[Abyss]

Abyss, on 11 October 2022 - 06:21 AM, said:

JM Straczynski's AMAZING SPIDER-MAN run. About 15 floppies in so far.
DAMN this is is some fine fine comics.

Still reading this. I don't think i've ever enjoyed Spidey comics this much (aside from Spiderverse). I finally understand why ONE MORE DAY pissed off fans so much.
Once upon a floppy, 'street level' heroes didn't interest me, and solo stories were dull in comparison to team books. Now i'm utterly engaged by Spidey's relationship with New York and New Yorkers (he's strolling down a building, a guy on a balcony casually shares his popcorn w him; he's car surfing, a cop gives him a ticket just to mess with him); Peter's efforts to help underprivileged kids in his old high school; and yes, even his relationships with MJ and Aunt May (who is so much more interesting here than in her old doddering 'don't forget your galoshes' role).

In between i've also been catching up on the XBooks leading up to/around the second HELLFIRE GALA. WOLVERINE's Deadpool story stayed consistently fun right thru. X-Force is engaging but meandering. X-MEN is great action... i see why some dislike the writing but it doesn't bother me. NEW MUTANTS... as much as i adore Illayana/Magik in her current badass Captain sorceress role, i'm not certain we needed to revisit her time in Limbo just to give her a new look and slightly different sword. Also, putting Madelyne 'oh Inferno was just a big misunderstanding' Pryor in charge of anything is as about as smart or reasonable as trying to reform Sabretooth for the sixth time and acting all shocked and surprised when he eats everyone. MARAUDERS is just barely ok. The overarching Orchis/Nimrod/Krakoa v the world/Phalanx story is meandering entirely too much. I see that a resolution is rumored for next year.

Also jumped back in time to the WOLVERINE AND THE XMEN Jean Grey School era to finish out the run. The Xmen cast are what they are, but the students are great and it's too bad only Kid Omega advanced to main character status.

I need a DC read next, suggestions welcome. Considering a LoSH run.

[Abyss]

JUSTICE LEAGUE: NO JUSTICE... there were many comics published by DC in 2018. This was four of them.

It appears this was to be a scene set following the Dark Nights Metal event. I suppose it was. A scene was certainly set. Badly. Evil ancient entities something something JL has to work w villains everyone runs around babbling technobabble and, i dunno. This was two or three stock plots - ancient evil giant gods, heroes and villains have to work together, punching cant fix the problem must use bravery - redigested and barfed back onto four LS issues with mediocre art to move it from A to B. Snyder, Williamson, and Tynion have all done massively better work elsewhere.

This went directly into the 2018 JL series, which i have now read from floppy 1 thru the DROWNED EARTH story that was a thinly veiled promo for the AQUAMAN movie released at the time.
Things start well enough, new JL lineup that is the old JLU cartoon lineup, solid art, the main plot is a macguffin from the above LS but ok fine we're moving fwd... the writing gets the characters, the interplay between Bats and Supes as friends, WW and Aquaman as royal outsiders, on some level it feels as tho the cast could be any heroes plugged in and this would work equally decently, which is damning w faint praise but i cut justice league books a lot of slack because they've been around forever and its hard to reinvent the hoverwheel every four years or so. Also, i have a nostalgic fondness for the Legion of Doom as villains, and the writing does a solid Lex Luthor and Joker playing off each other and the clever but too brief inclusion of the Batman Who Laughs as the cause of Luthor and Joker's schism. Still Batman with four broken limbs fighting Sinestro, Grodd, and the Joker in Luthor's old green-purple armor is a treat. Too bad we only get one page of it.

Things really kind of fall apart during the Drowning Earth thing. The earth is invaded by three ancient evil entities, distinct from the No Justice evil ancient entities. It has a few fun moments, notably boosts Mera to the main cast, and, naturally, hits the reset on Aquaman so someone can write him with tattoos and a tan in time for the movie. Fill in art is weak, plot is poorly explained macguffin quests. Meh.

Good return to the main storyline tho, w the Joker taking out the entire Legion of Doom out of sheer spite - this i enjoyed. Hopefully the book stays strong for the rest of the run.

[polishgenius]

I read Tom King's Supergirl: Woman of Tomorrow miniseries. That was great. I was a little unsure how King would translate to more adventury superhero stuff after the off-kilter family stuff he became famous for, and I gather he faceplanted completely on Heroes in Crisis, but he fucking nailed this one. Full-on epic space fantasy adventure quest.

[Abyss]

Abyss, on 07 November 2022 - 03:02 PM, said:

JUSTICE LEAGUE...the 2018 JL series,... Hopefully the book stays strong for the rest of the run.

Narrator: It did not.

Stuck w this all the way through to the end of the DARK KNIGHTS DEATH METAL massive huge epic crossover to end all crossovers til the next crossover crossover with much crossovering and prologes and epilogues and side stories.
And now i feel stupid. And kind of a masochist.

Mind, i would have felt massively stupiderest had i spent money on these floppies rather than marathoning thru the DC app, but otherwise wow that sucked. Sure, there were a few cool moments, a few fun exchanges, a couple of neat concepts for old characters but otherwise this was just a sprawling mess w little in the way of coherent story or any point other than squeezing every red cent out of readers. It may have been worse than Infinite Crisis, tho Superman didn't sing anyone to death this time.

Except for Jarro.

SPOILER FOR MAGNIFICENCE

Spoiler

I now love Jarro, the greatest new DC comics character to be created since roughly 2000 or so. Jarro needs his own series.

[QuickTidal]

The more they let Scott Snyder write in the DC milieu after Batman (a title he was exceptionally good at writing) the worse I felt he was out of his depth overall.

His Justice League run is mostly bad.

Tynion adds nothing to temper Snyder's more pedestrian ideas.

Snyder was a good Batman writer, and his independent work is usually VERY good...but yeah he was not the right choice for JL.

[Abyss]

QuickTidal, on 05 December 2022 - 06:57 PM, said:

The more they let Scott Snyder write in the DC milieu after Batman (a title he was exceptionally good at writing) the worse I felt he was out of his depth overall.

His Justice League run is mostly bad.

Tynion adds nothing to temper Snyder's more pedestrian ideas.

Snyder was a good Batman writer, and his independent work is usually VERY good...but yeah he was not the right choice for JL.

And it bothers me esp bcs individually they are both excellent writers, and both can effectively do a big story w a big cast.
But this... to be fair i am certain they were working w a level of editorial direction and mandate neither had during their earlier work... it's just... the end result was bad comics.
REALLY bad comics. Like, they literally rehashed the 'ancient beings show up to destroy Earth' plot three times in a row and it just got messier every time they broadened the story. And along the way they ripped off Rock of Ages a couple of times just for good measure.

To cleanse my brain i returned to Marvel and resumed JMS's AMAZING SPIDER-MAN... which was going great til it got written into CIVIL WAR. I've read Civil War, it was fine, i have no need to reread it.

Now i was going to jump ahead and do a Spider-Verse reread then Spidergeddon, but Slott's currently doing a third Spiderverse storyline so i'm going to wait on that and see about some old school Daredevil instead.
Probably.... that Neil Gaiman comics humble bundle i just got is kind of calling to me.

[polishgenius]

I liked Death Metal more than I did the original DK Metal, mostly because it seemed clearer and had a bit more room to breathe. But it was basically the same comic which was already not original. And BMWL is just the wrong villain for it. He makes no sense as the primary antagonist to a WW-led cosmic epic. Even if you didn't want to lead with Darkseid, which I understand because it was Rock of Final Crisis enough already as Abyss said, there are other options to have slid into that role. Snyder just fell way too in love with the character, who should have been done - for now at least- with his self-titled book.

[Abyss]

polishgenius, on 06 December 2022 - 11:47 PM, said:

I liked Death Metal more than I did the original DK Metal, mostly because it seemed clearer and had a bit more room to breathe. But it was basically the same comic which was already not original. And BMWL is just the wrong villain for it. He makes no sense as the primary antagonist to a WW-led cosmic epic. Even if you didn't want to lead with Darkseid, which I understand because it was Rock of Final Crisis enough already as Abyss said, there are other options to have slid into that role. Snyder just fell way too in love with the character, who should have been done - for now at least- with his self-titled book.

