[Abyss]

I disagree re AG - the warren is the 'flavour' of power related to summoning and binding demons, not the world the demon or the power itself comes from. Like the spirit magic Nil and Nether use, it's a different style, more like Mokra than Meanas.

Some warrens are physical spaces / dimensions where you can take a stroll, some are not. Some warrens are 'dimensions', not all dimenions are warrens. Aral Gamelon is not a space, it's a technique or a talent.

Demons are basically any non-human dwelling in a warren / dimension other than the Malazan world. The Kenyryla world is not the same as the corner of Meanas the Aptorians and that other boreal race with two penises live. Greyfrog came from still another dimension. The Nascent is stil another, likely a chunk of KE that was floating around until Rhulad flooded it from the Kenyryla world.

Notice in MoI how QB undoes the binding on Bauchelain's demon - he doesn't send it back where it came from, he just removes (most of) bauchelain's control over it. Loric doesn't bind Greyfrog at all, rather, he invites him along. But Trull releases Petal - a Kenrynylyhoweveryouspellthat, who was bound by Edur witches or Krisnan and who subsequently just vanishes and goes home.

So, like everything else in SE's world, there is no hard and fast rule for any of the elements at work when it comes to demons.


- Abyss, can be summoned for a low monthly fee...

[Aptorian]

Abyss;293950 said:

I disagree re AG - the warren is the 'flavour' of power related to summoning and binding demons, not the world the demon or the power itself comes from. Like the spirit magic Nil and Nether use, it's a different style, more like Mokra than Meanas.

See that was also my impression, but there's some mention of Aral Gamelon as an actual place in RG.

Now of course I could just be remembering it wrong, but it gave the distinct impression that the world the kenrylalala come from is Aral Gamelon.

[Tarr]

Perhaps this would explain why there is so many different species that seem to come from Aral Gameleon, but I do not think it likely.

The demons are quoted as coming from Aral Gameleon (I think the one quick releases is) so I think it is actually a world like Wu instead of an flavour like mockra. If there is a flavour for demon summoning it would probably be Hoods path (see quick ben and bauchelins talk in MOI).

[Ain't_It_Just_]

Tarr;294123 said:

Perhaps this would explain why there is so many different species that seem to come from Aral Gameleon, but I do not think it likely.

The demons are quoted as coming from Aral Gameleon (I think the one quick releases is) so I think it is actually a world like Wu instead of an flavour like mockra. If there is a flavour for demon summoning it would probably be Hoods path (see quick ben and bauchelins talk in MOI).

Weird... there's been no Death-aspected demons, you'd think there Shadow would be the flavour for demon summoning....

[Aptorian]

Actually, weren't there demons that attacked Paran and the Trygalle when they went through Hoods warren? or was that just dead people.

[Abyss]

Aptorian;294231 said:

Actually, weren't there demons that attacked Paran and the Trygalle when they went through Hoods warren? or was that just dead people.

Both - two different stages of the trip. And the demons that time were like aggressive ape thingies.

- Abyss, wants a banana.

[Aptorian]

So there are death demons... of a sort. I'm guessing that's where Sirynn is right now.

[Abyss]

Put it this way - if animals, gods, ascendents, dragons and humans can be aspected to a particular warren, element or power, there's no reason why demons can't.

By easiest example, there is clearly something of Shadow in what the Aptorian Matron does to Panek in DG, and the thing the Azalan does to hold the wall together while Kalam is climbing in HoC.

- Abyss, is relieved he remembered 'Azalan' because typing 'Two-Penis demon' was getting distrubing...

[Tarr]

But are demons from Aral Gameleon aspected or is it just those from elemental warrens? e.g. Aptorians, Dead monkeys, andii and jaghut...

What about the lord of the Galayan I got the impression from his weapon and rakes speech that he was aspected to light and perhaps the Koravali? (quick uses it in the rooftop) is from shadow or a shadow fragment.

[Aptorian]

Your guess is as good as ours.

[Raraku]

I think in the convo between QB and Bauchelin in MOI Aral Gameleon is close to Chaos or atleast the path that Bauchelin uses is and also he isnt affected by the CG s attack on the warrens then. Maybe demons are really alien in the same way that the CG is.

[Abyss]

That's a ref to the power to summon and bind a being to your will being close to chaos. AG is not a warren in the way Meanas is.

Not all dimensions/spaces/planets/whatever are warrens the way Meanas is. Meanas specifically is a chunk of Kurald Emurlahn that broke free.

The Galayn Lord wasn't identified as aspected to anything - Rake was waxing poetic (see: 'Anomandaris, by Fisher Cal Tech ).


- Abyss, bets Rake is a big e.e. cummings fan...

[Tarr]

But is the world the demon Lilac describes Aral Gameleon or is it something else?

Plus from what cot and the three dragons said I got the impression there are a few world like Wu out there.

[Blacksox]

The best example of a summoning in the MBOTF imo is the fall of the cripple god. It required a ritual and luring him into a trap. Seems like the binding failed big time. But, it seems the summoning we have the most written information on.

[Tarr]

Also what about in MT that bit where the mage tries to bind a Forkul Assail, it obviously failed but why?

[Aptorian]

Because you don't bind a Forkrul Assail

They are impervious to magic.

[Tarr]

Isn't that toblaki? and if not do you have a quote to back it up?

To quote yourself "quote or it didn't happen"

[Aptorian]

I'm not going to quote it, but when the K'risnan tried to protect Rhulad, she simply threw his power back at him. He was rebuffed like a child being slapped over the hand.

[Tarr]

Ruin did the same thing! he's not immune to sorcery, he simply used his own sorcery to do it.

[Abyss]

Aptorian;295747 said:

I'm not going to quote it, but when the K'risnan tried to protect Rhulad, she simply threw his power back at him. He was rebuffed like a child being slapped over the hand.

That FA (Serenity) was male, and iirc, it didn't throw it back so much as ignore it. But some quotes would help here...

*fires up the Vaiski (or anyone) signal*

- Abyss, gender-vague...