[Sinisdar Toste]

my two cents on the k'chain:

they are not native to burn, or SD, but were truly the first descendants of dragons
they develop in stages like khellendros says
they came to burn through warren, not outer space
their technology was developed on their home world and led them to discover the warren of kaschan which enabled them to make anti-grav and traverse the warrens eventually coming to burn. (this part is pure speculation)
they are looking for a triumphant return re. the over 9000 skykeeps in the imperial warren

[Traveller]

Does anyone else have a problem visualising reptiles welding and building the technology described? Let alone flying it. The k'ell hunters behave, well, like 'rapters with swords! Hacking everything to bits in a frenzy of blood and hair.
What do they do later; sit down and have a review of their strategy, weld on a couple more swords, and order a skykeep air attack?

[BeLeG]

well the K'ell hunters are KCCM -and they are devoted to chaos
the short tails-Nah'ruk have the technological advanced culture-these ones are devoted to Order

[Aptorian]

BeLeg do you have a quote that states that Longtails are devoted to chaos and shorttails are devoted to order? Because I only remember that as a forum theory.

[Illuyankas]

The Jaghut Paran freed that was killed by the KCNR says so.

[BeLeG]

Aptorian I am sure there is a mention(in MT or tBH?) about the long tails being the truly chaotic ones in contrast to the Short-tails but It will take some time to find it since I dont remember which character said those words

[Old Hunch Arbat]

Traveller;357387 said:

Does anyone else have a problem visualising reptiles welding and building the technology described? Let alone flying it. The k'ell hunters behave, well, like 'rapters with swords! Hacking everything to bits in a frenzy of blood and hair.
What do they do later; sit down and have a review of their strategy, weld on a couple more swords, and order a skykeep air attack?

I couldn't agree with you more - despite the fact that you didn't make a statement but, rather, posed a question. But the questions are rhetorical, I know.

The combination of T-Rex physiology (including big sharp claws and big pointy teeth) and the notion that such beasts postulated, proved, and then commercialized the use of something looking much like the Unified Field Theory is so gratingly discordant that, frankly, I haven't actually spent much time considering it. Now that you pose the questions however, not debating this seems much like the "Elephant in the Living Room" problem (if that "Elephant..." quote seems odd, ignore it. It's a counseling/therapy concept). Needless to say Traveler's observations are spot on.

So...do the KCCM have factories full of little endentured Shake witches or other humanoids, running computer controlled assembly lines or do they employ unionized KCCM laborers, all collecting pay cheques and paying into KCCM retirement benefit plans who, after 25 years of service retire to the condo communities on the shores of the Otataral Sea?

OHA

[D'rek]

Who is to say that just because we are sentient and live in a particular way, that another species of sentient creatures would be at all similar?

If the Jaghut, despite being so very similar to humans physically, can live so differently, why can't sentient lizards who are extremely different from humans have a seemingly bizarre lifestyle that combines their extreme technological advancement with a continuance of their primal roots?

[Illuyankas]

"I'm sorry, I have difficulty believing that a race of dinosaurs created so much technology, or used swords."

Uh, OK. I have two points. Point one, the swords are magically welded to the arms of the warrior K'Chain Che'Malle, while the K'Chain Nah'Ruk seem to be more hand-eye coordinated and able to wield swords themselves.

Point two. Which word of the previous sentence is the key one? Here's a hint: it ends in 'agically'.

YOU ARE NITPICKING A SERIES WITH SENTIENT HUGE FUCK-OFF LIZARDS THAT CAN FLY AND HAVE MAGIC, AND SEVERAL ALIEN RACES CREATED BY MAGICAL CREATURES THAT ALL HAPPEN TO BE ABLE TO INTERBREED AT WILL, BECAUSE ONE OF THESE MAGIC RACES, ONE THAT CAN MAKE MOUNTAINS FLOAT AND HAS KILLED THE UNIVERSE, DOESN'T SEEM TO BE ABLE TO DO ALL THIS DESPITE BEING A PART OF A WORLD WITH A LOT MORE RANDOM SHIT GOING ON

There's suspension of disbelief and then there's just pedantry, OK?

[Aptorian]

Do you think Matrons give their children eskimokisses?

[Old Hunch Arbat]

Illuyankas;357990YOU ARE NITPICKING A SERIES WITH SENTIENT HUGE FUCK-OFF LIZARDS THAT CAN FLY AND HAVE MAGIC, on AND SEVERAL ALIEN RACES CREATED BY MAGICAL CREATURES THAT ALL HAPPEN TO BE ABLE TO INTERBREED AT WILL, BECAUSE ONE OF THESE MAGIC RACES, ONE THAT CAN MAKE MOUNTAINS FLOAT AND HAS KILLED THE UNIVERSE, DOESN, said:

SEEM[/I] TO BE ABLE TO DO ALL THIS DESPITE BEING A PART OF A WORLD WITH A LOT MORE RANDOM SHIT GOING ON

There's suspension of disbelief and then there's just pedantry, OK?

