there for him to feel tragic about?

K'rul to Envy on Hood's taking of Dassem's daughter...
"... Dassem his champion, Dessembrae....who's power had grown to rival Hood's own"

the sentence indicates that Dassem was Dessembrae, and a powerful individual, before Hood took his daughter. so what happened to the girl's mother?

#409 Abyss

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Posted 30 August 2005 - 09:24 PM

re: Patronage - I had the impression patron gods or mages chose their champion, not the other way around. Sure, any idiot with a sword could worship Hood, but not just anyone is selected by Hood to handle a portion of his power.

Also, considering the hint Dassem had killed off a bunch of Hood's priests, and considering what happened when Temper tried to stab Dassem to wake him up, i wonder whether once a champion is selected bya power, that selection cannot be withdrawn. Ie: the CG never de-championed Karsa in HoC.

As for Dassem ascending and becoming Dessembrae, we assume that he's actually done so and become a god. But if he's Traveller, he didn't seem very godlike in HoC. I wonder if perhaps he hasn't gone all the way with the godhood thing.

- Abyss, has gone all the way with, well, nevermind, TMI, forget i said anything...

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#410

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Posted 30 August 2005 - 09:46 PM

Abyss said:

As for Dassem ascending and becoming Dessembrae, we assume that he's actually done so and become a god. But if he's Traveller, he didn't seem very godlike in HoC. I wonder if perhaps he hasn't gone all the way with the godhood thing.

makes me think of Rake spending time as a guard somewhere for a number of years? he probably didn't appear very god-like either

#411 vaiski

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Posted 31 August 2005 - 05:57 AM

Abyss said:

But if he's Traveller, he didn't seem very godlike in HoC. I wonder if perhaps he hasn't gone all the way with the godhood thing.

Dunno about godhood, but there is this line in HoC:
"Thank your god, mortal", for the sword."

So, ascendant at least.

#412

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Posted 31 August 2005 - 06:53 AM

nice catch Vaiski

#413 Abyss

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Posted 31 August 2005 - 03:23 PM

Hetan said:

makes me think of Rake spending time as a guard somewhere for a number of years? he probably didn't appear very god-like either

Ahhh, but altho' tremendously powerful, strictly speaking, Rake isn't a god.

Vaiski's Traveller-quote is spot on, but then, i do not doubt whether he was Dassem or not, Traveller was Ascendent.

- Abyss, transcendent.

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#414

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Posted 31 August 2005 - 04:13 PM

Abyss said:

ok.. he didn't appear very ascendant-like..... if we are discussing semantics:D

#415 Abyss

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Posted 31 August 2005 - 08:56 PM

But he knew the secret handshake and EVERYthing.

- Abyss, also knows the password.

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#416

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Posted 20 September 2005 - 02:47 PM

Interesting snippet just came to my attention.......It mentions in DG that Baudin's father was at Deadhouse the night of the assassinations :eek:
I wonder if he was among the Talon or Shadow cult then?

#417 Hume

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Posted 21 September 2005 - 12:46 AM

^^

Talon me thinks.

#418

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 02:53 PM

anyone else notice the bit about Jaghut coming from another world?

I'd like to know how many others have sat on the Throne of Shadow too...

#419 Set'alahd Crool

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 03:26 PM

Hetan said:

anyone else notice the bit about Jaghut coming from another world?

I'd like to know how many others have sat on the Throne of Shadow too...

I thought it was the stormriders that came from aother world. Edgewalker(gotta love that guy) said it was rumoured they came to the malazan world when the Jaghut wrought their sorcery too powerfully.

As for other rulers of shadow, Jhedel is intriguing. What is he? Who deposed him? Edgewalker(gotta love that guy) was about to tell him but he wanted to remember himself....

On the Temper-as-guardian issue, I got the impression that he took over the role(s) left by Faro and Trenech. He did say he thought he'd be staying in the Hanged Man for quite some time. It sounded like he knew what he was talking about.
Maybe when an azath's chief guardian is a prisoner(unlike Moby who chose to enter) the house will choose another, outside, to help keep them a prisoner. So if Gothos tries to escape Temper will be there....

Or not, I suppose.

#420

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Posted 09 November 2005 - 03:50 PM

Yep.. you're right about the Jaghut...I mis-read a word last night and posted without checking... however

Shadow House is alive... and alien to the realm of Shadow .. and it was the Jaghut that allowed it into this world..(the bit I cocked up)

Jhedel was a demon lord wasn't he?... from the distant edges of Shadow?

I agree Edgewalker is another one of those characters that you know so little about, but you just LOVE him! like Silchas Ruin..although he is SE's of course.
It was interesting that he was going to step into the fray against the Jaghut Jhenna to prevent her entering the realm of shadow... so why not the same with Kellanved? I mean he's obviously powerful, because he felt he could do it..

Addition: If the First Throne is not empty - because kellanved ascended and did not die.. Then surely the rules apply for the Throne of Shadow (Emurlahn).. Scabandari is not dead.