DK did the 'darker alt versions' thing, and did it ok enough w the Batman theme around the League and others. DM tried to go 'look we go EVER DARKER' and just didn't. Different, but not better and not more original, and winding the entire thing into yet another 'ancient evil being wants to rule the universe'... historically we've had the Anti-Monitor (twice), Alex Luthor and SupermanBoy Prime (twice), Parallax (twice i think), Darkseid (six or seven times)... and hell the lead ins were based on TWO sets of THREE acient evil big bads from beyond....
So making the DM Big Bad way taller and female wasn't all that novel, and Lex Luthor's heel face heel face wait no face no heel really heel so much heel no face he's a good guy again only evil no wait... was just tiresome. And the dooknob of destiny was so so dumb and Kendra's wings spontaneously generating maps made no sense and John Stewart alternated between rings frequently in the same floppy and if Superman was supposed to be turning into Darkseid's heir DC forgot to tell oh... everyone writing every book except for a few pages towards the end there. Black Lantern Batman had a few moments but if they ever explained how he set that twist up i missed it. WW's invisible chainsaw of truth was not nearly the kewl idea someone thought it was.

The Batman Who Laughs... i thought that character was an interesting addition to DK but has been way WAY overplayed since and this story amping him up to Darkseid level just didn't work... tho I did enjoy how thoroughly disgusted the Joker was at his involvement, but even that was ruined by having the Joker generically stand w the heroes at the end bcs Superman asked nicely... no, just no.

And most of the crossovers were poorly written crap, and most of the side stories were barely even that. Poor Nightwing... every time one of these line wide messes comes around he ends up on some stupid side quest that comes to nothing so he can run back to the main story to be there when Batman does... something.

Just.... a sad reminder why Big 2 comic love tends to have a shelf life.



Now, seven issues into Tom Taylor & co's SEVEN SECRETS and i like comics again. Great art, great characters, fun concept - a secret society protects seven secrets that can destroy the world in the wrong hands; each secret is guarded by a keeper and a holder, and the newest holder has no time at all before the society comes under deadly attack. Cue 'splosions, wild action, world travel, guns, swords, magic, friendships, family... it's so simple and so damn fun and manages at least one genuine plot twist and/or heartbreak per floppy.

[polishgenius]

I do suspect that my enjoyment was helped by reading the two big events without any of the JLA run in between (and only the trade collection so some of the side stuff you seem to be referring to didn't make it in). Didn't get quite as bored of the repetition or random ass-pull superpowers.


But really like I said at the time I first read it it feels like both big-two prestige lines and big events have devolved into 'BIG THREAT FROM OUTSIDE THEN UNIVERSE. BIGGER THREAT FROM OUTSIDE THE UNIVERSE'. Marvel maybe wears it a tiny bit better just coz Hickman is a bolder writer than Snyder in how he presents it, but his Infinity crossover from a few years ago was a lot worse than either of these imo so... the fun in both 'verses is definitely in the smaller, unlinked stuff now. Like I say, Supergirl is a bop of a comic book and the Son of Kal-el story I read in summer was, despite the main villain's plot being unoriginal as heck too, very well presented overall.

[T77]

Abyss, on 07 December 2022 - 03:36 AM, said:

polishgenius, on 06 December 2022 - 11:47 PM, said:

I liked Death Metal more than I did the original DK Metal, mostly because it seemed clearer and had a bit more room to breathe. But it was basically the same comic which was already not original. And BMWL is just the wrong villain for it. He makes no sense as the primary antagonist to a WW-led cosmic epic. Even if you didn't want to lead with Darkseid, which I understand because it was Rock of Final Crisis enough already as Abyss said, there are other options to have slid into that role. Snyder just fell way too in love with the character, who should have been done - for now at least- with his self-titled book.

DK did the 'darker alt versions' thing, and did it ok enough w the Batman theme around the League and others. DM tried to go 'look we go EVER DARKER' and just didn't. Different, but not better and not more original, and winding the entire thing into yet another 'ancient evil being wants to rule the universe'... historically we've had the Anti-Monitor (twice), Alex Luthor and SupermanBoy Prime (twice), Parallax (twice i think), Darkseid (six or seven times)... and hell the lead ins were based on TWO sets of THREE acient evil big bads from beyond....
So making the DM Big Bad way taller and female wasn't all that novel, and Lex Luthor's heel face heel face wait no face no heel really heel so much heel no face he's a good guy again only evil no wait... was just tiresome. And the dooknob of destiny was so so dumb and Kendra's wings spontaneously generating maps made no sense and John Stewart alternated between rings frequently in the same floppy and if Superman was supposed to be turning into Darkseid's heir DC forgot to tell oh... everyone writing every book except for a few pages towards the end there. Black Lantern Batman had a few moments but if they ever explained how he set that twist up i missed it. WW's invisible chainsaw of truth was not nearly the kewl idea someone thought it was.

The Batman Who Laughs... i thought that character was an interesting addition to DK but has been way WAY overplayed since and this story amping him up to Darkseid level just didn't work... tho I did enjoy how thoroughly disgusted the Joker was at his involvement, but even that was ruined by having the Joker generically stand w the heroes at the end bcs Superman asked nicely... no, just no.

And most of the crossovers were poorly written crap, and most of the side stories were barely even that. Poor Nightwing... every time one of these line wide messes comes around he ends up on some stupid side quest that comes to nothing so he can run back to the main story to be there when Batman does... something.

Just.... a sad reminder why Big 2 comic love tends to have a shelf life.



Now, seven issues into Tom Taylor & co's SEVEN SECRETS and i like comics again. Great art, great characters, fun concept - a secret society protects seven secrets that can destroy the world in the wrong hands; each secret is guarded by a keeper and a holder, and the newest holder has no time at all before the society comes under deadly attack. Cue 'splosions, wild action, world travel, guns, swords, magic, friendships, family... it's so simple and so damn fun and manages at least one genuine plot twist and/or heartbreak per floppy.

Agree about 7 Secrets. Reminds me I need to read vol 2.

[Abyss]

polishgenius, on 07 December 2022 - 07:16 AM, said:

I do suspect that my enjoyment was helped by reading the two big events without any of the JLA run in between (and only the trade collection so some of the side stuff you seem to be referring to didn't make it in). Didn't get quite as bored of the repetition or random ass-pull superpowers.


But really like I said at the time I first read it it feels like both big-two prestige lines and big events have devolved into 'BIG THREAT FROM OUTSIDE THEN UNIVERSE. BIGGER THREAT FROM OUTSIDE THE UNIVERSE'. Marvel maybe wears it a tiny bit better just coz Hickman is a bolder writer than Snyder in how he presents it, but his Infinity crossover from a few years ago was a lot worse than either of these imo so... the fun in both 'verses is definitely in the smaller, unlinked stuff now. Like I say, Supergirl is a bop of a comic book and the Son of Kal-el story I read in summer was, despite the main villain's plot being unoriginal as heck too, very well presented overall.

Your assessment of the devolution is bang on and really just frustrating now because it's near impossible to enjoy a run without having it broken by garbage. I could live w it if the crossovers were good - the xbooks are mostly managing that during the Krakoa era - but most are the opposite.


I could see jumping from DK to DM and skipping the inbetween saving a lot of irritation. ....a LOT because dear gods No Justice and Drowning Earth were just BAD comics being bad, i could practically feel the writers' and artists' pain at having to do this and the lack of given fucks radiating off the pages.



Tho it's interesting that you thought these were better than INFINITY. I ack Infinity was yet another 'aliens invade, Earth heroes save everyone' and even the Thanos B-plot - villain takes advantage of alien invasion to conquer Earth - has been done at LEAST twice just in the Avengers that i can think of offhand, but Hickman kept the plot reasonably tight for what it was, the characters in character, the side bits relevant, and the impacts lasted years... say what one will about Marvel's (dumb dumb dumb) attempt to upsell the Inhumans (to sideline the mutant and FF books) but it gave us Ms Marvel, a few other new characters and status/setting changes that stuck a few years. The biggest impact of Death Metal was an even better reason to ignore DC's New52 mess and whatever that was w The Watchmen (OMG did they handwave that during DM).


The buzz around both Supergirl and Son of K put them on my list to read eventually once they have a few more months stocked on the app.