Holy shit, my ears are ringing.

OHA

[Old Hunch Arbat]

Now that what's his name has had his temper tantrum, let's get back to mocking the KCCM.

OHA

[Old Hunch Arbat]

Can they hold pencils?

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

BeLeG;357511 said:

Aptorian I am sure there is a mention(in MT or tBH?) about the long tails being the truly chaotic ones in contrast to the Short-tails but It will take some time to find it since I dont remember which character said those words

Nope. Short tails are the meaner ones. No, I have no page numbers. Illy, be nice. Old Hunch, quit triple posting.

[BeLeG]

When I return from Santorini(Thyra) in 4 days I will search for that quote(but first I will have to find the right book )
Since I am not English I cant imagine myself creating quotes in english that exist only in my mind( I remember the phrase "the truly chaotic ones" describing the long tails)
oh well...until I find it,I'm wrong
If I never find it I will consider stop reading books in english-they mess with my mind

[Traveller]

Illuyankas;357990 said:

YOU ARE NITPICKING A SERIES WITH SENTIENT HUGE FUCK-OFF LIZARDS THAT CAN FLY AND HAVE MAGIC, AND SEVERAL ALIEN RACES CREATED BY MAGICAL CREATURES THAT ALL HAPPEN TO BE ABLE TO INTERBREED AT WILL, BECAUSE ONE OF THESE MAGIC RACES, ONE THAT CAN MAKE MOUNTAINS FLOAT AND HAS KILLED THE UNIVERSE, DOESN'T SEEM TO BE ABLE TO DO ALL THIS DESPITE BEING A PART OF A WORLD WITH A LOT MORE RANDOM SHIT GOING ON

There's suspension of disbelief and then there's just pedantry, OK?

Was only asking...!! Yow. If it wasn't for pedantry, this whole forum would be a lot smaller.
So, Tyrannosaurs in spaceships...

[biblioholic]

Aptorian;357993 said:

Do you think Matrons give their children eskimokisses?

Of course the Matrons give their children eskimokisses. Isn't that what she gave Toc the Younger when they were together?

[Dance]

Old Hunch Arbat;357563 said:

I couldn't agree with you more - despite the fact that you didn't make a statement but, rather, posed a question. But the questions are rhetorical, I know.

The combination of T-Rex physiology (including big sharp claws and big pointy teeth) and the notion that such beasts postulated, proved, and then commercialized the use of something looking much like the Unified Field Theory is so gratingly discordant that, frankly, I haven't actually spent much time considering it. Now that you pose the questions however, not debating this seems much like the "Elephant in the Living Room" problem (if that "Elephant..." quote seems odd, ignore it. It's a counseling/therapy concept). Needless to say Traveler's observations are spot on.

So...do the KCCM have factories full of little endentured Shake witches or other humanoids, running computer controlled assembly lines or do they employ unionized KCCM laborers, all collecting pay cheques and paying into KCCM retirement benefit plans who, after 25 years of service retire to the condo communities on the shores of the Otataral Sea?

OHA

I always think of them like ants.

You have the queen (Matron). The "center" of the KCCM hive/colony structure.
The soldiers (Hunters). Obviously designed to fight.

Now, given the above, why wouldn't they also have Workers and (possibly) Thinkers? Or Artisans, Builders, etc. We only see the KCCM in conflicts, thus the hunters - if we saw an actual KCCM colony, it would be quite different. Judging the race on the fights we've seen them in would be like trying to extrapolate US culture from watching bits and peices of the Vietnam War.

[Old Hunch Arbat]

Quote

Now, given the above, why wouldn't they also have Workers and (possibly) Thinkers? Or Artisans, Builders, etc. We only see the KCCM in conflicts, thus the hunters - if we saw an actual KCCM colony, it would be quite different. Judging the race on the fights we've seen them in would be like trying to extrapolate US culture from watching bits and peices of the Vietnam War.

Excellent point.

OHA

[Lisheo]

Very good point indeed Dance. Also, the Jaghut have arms and so on, they were the KCCM slaves, they learnt how to build technology from somewhere. As odd as this sounds, perhaps they were enslaved by the KCNR who can def build, taught how to design all these things for the KCCM who decided that now they have slaves, who needs hands. Lets all get sword arms!

Lisheo, will get spork arms once he subjugates the human race.