Malazan Empire: Help! What to read - Malazan Empire

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Help! What to read

#1 Guest_Dystran Hart_*

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 06:40 PM

Would be VERY grateful for any help on this .... I just can't decide!

I am looking for a stand alone or series similar to Erikson in so far that it is to be:

Well written, ie. not too ... simple .... ;

Has to keep me gripped (i read small amounts at a time);

Importantly, have a large range of powerful characters / character interactions. When i say interactions i mean either physical battling, conversational wit, political or miltary tactics (mixture of all is great!). I really do not like the one hero versus one bad guy at the end scenario (which is why I like Erikson so much!) and I much prefer having lots of character 'challenges' throught the book rather than a slow build up to oone at the end.

Finally, if the recommendation is a series it needs to be finished - or finished within the next 6 to 12 months (rules out GRRM sadly).

Current thoughts are:

Coldfire Triology by Friedman (hate the covers though lol)
Black Jewels Triology byAnne Bishop
Prince of nothing books by Bakker (will this be a triology?)
Black Ice Triology - JV Jones

Any rough outline to these books would be much appreciated. Also, if anyone has read more than one of the sets i would be interested in your preference!
I ma currently leaning towarrds the Coldfire triology!


Bakker


The book covers put me off (i know i know, not sensible) but the Coldfire Triology
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#2 User is offline   Brys 

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 07:16 PM

I haven't read the first two, but I've read the two others. Both are excellent, though Bakker is far superior and closer to Erikson.

R Scott Bakker's Darkness that Comes Before read like an Erikson book - it wasn't quite as complex, or as detailed, and it had more of a historical than militaristic leaning to it, but it is still by far the closest novel I've read to Erikson (and I've also read Glen Cook, a great influence on him).

Unfortunatley, neither Bakker's nor Jones' trilogies are complete, but I think Bakker will be finishing his soon, probably within the next year. I couldn't say the same for Jones though, as I haven't heard anything on it. From what I've heard of the others, Bakker is by far the best choice on the list, especially for an Erikson fan.

Others you may want to consider include:
Glen Cook's Black Company (Finished I think) - a great influence on Erikson, though quite a lot simpler

Steph Swainston's The Year of Our War - I think it may be part of a series, but it is definitely a standalone as well. A mix between New Weird and Epic fantasy. Simpler than Erikson, but very well done. Quite a bit of "character interaction" in it.

Fritz Leiber's Lankhmar books - focusing on the character and action side of things, these are the best sword and sorcery books around, about Fafhrd and the Gray Mouser, with a range of stories ranging from the very moving and well written, to extremely humourous ones. I was recommended it by Ainulindale, in part because he compared it to Erikson in his top 101 list. Lacking the complexity of the Malazan world (but then, I can't think of any which doesn't), but some of the best "character interactions".

Some which I'd recommend whatever the circumstances, though less like Erikson:
China Mieville's New Crobuzon books (The Scar, Perdido Street Station, Iron Council) - start off with the Scar, which is the easiest to get into, though it's the second published. It's not a series, they're just standalones set in the same world.
Mervyn Peake's Gormenghast - great on the character interactions. A difficult but worthwhile read, and a true classic of the genre
Roger Zelazny's Chronicles of Amber - Great characters and an excellent, original plot
M John Harrison's Viriconium - Second in quality of writing and atmosphere only to Peake, an excellent sequence of four books.
Michael Moorcock's Elric - I don't know if it's complete, but there are so many books in it it doesn't really matter, because they all have proper endings anyway.

But of those you've got in that list, I'd recommend Bakker. The book covers don't really have much to do with the story at all, only that the person on the front may be one of the main characters, and the tapestry-like illustration may be suggesting that it is a pseudo-medieval Europe world.
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#3 User is offline   Karsa Orlong 

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Posted 04 August 2005 - 10:41 PM

I can only recommend to read Bakker and Bishop at one time. Both books are enjoyable reads. I'd say that Bakker is definitely closer to Erikson than any other Author i have read so far. He also created a very detailed world with interesting conflicts and gripping characters.
Anne Bishop's Black Jewels trilogy is a fast paced and quite dark novel but not without humor. It is a world where women rule and powerful males are seldom and often those few are sold into slavery (there is a lot of talking about sex in those novels [nothing too explicit but comparing with other fantasynovels its enough *g*] and also some dark aspects of it like rape and such, so consider you forewarned if you are touchy about those subjects!).
Another very good read imho are Michelle West's Books. She started with the Hunter duology (Hunter's oath and Hunter's death) and continued in the same world with her Sun Sword sixtet (finished now). If you like well developed characters and a deep worldbuilding this is for you. But be warned, these are not fast paced books! She describes artfully and i love that but for some people this is boring...so if you look for action every second page, this is not for you ;-)

Oh, btw...have you read Georg R. R. Martin? His "A song of ice and fire"-Books? If not, this is definitely another "must-read". The first book in the series is called "A game of thrones". I am sure you will find enough reviews of these books on the internet :-)

Cheers
Karsa
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#4 Guest_Alric seVinta_*

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 05:36 PM

ColdFire is a pretty good trilogy. It certainly features one of the greatest modern anti-heros in fantasy. It isn't overly complex, but it is well written and it is complete.

Bakker is much more along the same line as Erikson. The series is to be a trilogy, and the final book is due to be out in January. There are a number of key characters, and there are a great deal of different confrontations, from emotional, intellectual and physical. This is certainly worth a read.

I will certainly echo the China Mieville recommendation. His novels Perdido Street Station and The Scar are amongst my favorite speculative fiction novels. Though, I'd argue that one should start with Perdido and then move onto The Scar.

A stand alone historical fiction novel that you should check out, any Erikson fan should, is Stephen Pressfield's The Gates of Fire, which is the story of the Spartan military campaign in the battle of Thermopylae. It focuses on a company of Sparta's military elite and their doomed and glorious stand against the million man Persian army. It's a great read.

Surprisingly enough, I'm going to suggest an author and series that most people consider science fiction, but I will stand by this recommendation. Read Dan Simmons' Ilium and Olympus. It's an amazing, and complete, two-book series. A great portion of the action is an interesting retold version of the Trojan war. There are really three parallel stories going on in the novel... and it is simply amazing.

Another great, recent and completed series to check out is Gene Wolfe's [i]The Wizard Knight/i]. It's a two book series written by a true master of speculative fiction. The story is an old-style quest novel about a knight out to prove his name and take his place as a true hero. Amazing.
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#5 User is offline   Brys 

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Posted 05 August 2005 - 06:08 PM

I second the recommendation for Gates of Fire as excellent historical fiction. Tides of War was pretty good as well.

For Mieville, it doesn't really matter which you start with. I started with the Scar, and it made no difference (except that unlike most people, I prefer Perdido Street Station to the Scar a little).The Scar was more accesible and less strange than Perdido, I think. But Iron Council should probably be read last, because he doesn't explain much at all about New Crobuzon itself, or about the races, and his style has completely changed by then, which polarises opinion more than the other two, and of course, it's his weakest New Crobuzon book (meaning a lot better than pretty much any other major fantasy author writing in the last 10 years with the exceptions of Steven Erikson, R Scott Bakker and George RR Martin).
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#6 User is offline   ObsoleteResolve 

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Posted 06 August 2005 - 02:36 AM

I personally will be the voice of dissent. Bakker did nothing for me. I might finish it, eventually, but not soon (The Darkness...).

That said. Anne Bishop has much love from me. Glen Cook can never get enough love from me- he is absolutely great. If you like the Bridgeburners, the Black Company's goin' to make you drool.

I'd also suggest my latest flavor of the month (since I'm poor, I don't have a flavor of the week anymore. It's monthly, sadly): Sean Russel. The Swans War, while it does have a flavor of Robert Jordan in some aspects (the set up of the major three characters, reminscient of Rand, Mat, and Perrin) but without the overwhelming suck. He's good. Very, very good. I also read his duology (WHOOO! TWO BOOKS, FINISHED!) Beneath the Vaunted Hills/Compass of the Soul and it was damned good as well.

And, on that note: Alaan and Eremon rock in The Swans War Trilogy. Erasmus Flatter in the duology also rocks. He's the protagonist. He's a BOTANIST. Who's a protagonist?!?

.david
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#7 User is offline   tickhill43 

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 01:12 PM

If you only like reading in small amounts why don't you try 'City of Saints & Madmen ' by Jeff Vandermmer.

Its a brilliantly written collection of 4 novella sized stories and alot of shorter stories.

Other smaller sized books of high quality are the Paul Kearny books or the Black Company novels by Glen Cook. Both of these authors are admired by Erikson and you can see the simiralities with Glen Cook especially

If you would rather have longer more epic fantasy I have to reccomend anything by Stephen Donaldson, Robin Hobb or Gene Wolfe. They have the advantage of having alot of complete works out and in my opinion all of thier works of of the highest quality available.
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#8 User is offline   Topper 

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Posted 19 August 2005 - 06:08 PM

I'd recommend the Farseer Triology by Robin Hobb. It is intresting and one learns to really love the main character.

I'd also recommend The Fionavar Tiology by Guy Gaverial Kay. I found it okay/good, but I know a lot of people who loved it.
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#9 Guest_Izz_*

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Posted 21 August 2005 - 12:39 AM

Out of those, get either The Prince of Nothing or The Coldfire Trilogy. Bakker is newer, but Friedman is classic. I couldn't get into that series by Bishop, and Jones' work is subpar. Oh and just get GRRM anyways.

I'd also suggest reading some Robert E. Howard if you haven't. Tons of his stories are jumbled together in new editions for each character: Conan, Solomon Kane, and Bran Mak Morn, maybe some others.

Howard was a great writer.

I'll list some other complete series to you - some of which I don't like or haven't even read (just to give you ideas):

Crown of Stars by Kate Elliott
Monarchies of God by Paul Kearney (Erikson loves this guy)
The Chronicles of Thomas Covenant by Stephen R. Donaldson (this is good)
The Sun Sword by Michelle West
Exiles by Melanie Rawn
The Farseer Trilogy by Robin Hobb (I need to get into her still)

All of these have fans here.
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