[Abyss]

T77, on 07 December 2022 - 03:36 PM, said:

Abyss, on 07 December 2022 - 03:36 AM, said:

...

Now, seven issues into Tom Taylor & co's SEVEN SECRETS and i like comics again. Great art, great characters, fun concept - a secret society protects seven secrets that can destroy the world in the wrong hands; each secret is guarded by a keeper and a holder, and the newest holder has no time at all before the society comes under deadly attack. Cue 'splosions, wild action, world travel, guns, swords, magic, friendships, family... it's so simple and so damn fun and manages at least one genuine plot twist and/or heartbreak per floppy.

Agree about 7 Secrets. Reminds me I need to read vol 2.

Stayed up WAY too late last night reading til issue 14 and yah, you really really do.

I'm noticing a thing about the art; it's done in an 'anime style' and it works well (blissfully without the 'emotional character drawn like a baby with massive eyes' or 'one huge drop of sweat' flourishes manga artists tend to use) for the action and for showing distinct and colorful characters. The comic is loaded w BIPOC and LGBTQ characters and not trying to be subtle about it - the Queen of England is an aboriginal Australian lesbian commando - but, on purpose i think, the art team seem to be actively drawing most of the characters in a gender neutral or subtle shifting m to f/f to m way. I noticed it initially w two characters and there was a logical in story if subtle explanation for the shift, but i'm noticing it w other characters who have distinctly gender neutral names and styles of dress. Its an interesting approach to see in action. It took me a bit to accept that maybe i am not supposed to identify a character as male or female because it doesn't matter to the story. I've read without problem any number of books now where characters are deliberately given neutral pronouns but it's the first time i'm encountering this in comics.

[Abyss]

Abyss, on 07 December 2022 - 04:27 PM, said:

T77, on 07 December 2022 - 03:36 PM, said:

Abyss, on 07 December 2022 - 03:36 AM, said:

...

Now, seven issues into Tom Taylor & co's SEVEN SECRETS and i like comics again. Great art, great characters, fun concept - a secret society protects seven secrets that can destroy the world in the wrong hands; each secret is guarded by a keeper and a holder, and the newest holder has no time at all before the society comes under deadly attack. Cue 'splosions, wild action, world travel, guns, swords, magic, friendships, family... it's so simple and so damn fun and manages at least one genuine plot twist and/or heartbreak per floppy.

Agree about 7 Secrets. Reminds me I need to read vol 2.

Stayed up WAY too late last night reading til issue 14 and yah, you really really do.

I'm noticing a thing about the art; it's done in an 'anime style' and it works well (blissfully without the 'emotional character drawn like a baby with massive eyes' or 'one huge drop of sweat' flourishes manga artists tend to use) for the action and for showing distinct and colorful characters. The comic is loaded w BIPOC and LGBTQ characters and not trying to be subtle about it - the Queen of England is an aboriginal Australian lesbian commando - but, on purpose i think, the art team seem to be actively drawing most of the characters in a gender neutral or subtle shifting m to f/f to m way. I noticed it initially w two characters and there was a logical in story if subtle explanation for the shift, but i'm noticing it w other characters who have distinctly gender neutral names and styles of dress. Its an interesting approach to see in action. It took me a bit to accept that maybe i am not supposed to identify a character as male or female because it doesn't matter to the story. I've read without problem any number of books now where characters are deliberately given neutral pronouns but it's the first time i'm encountering this in comics.

Just Finished aaaand they stick the landing. Series wrapped w floppy 18, very satisfying end, surprisingly upbeat happy. All major plots resolved, nothing important left dangling but a nice 'and the adventure contnues' note to end on.

SEVEN SECRETS is totally worth your time and money and is complete in 18 issues or whatever number of tpbs.

[Abyss]

Waid's DAREDEVIL run has been repeatedly reco'd to me, but I'm not feeling it.
I can ack the quality of the writing, the art is solid... it's the stories. Low stakes, low opposition... sure there are lives at stake and super baddies to fight, but thus far it's like, one life, and the baddie is kind of a joke to a more powerful hero. It's a step closer to street level hero than Amazing Spidey was, and it's losing me, just because my preferences are for something bigger.

