[thompsjt1]

I am in "The Fete" section of gardens of the moon and am completely confused on the whole part from the awaking of the Jaghut and come out of nowhere dragons, to some sort of confrontation with Kruppe?? yet he was in the city and then ends up where the Jaghut is, then is back in the city again and everyone starts bumping into each other and there seems to be mass confusion at the Fete in the city and then people start loosing body parts and blood is everwhere and quick ben mentions the gas below the city and the jaghut is possessing people.........This is all my understanding of all this mess and I have no clue what the hell happened. Can someone decode the turn of events of this Fete last book of gardens of the moon???


Thanks!!

[Dolorous Menhir]

Raest was woken at his tomb. He started walking towards the city, where his Finnest (source of most of his power) had been hidden, in order to lure him there.

Five dragons left Moon's Spawn and flew to Raest, then fought him in a delaying action to stop him reaching the city. Raest proceeded to whip the dragons big time.

Then Kruppe went to sleep at the Fete (he was seen sleeping at a critical time), and via some kind of trick Raest was moved into Kruppe's dreamworld. Also present in the dreamworld were K'rul and Tool. Raest turned down K'rul's offer to travel the warrens together. Tool proceeded with dismembering Raest, who is powerless to resist in Kruppe's dreamworld, only for Raest to jump from that body to Mammot, a guest at the Fete. Kruppe wakes up, since the dreamworld is pretty pointless now.

Mammot had been under Raest's control from the point when he fell into a coma earlier in the book. Possessed-Mammot went on something of a killing spree at the Fete, until encountering some resistance from Derudan, Quick Ben and (most significantly) the wrong end of a cusser.

In the meantime, the Finnest became the seed of an Azath house. Now, it is a serious weakness of the first book that this "Azath" appears with no explanation, but suffice it to say that it is kind of natural defence mechanism for the world, which collects and imprisons dangerous (i.e. powerful) individuals. They seem to spontaneously appear in response to serious dangers, such as the release of a Jaghut Tyrant like Raest. Can't remember if this part is a spoiler for later books, but it is not significant if it is:

Spoiler

The Deadhouse in Malaz City is another such Azath, notable for being the home base from which Kellanved built his empire.

After being blown away by the cusser, the spirit of Raest is "taken" by the Azath. He has been neutralised.

At around about this time, the Malazan soldiers put two and two together and realise that their plan to cause mayhem by blowing up critical parts of the city fails to take into account the gas network throughout Darujhistan. Not wishing to destroy the entire city (which they want for its wealth after all), they put a stop to the detonation of the mines.

That covers pretty much everything you ask about, I think.

[Raymond Luxury Yacht]

thompsjt1;184549 said:

I am in "The Fete" section of gardens of the moon and am completely confused on the whole part from the awaking of the Jaghut and come out of nowhere dragons, to some sort of confrontation with Kruppe?? yet he was in the city and then ends up where the Jaghut is, then is back in the city again and everyone starts bumping into each other and there seems to be mass confusion at the Fete in the city and then people start loosing body parts and blood is everwhere and quick ben mentions the gas below the city and the jaghut is possessing people.........This is all my understanding of all this mess and I have no clue what the hell happened. Can someone decode the turn of events of this Fete last book of gardens of the moon???


Thanks!!

You're not the first person to be confused by this book.

[thompsjt1]

LOL,

That explained a bunch and I appreciate it. Even though the explnations don't really tell me much, I guess I just have to take its word for it and these things will be explained more in detail in later books to make some sort of cohesive sense. The Azath house is mentioned in this book and it was created where the acorn "Finnis" was buried in the ground. Rallock went inside the house, but Rake's people were following him and said it being called "deadhouse" and said they could not enter it for some reason. I guess the deadhouse gates book will get into this more??? I hope it doesnt make things even more confusing or I'll never "get it"

please tell me the books are organized better in these next books to follow and explain things when it mentions somthing new instead of just saying somthing with no explination what so ever.??

[caladanbrood]

I would recommend re-reading the section, more slowly - now that you know what's coming, you might be able to understand it better.

