[Blend]

Urizen, on Oct 6 2008, 06:56 PM, said:

Maybe Clip will appear in Dust of Dreams. It's supposed to take place on Lether, right? I can see Clip going back there in a hissy fit because the Andii in Black Coral will not fall over and worship the ground he walks on.

I seem to remember Erikson stating that the last two books would take place mainly on a continent we've never seen before. I firmly believe, however, that we will see Lether, Darujhistan and even Seven Cities some more in side stories.

[Lisheo]

The first quarter of DoD is taking place on Lether, I believe. We depart for places unknown after the Book One part, I think someone said in an older topic.

[dawnkiller]

Considering how much time Clip spent harping on the fact that he was in touch with True Dark in RG I'd love to see how he takes the real Mother Dark being back in play -- a good deal of his personality seems to be shaped by outright delusion ("I'm the Herald of Mother Dark and Mortal Sword of Anomander Rake!" "Uh . . . sure."), so having indisputable fact pushed in his face might be interesting. Granted you would have thought being possessed by the Dying God would have done it, but there's probably a good deal of denial there -- especially when you think about how horrific and confidence-shattering the idea that you were utterly taken over and powerless to stop it is, especially for someone of Clip's ego. I can almost forgive him for trying to believe he somehow crowbarred Bellurdan out himself -- he doesn't have much else to hang on to.

I was going to add that I'd hope for a turn into Awesome, as happened with Kallor, but alas, unlike Kallor in MoI we've seen Clip's internal monologue all along, so it's unlikely there will be surprises there. I think he really is just that petty.

[Jude]

Yeah I think Clip WOULD win for the biggest loser in the Malazan books if not for one other character that comes to mind. As much as I hated him in RG (being a bigger dick than everyone in Team Fear Sengar is pretty hard to do) I think I liked him even less in TtH. That's not to say I didn't like his character. I just loved to hate him. And I didn't find MUCH of a change in TtH except for that he seemed a little less sassy and sarcastic and just more unhappy and arrogant.

Anyway, completely off topic, the guy who DOES win the "Biggest Loser Award" for me has to be Redmask. He sucked SO bad.

[Urizen]

Jude, on Oct 9 2008, 01:03 AM, said:

Yeah I think Clip WOULD win for the biggest loser in the Malazan books if not for one other character that comes to mind. As much as I hated him in RG (being a bigger dick than everyone in Team Fear Sengar is pretty hard to do) I think I liked him even less in TtH. That's not to say I didn't like his character. I just loved to hate him. And I didn't find MUCH of a change in TtH except for that he seemed a little less sassy and sarcastic and just more unhappy and arrogant.

Anyway, completely off topic, the guy who DOES win the "Biggest Loser Award" for me has to be Redmask. He sucked SO bad.

Why does eveyone hate Redmask? I sort of liked him (early on at least), Warrior coming back to save his people from the selfish sanctiomnious Letheri and all that. What messed things up was the ending. No explanation why the KCCM first followed him, only to turn later? Was Redmask a Letheri himself? then who was he and how did get the Awl knowledge and skills.

While she might not displace Clip for the "Biggest Loser Award", high on the List (top 5 at least) you have to put Antri- Preda Bivatt, Redmask's oppnent.

[Lisheo]

Redmask:Hey, Ill go over here, whip these people into something like an army, and then- *chop* AGH, SHIT, KCCM BODYGUARDS, WTF ARE YOU GUYS DOING!
I didnt actually mind Bivatt, at least she didnt have delusions of grandeur of being the Herald of the Prime Mover lols

[Throne]

I believe the story of the Tiste Andii in Black Coral is finished there. Mother Dark is back with them, Nimander rules and Clip is an eternal mosquito but in the least insignificant.

In my opinion only Korlat will show up in future books.

[Lisheo]

Spinnock Durav only being a one book wonder? No, if that was true SE would have let him die...

[Throne]

Lisheo, on Oct 9 2008, 12:58 PM, said:

Spinnock Durav only being a one book wonder? No, if that was true SE would have let him die...

Okay, him too. But the Tiste in Black Coral are out of the story I think

[Lisheo]

I suspect Black Coral won't appear in the MBotF again, but I would't be surprised if Black Coral appears in one of the other trilogies SE is writing.

[dawnkiller]

(Okay, not Clip-related, but I think if we're going for Most Annoying I vote for any Letherii Interchangable Letherii Beaurocrat, ever, especially from RG. Whoever was holding, uh . . . Janeth? Whatever her name was hostage, comes to mind.)

