[Cougar]

I don't buy the idea that he doesn't write male homos because he isn't comfortable or is repulsed by it, I've forgotten the dudes name but the Letherii chancellor is a pederast isn't he and I find a guy raping little boys a whole lot more disturbing than two consenting males.

[Osric]

I do have to agree that publishing wise they probably don't want any gay sex scenes in there.. Too many people really dont like it.

[Blend]

 Osric, on Oct 6 2008, 04:37 PM, said:

I do have to agree that publishing wise they probably don't want any gay sex scenes in there.. Too many people really dont like it.

I'm sure, however, that that is slowly changing, at least in these here parts.... Homosexuality is becoming more and more accepted in most of the world, so just like we're seeing gay male relationships crop up all over television, it'll eventually make its way into literature, I'm sure!

[Pig Iron]

Errant is true. Anyway, to see how it should be done (no innuendos there for sure) read Morgan's latest, "The Steel Remains". Cool with a main gay character where his sexuality is not depicted in a condescending way or coupled with perversion (though I have no idea how a gay reader would see it).

[Abyss]

Keep in mind we're also talking about an author who has women take on a roughly equivalent role as men in most military situations. SE has thought about, and addressed, gender roles. He hasn't spent time on a male same sex relationship, but its not as tho there is some rule that he's obliged to.

- Abyss, would be curious about a gay perspective on The Steel Remains and goes to post accordingly...

[Use Of Weapons]

I've only read three authors who had outright gay MM sex scenes. Mercedes Lackey (Magic's Pawn etc, plus several other out gay male characters, including one _screaming_ queen in Firesong k'Treva); Diane Duane (Door into .... series); Lynn Flewelling (can't remember the titles, but I remember thinking that she'd at least done her research! ) There are others who hint at it. Butcher does the whole vampire homoeroticism thing with Thomas, of course.

[Blend]

 jitsukerr, on Oct 7 2008, 04:55 PM, said:

I've only read three authors who had outright gay MM sex scenes. Mercedes Lackey (Magic's Pawn etc, plus several other out gay male characters, including one _screaming_ queen in Firesong k'Treva); Diane Duane (Door into .... series); Lynn Flewelling (can't remember the titles, but I remember thinking that she'd at least done her research! ) There are others who hint at it. Butcher does the whole vampire homoeroticism thing with Thomas, of course.

Fiona Patton plays with it too... The Painter Knight was a total feg. *nods*

[SiriusL]

 Abyss, on Oct 6 2008, 03:42 PM, said:

He hasn't spent time on a male same sex relationship, but its not as tho there is some rule that he's obliged to.

It could be that it just hasn't come up. Thinking about it, there are a lot of characters whose sexuality is never an issue, so it's probably not important to the plot. Picker and Blend are important to the plot, as is their relatioship. If Mappo or Shadowthrone is gay, it doesn't really matter, so SE doesn't mention it.

[Blend]

 SiriusL, on Oct 7 2008, 04:48 PM, said:

 Abyss, on Oct 6 2008, 03:42 PM, said:

He hasn't spent time on a male same sex relationship, but its not as tho there is some rule that he's obliged to.

It could be that it just hasn't come up. Thinking about it, there are a lot of characters whose sexuality is never an issue, so it's probably not important to the plot. Picker and Blend are important to the plot, as is their relatioship. If Mappo or Shadowthrone is gay, it doesn't really matter, so SE doesn't mention it.

LoL, yeah, we all know Cotillion is gay eh? I mean, with a name like that... And his nickname is The Rope... Gee, I wonder why....

[alt146]

Clive Barker also has several outright gay characters, as well as several gay sex scenes. That said he's gay himself. Very good books though

[Dancer+]

 Blend, on Oct 7 2008, 06:35 PM, said:

 SiriusL, on Oct 7 2008, 04:48 PM, said:

 Abyss, on Oct 6 2008, 03:42 PM, said:

He hasn't spent time on a male same sex relationship, but its not as tho there is some rule that he's obliged to.

It could be that it just hasn't come up. Thinking about it, there are a lot of characters whose sexuality is never an issue, so it's probably not important to the plot. Picker and Blend are important to the plot, as is their relatioship. If Mappo or Shadowthrone is gay, it doesn't really matter, so SE doesn't mention it.