Lots of things happen in Erikson's stories that you won't understand for another two or three books. Don't sweat it, just revel in the uncertainty:)

[Dolorous Menhir]

thompsjt1;184612 said:

LOL,

That explained a bunch and I appreciate it. Even though the explnations don't really tell me much, I guess I just have to take its word for it and these things will be explained more in detail in later books to make some sort of cohesive sense.

Gardens of the Moon is often described as a poor introduction to the series. A reader has to have a high tolerance for being bombarded with new material with no real explanation. Later books are much much better at this, by design I think. Erikson isn't holding your hand and spelling out every detail, he is parcelling out the story in very controlled chunks and relying on you to piece it together. It's one of the pleasures across the series to read about something and over time put together the explanation in your mind.

Personally, I wasn't sold on the series until the second book. I borrowed them all from the library on my first time round, so it didn't cost me anything to see what happened next. I can see why someone paying for it would be a bit reluctant to buy Deadhouse Gates if they were disappointed with GotM.

Quote

The Azath house is mentioned in this book and it was created where the acorn "Finnis" was buried in the ground. Rallock went inside the house, but Rake's people were following him and said it being called "deadhouse" and said they could not enter it for some reason.

The following includes information about the Azath that isn't in GotM, but I don't really consider it a spoiler. It doesn't reveal storylines, just explains what exactly was going on.

The Azath grew up around the Finnest. Azath Houses can actively trap and imprison nearby powerful creatures (as it did with Raest), and it will automatically capture powerful beings who enter its garden (each Azath is a house surrounded by a distinct garden area). People can walk up the path to the door, but it will only open for a very few people. Rallick Nom was one of those, the Emperor Kellanved was another. No-one can predict who gets to enter an Azath, or why.

Clearly there was some significance to Rallick being allowed to enter. Once the door was open, Vorcan was admitted too. The Tiste Andii pursuing could not enter the grounds of the house, because they would almost certainly not be admitted to the house, and would run the serious risk of being captured.

Quote

I guess the deadhouse gates book will get into this more??? I hope it doesnt make things even more confusing or I'll never "get it"

Deadhouse Gates has some wonderful storylines that are clearly explained. You begin to develop an understanding of the Malazan universe, and it's set in a bit more of a real-world environment (a rebellion & a military campaign).

Quote

please tell me the books are organized better in these next books to follow and explain things when it mentions somthing new instead of just saying somthing with no explination what so ever.??

They are better organised. But there are still plenty of things that go unexplained - otherwise this forum wouldn't be here to discuss them.

I would definitely say that nobody complains about complexity once they have read Deadhouse Gates and further. There are plenty of people with complaints about GotM similar to yours, but you never hear the same arguments once they get past the second book. Perhaps those people never get past GotM, but I would prefer to think it is because the books get better.

[thompsjt1]

Dolorous Menhir;184631 said:

Gardens of the Moon is often described as a poor introduction to the series. A reader has to have a high tolerance for being bombarded with new material with no real explanation. Later books are much much better at this, by design I think. Erikson isn't holding your hand and spelling out every detail, he is parcelling out the story in very controlled chunks and relying on you to piece it together. It's one of the pleasures across the series to read about something and over time put together the explanation in your mind.

Personally, I wasn't sold on the series until the second book. I borrowed them all from the library on my first time round, so it didn't cost me anything to see what happened next. I can see why someone paying for it would be a bit reluctant to buy Deadhouse Gates if they were disappointed with GotM.



The following includes information about the Azath that isn't in GotM, but I don't really consider it a spoiler. It doesn't reveal storylines, just explains what exactly was going on.

The Azath grew up around the Finnest. Azath Houses can actively trap and imprison nearby powerful creatures (as it did with Raest), and it will automatically capture powerful beings who enter its garden (each Azath is a house surrounded by a distinct garden area). People can walk up the path to the door, but it will only open for a very few people. Rallick Nom was one of those, the Emperor Kellanved was another. No-one can predict who gets to enter an Azath, or why.