[flea]

Throne, on Oct 9 2008, 05:47 AM, said:

Lisheo, on Oct 9 2008, 12:58 PM, said:

Spinnock Durav only being a one book wonder? No, if that was true SE would have let him die...

Okay, him too. But the Tiste in Black Coral are out of the story I think

Makes sense, with one exception: They have unfinished business with the Edur. Yes, that will be Ruin's role, but who knows what warren travel might accomplish?

I can't say much about Clip unless we get some of his pov. We could never really get a sense of him since he never really interacted with the others. I could see him as a minion of the CG, since he seems to have a damaged psyche, but I wouldn't count on it.

[Lisheo]

I think the CG would look on anything related to the Dying God with scorn, to be honest. He was a malicious child compared to the CG.
Who, I might add, is now able to give his worshippers what he promised... He can take their souls in death now, cant he? Giving them that heaven his religion is about...

[Urizen]

Lisheo, on Oct 9 2008, 07:49 AM, said:

I didnt actually mind Bivatt, at least she didnt have delusions of grandeur of being the Herald of the Prime Mover lols

I couldn't stand Bivatt, her only redeeming action was that she didn't let the Edur characters (Brohl something?) get murdered by the Factor's agents. She went along with the whole Geoncide against the Awl idea despite knowing that everything only served to line the Factor's purse. She didn't show any real competence either.

Throne, on Oct 9 2008, 10:51 AM, said:

I believe the story of the Tiste Andii in Black Coral is finished there. Mother Dark is back with them, Nimander rules and Clip is an eternal mosquito but in the least insignificant.

In my opinion only Korlat will show up in future books.

I hope we see more of Nimander and the Tiste Andii in Black Coral. Hopefully we'll get some connection to Yan Tovis and the Shake, they are supposed to be Andii descendants after all. A Mother Dark and Silchas Rain meeting would not be uninteresting either.

[Notelrac]

Lisheo, on Oct 9 2008, 03:49 AM, said:

Redmask:Hey, Ill go over here, whip these people into something like an army, and then- *chop* AGH, SHIT, KCCM BODYGUARDS, WTF ARE YOU GUYS DOING!

Redmask was doing fine until his tragic flaw tripped him up. Until he gave in to the impulse to murder the old guy who knew he was half-Letheri, his military tactics were outstanding. Then his hubris cut in, and he attempted a more conventional battle.

I'm still wondering how he convinced the K'chain to follow him.

[Jude]

Hahaha guys guys. I'm not saying I didn't like Redmask. Quite the contrary actually. I just thought he was a huge loser. I took him as Erikson's parody on the whole underdog uprising story. This awesome hardcore leader with some powerful friends rallies his people together to fight the evil corrupt empire that's oppressing them; even wins his first skirmish against them. Then you get slapped in the face back to reality and realize, "yeah wait a minute.. how could we think that one tribe could stand up against such a powerful and ruthless enemy." And just to make sure the message hits home, he's taken apart by his "powerful friends" for being that dumb and sucking that much. Tragic really, but still, if that's what SE was doing there, then I think that the redmask plot was awesome just in the sense that nothing came of it... for the moment atleast.

As for team nimander showing up again, I don't know if I think they will, but then, I was pretty sure Tehol and co weren't going to show up past RG either and everyone else is sure they will. So I'm probably very wrong about both haha.

[Lisheo]

Actually Jude, that makes a damn fine amount of sense... I can almost forgive Redmask for being such a loser now lols.
Aye Tehol and co appear in DoD, where SE is apparantly gonna finish of their story, as the Bolkando alliance(now real) attacks Lether, I think.

[Jude]

That's awesome then! It sounds like not only an excuse to bring back the lovable duo, but a potentially good plot line as well. So is everyone to assume then that the rest of the series will take place on the unexplored part of lether?

[Ain't_It_Just_]

The wildlands in Lether are like the Bermuda Triangle. So who knows where the storyline might go?

[Traveller]

Quick thought on Redmask - his mask was made from the skin of a K'Chain Matron, wasn't it? (no quote, but I'm positive this is mentioned)

This, I think, was why the hunters followed him and defended him.

My theory is that during the battle with Bivatt, in the total mudbath, the mask got covered with mud, along with everything else - again, I'm sure it's mentioned that Redmask escapes during this muddy brawl, where everything is indistinguishable.

He rides off, and.. the K'ell hunters cut him up. Maybe the mask was covered, and the Matrons influence was negated, so they just killed him along with everyone else in their path.

This post has been edited by Traveller: 15 October 2008 - 10:59 AM