LoL, yeah, we all know Cotillion is gay eh? I mean, with a name like that... And his nickname is The Rope... Gee, I wonder why....

Because he likes catching males with his rope and seducing them? Or perhaps he may just use a Rope like the First Sword uses a Sword and he may just excel/like dancing; you never know.

[zwitterion]

 Abyss, on Oct 6 2008, 11:42 PM, said:

Keep in mind we're also talking about an author who has women take on a roughly equivalent role as men in most military situations. SE has thought about, and addressed, gender roles. He hasn't spent time on a male same sex relationship, but its not as tho there is some rule that he's obliged to.

no he's not obliged to but he wasn't obliged to point out how scillara had enjoyed womanflesh before too, or make female homoerotic references in his description of festival behaviour, the point is you'd think with all the "no in this world it's totally normal and cool everyone does it" he puts forward for lesbianism, there'd be at least a passing mention of male gayness being acceptable too. But as others have pointed out the only references are of it are in pederasts and deviants.

[Sinisdar Toste]

just puttin this out there... you can take it, or you can leave it, but think about it... pores and kindly.

[Perashaman]

Regarding Challice and Gorlas..

I'm pretty sure that somewhere it says that Gorlas was completely uninterested in her sexually. And aren't there also a couple sly jokes from his "friends" about him not taking care of business with Challice?

I definitely got the distinct impression that Gorlas was gay.

Mappo - Icarium ... that gay lovefest would tear down mountains.

[polishgenius]

 Cougar, on Oct 6 2008, 04:44 PM, said:

I don't buy the idea that he doesn't write male homos because he isn't comfortable or is repulsed by it, I've forgotten the dudes name but the Letherii chancellor is a pederast isn't he and I find a guy raping little boys a whole lot more disturbing than two consenting males.

There's a vast difference though between making one of your major characters gay and making an eeeeeeeevil dude a boy-raper to make him seem more eeeeevil. In the latter, the whole point is that people are uncomfortable, something already raised in this thread.


Vellum, by Hal Duncan, has a male gay relationship presented well, I thought- it's just there, no big deal out of it whatsoever, and no point-making explicit gay sex scenes either (which to me is a far better way of making the point about equality than making your gay hero have as much explicit man-sex as possible, which is just going to make those who don't like it off completely). The sequel makes more of an issue out of it, but that might have been the point, and it's not majorly.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

Sirryn Kanar was gay, as I recall. Yet another reason for me to hate him.

I reckon, if you're gonna write about homosexuality in fiction, best to be casual about it. Unless it's meant to be discriminated against.

[Azure Horizon]

 Ain't_It_Just_, on Oct 25 2008, 11:35 PM, said:

Sirryn Kanar was gay, as I recall. Yet another reason for me to hate him.

I reckon, if you're gonna write about homosexuality in fiction, best to be casual about it. Unless it's meant to be discriminated against.

Wow, that's really homophobic dude. On what grounds does a character's sexuality make them a character to be hated?

[Aptorian]

I believe AIJ was reffering to Sirryns tendency to force himself upon weaker boys in the Letherii guard, etc. Not that he hated gays. At least I hope that's what he ment.

Apt, has a love/hate thing going on with Richard Simmons.

[Azure Horizon]

 Aptorian, on Oct 29 2008, 02:09 PM, said:

I believe AIJ was reffering to Sirryns tendency to force himself upon weaker boys in the Letherii guard, etc. Not that he hated gays. At least I hope that's what he ment.

Apt, has a love/hate thing going on with Richard Simmons.

I hope so too. =P

I do remember hating Sirryn for his viciousness towards everyone, not really his sexual proclivities. Though they were perverse.

[Ain't_It_Just_]

 Aptorian, on Oct 30 2008, 08:09 AM, said:

I believe AIJ was reffering to Sirryns tendency to force himself upon weaker boys in the Letherii guard, etc. Not that he hated gays. At least I hope that's what he ment.

Apt, has a love/hate thing going on with Richard Simmons.

In deed.

Like when he had COWARDLY fled the Letherii army (read his thoughts during that time, makes you really pissed) and was let inside by a sentry, and decided to have some playtime with him. Douchebag.