Clearly there was some significance to Rallick being allowed to enter. Once the door was open, Vorcan was admitted too. The Tiste Andii pursuing could not enter the grounds of the house, because they would almost certainly not be admitted to the house, and would run the serious risk of being captured.



Deadhouse Gates has some wonderful storylines that are clearly explained. You begin to develop an understanding of the Malazan universe, and it's set in a bit more of a real-world environment (a rebellion & a military campaign).



They are better organised. But there are still plenty of things that go unexplained - otherwise this forum wouldn't be here to discuss them.

I would definitely say that nobody complains about complexity once they have read Deadhouse Gates and further. There are plenty of people with complaints about GotM similar to yours, but you never hear the same arguments once they get past the second book. Perhaps those people never get past GotM, but I would prefer to think it is because the books get better.

Dolorous Menhir, I thank you very much as you have answered my questions quite thorougly. I feel confident now that gardens has its problems and things get better from there. The whole new material with no explination was getting to me and I have my friend reading this book too although he is a few chapters back and it was getting to him, but at least we now know it is a big flaw in this first volume. I already have deadhouse gates ordered as many people have said that you can't judge this series until you have read the 1st two wither you will like it or not. My library does not carry these books, I would have to interlibrary loan from somewhere else, but I actually got a Like new condition of the hardback of gardens of the moon for only $2.95 + $3.75 for media mail shipping, so I got a good deal there. I am anxiously waiting the next book.

Thanks again!!!

[Tif the Barber Boy]

I'm another one who wasn't really sold on the series till I read Deadhouse Gates. Mind you, I enjoyed GOTM, it was just that too many of the characters weren't filled in well enough, and there was plenty of stuff I didn't fully understand. Luckily the sheer energy of the narrative just kept me reading through.

[GardenGnome]

Actually, Dolorous Menhir is wrong. GotM is absolutely brilliant, nothing wrong with it at all (except all those things that doesn't make sense in the later books, such as the magic-deadening effect of the T'lan Imass).

[Bottle]

GoTM was the fourth book I read in the Malaz series, I found it a doddle

[natakamus]

The order I read the books in is very messed up;
GotM, MoI, DG, HoC, tBH, MT. After I finished them all once, I went back and read them in order.

minor *spoilers*

There is a lot in GotM that does not make sense when compared to the rest of the series. First, the magic-deadening field of Tellan that's around Tool. Tool is not a Bonecaster, so how is he able to do this? When Tellan is used by other Tlan-Imass, why doesn't magic blow people up like it did Bellurdan & Tattersail?

How did an Azath house grow from the Finnest?

Spoiler

There are plenty of parts in later books with deadlier convergences than in GotM, but no Azath houses show up to contain them. In fact, quite the opposite in MT.

Of course some plot points are very critical towards the series arc, and are referred to again many times in the future. Other plot points are conveniently forgotten, or explained away deus-ex-machina style

Spoiler

like Dujek & Whiskeyjack's conversation about Laseen's Gambit and Tayschrenn's motivations in MoI

[mmdw45]

RE: your second spoiler (the deus-ex-machina), I prefer to think of that as another example of unreliable opinions. There are plenty of characters throughout the books who express opinions that turn out to be just plain wrong, e.g. (MoI spoiler)

Spoiler

Picker's opinion of Quick Ben's (lack of) utility as a combat mage. Never seen him really let loose, suspects it's not really within his capability. Boy does she ever turn out to be wrong.

-Max

[blewin]

yes, that's one other thing which distinguishes SE from other authors. What the characters know and agree on doesn't necessarily mean it's true and correct! and think about it, it's the same in the real world. In life, people often form erroneous judgements because they only see one side of things. People don't always tell others everything about themselves, their motivations of their actions.

natakamus;185782 said:

The order I read the books in is very messed up;
GotM, MoI, DG, HoC, tBH, MT. After I finished them all once, I went back and read them in order.

wow, that's chaotic!! you were constantly ahead and going backward.
I've a tendency to always start a series from book 2 onwards (because book 1 is never around for some reason....). Now I'm convinced that I'm not the worst, but somehow, that isn't comforting... :cool: