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None of that would make any sense....except that I don't think Nok is telling the truth for whatever reason.
The old guard - who is who?
#61
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Posted 05 October 2005 - 06:59 PM
@ Imperial Historian.... ok - I'm worried now ........ have you turned into Tiste?
None of that would make any sense....except that I don't think Nok is telling the truth for whatever reason.
None of that would make any sense....except that I don't think Nok is telling the truth for whatever reason.
#62
Imperial Historian 
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Posted 05 October 2005 - 07:38 PM
Ok, one of my crazier theories then, thinking on it Nok not telling the truth would make more sense...
but i still think it's possible that some of the apparent discrepencies caused by people appearing before they should have been born are caused by them being named after someone else... after all does it seem plausible to you that no-one, has the same name (ok except pearl the demon and pearl the claw, and those named after there fathers), Se's an archaeologist, i'm sure hes thrown in some red herrings where people with the same name aren't the same person.
Oh and dujek is specifically referred to as 79? but looking younger in GotM
but i still think it's possible that some of the apparent discrepencies caused by people appearing before they should have been born are caused by them being named after someone else... after all does it seem plausible to you that no-one, has the same name (ok except pearl the demon and pearl the claw, and those named after there fathers), Se's an archaeologist, i'm sure hes thrown in some red herrings where people with the same name aren't the same person.
Oh and dujek is specifically referred to as 79? but looking younger in GotM
#63 Guest_Serric_*
Posted 06 October 2005 - 04:22 PM
I re-read the part where Nok was telling Tavore, and I noticed that he seemed pretty complacent about the death of his wife, which could be because he wasn't telling the truth, or that he wasn't hurting over it anymore (can anyone work out roughly how long it is between Hawl dying and Nok's telling?).
We know that Cotillion knew Hawl wasn't dead, and from Kellenved's reaction at seeing her we know that he knew too. If Nok was lying we can assume he knew...so who else might know? And does anyone else ever mention her?
Also, a little thing too think over is this...Ammanas says, when he see's Hawl's body, "How many times do our follower's have to die?". How is that meant to be taken? Is he saying about the fact that each of their followers is dying off one-by-one, or is it refering to the number of times a single follower dies? Does that imply that Hawl may in fact have died, and then be resurrected? If we take the bronze skin she has as being the same sort of thing as Gesler and co (on the edge of ascendency), could she have possibly ascended? Just a thought, cos every other person of the family that has really died has ascended...
We know that Cotillion knew Hawl wasn't dead, and from Kellenved's reaction at seeing her we know that he knew too. If Nok was lying we can assume he knew...so who else might know? And does anyone else ever mention her?
Also, a little thing too think over is this...Ammanas says, when he see's Hawl's body, "How many times do our follower's have to die?". How is that meant to be taken? Is he saying about the fact that each of their followers is dying off one-by-one, or is it refering to the number of times a single follower dies? Does that imply that Hawl may in fact have died, and then be resurrected? If we take the bronze skin she has as being the same sort of thing as Gesler and co (on the edge of ascendency), could she have possibly ascended? Just a thought, cos every other person of the family that has really died has ascended...
#64
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Posted 06 October 2005 - 04:36 PM
According to Admiral Nok he said his wife had died when Kellanved took Malaz City.... if the emperor reigned for 90 years.. then thats when Nok said she died. Well she obviously did not... so he's either lying or he's covering for her.
I don't believe she will be resurrected either. She didn't have bronze skin.. that was the captain with the gold eyes. Hawl was horrifically burned.
regarding Kellanved talking about followers dying I took that to mean both the Talon and the family. He doesn't really know a lot does he - about Keeper and so on....but then he did say we made them good at hiding..
I don't believe she will be resurrected either. She didn't have bronze skin.. that was the captain with the gold eyes. Hawl was horrifically burned.
regarding Kellanved talking about followers dying I took that to mean both the Talon and the family. He doesn't really know a lot does he - about Keeper and so on....but then he did say we made them good at hiding..
#65 Guest_Serric_*
Posted 07 October 2005 - 10:35 AM
Hetan said:
She didn't have bronze skin.. that was the captain with the gold eyes. Hawl was horrifically burned.
I stand corrected Hetan…
thanks for pointing it out, as its lead to something else now…The burned woman (Hawl) says to Cutter when he tells the marines on Drift Avalii of the Throne of Shadow:
“Ammanas and Cotillion are about to be usurped, and what of it? The Throne of Shadow – we ought the Edur for that! Oh, what a waste…”
This shows that Hawl had no loyalty towards Ammanas and Cotillion as she does not know who they are, or if she does know, it shows she has no loyalty to Dancer and Kelanved anymore.
Also, as she seems to be the squad mage, it means she must have re-enlisted like Fiddler…Hawl being a mage is something that wasn’t mentioned before in Nok’s speech either. And assuming Traveller is someone who was part of the 'family', why didn't Hawl regognise him...or would it have been too long ago for her to remember?
#67
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Posted 07 October 2005 - 12:07 PM
I agree with that IB....
hmm.. the captain knew who was the "one of power" which Cutter referred to... and I would have thought that if she knew Hawl did...
Cotillion to Cutter... "..... Rather, why was she with Traveller? What is the Talon up to? And Traveller.... gods, did he know who she was? Of course he did - oh, she's aged and not well, but even so..."
hmm.. the captain knew who was the "one of power" which Cutter referred to... and I would have thought that if she knew Hawl did...
Cotillion to Cutter... "..... Rather, why was she with Traveller? What is the Talon up to? And Traveller.... gods, did he know who she was? Of course he did - oh, she's aged and not well, but even so..."