[polishgenius]

At home over Christmas I went and bought Superman: Birthright, which it's about time and that was really good, a solid take on the Superman origin, and also volume 2 of We Only Find Them When They're Dead, Al Ewing and Simone Di Meo's cosmic space-opera thing. First one was good, this even better: the art is clearer and more iconic, and with the set-up done in the first book, I think they felt free to make the plot tighter and more focused in this. Seemingly just two creators growing into their work.

[Abyss]

If you happen to be a fan of the X-Men, i recommend this podcast to your attention:

https://www.connorgo...ith.com/cerebro

The host is a long time xbook fan. Each ep he picks a character, reads more or less their entire history (give or take an overtly garbage crossover or storyline), gets a cohost who has some connection to the character, and chats their way through the history (usually while drinking alcoholic beverages).

Connor is gay and much of the discussion is from his perspective as a gay man - it's not the focus but he's up front ("a homo and his friends discuss homo superior") about it. I enjoy the different perspective and also he's fncking funny.

The cohosts run from comics professionals like Anne Nocenti, Mike Carey, Tini Howard, Kieron Gillen, to individuals with interesting relevant perspectives, by example when he did an episode on characters Australian aboriginal Gateway and his grandson Manifold the cohost was an Australian Aboriginal rocket scientist who is also a long time xbooks fan and she was brilliant. Her thoughts on being an Aboriginal child in Australia, reading the Claremont Outback era UXM floppies were kind of mind blowing. To a white Canadian kid reading xmen comics Gateway was an interesting teleporter... to an Aboriginal... i can't even begin to explain but it was amazing to listen.

He and whoever cohosts really do the legwork to discuss a character, obscure appearances, other media, legacies, all of it. If you're long time xbooks fan, it's a treat because they goes WAY back to the early pre-Claremont and works forward to the week or so before the podcast. He also picks both main and obscure characters, so while it's fun to hear him discuss Storm or Nightcrawler, the episode about c-list villains (and also incestuous twin sibling nazis) Fenris is also a treat.

Worth a listen.

[Abyss]

AVENGERS ARENA.
I had heard of this series before, it didn't really inspire much interest - perennial loser assassin Arcade kidnaps a bunch of teenage heroes from various team schools and forces them into a Hunger Games/Battle Royale/Lord of the Flies thing.

A random twitter thread posted a couple of great panels and some rave comments, so i pulled it up on the MU app and was instantly dragged right in.

The setup is as blunt as it reads, but the characters are very well written and interact more or less how you expect/want superpowered teenagers from Avengers, Xmen, Runaways, and British superhero groups to behave.

The writings sets the stage very quickly that pretty much everyone is at huge risk. No reader expects Laura/Wolverine/X-23 to die, a couple of others are sufficiently established that they are likely (likely) safe, but everyone else is c-list at best and very disposable so the body count is way higher than your typical Marvel comic.

It's good comics fun, gloriously free of crossovers and tie-ins, 18 floppies. Worth a look.

I enjoyed it enough to start the sequel series AVENGERS UNDERCOVER by the same writing/art team.

[Abyss]

Abyss, on 21 February 2023 - 06:04 PM, said:

AVENGERS ARENA.... enjoyed it enough to start the sequel series AVENGERS UNDERCOVER by the same writing/art team.

....which was not quite as good but still fun, and wraps in ten issues without feeling quite as rushed as it must have been. A couple of the characters get more satisfying endings to their arcs tha others, but overall it's a decent coda to ARENA, again nicely self-contained w/out crossover stupidity.


Next up, Kirkman n co.'s FIREPOWER.

[Abyss]

Abyss, on 28 February 2023 - 09:13 PM, said:

...
Next up, Kirkman n co.'s FIREPOWER.

maybe i just may have kind of marathon'd the first four tpbs by accident and HOLYNINJAFUCKSTARS this is SO GOOD.

[T77]

Abyss, on 01 March 2023 - 03:58 AM, said:

Abyss, on 28 February 2023 - 09:13 PM, said:

...
Next up, Kirkman n co.'s FIREPOWER.

maybe i just may have kind of marathon'd the first four tpbs by accident and HOLYNINJAFUCKSTARS this is SO GOOD.

Glad you like it. I read the first trade or two, thought it was just OK and never returned to it.