[Keysi]

Regarding the fight between Mok and Tool, was Mok just outright better than him or was Tool also pretty done in and busted up by then? I can remember that Tool had pretty much been through hell and high water by that point, but then again so has pretty much everyone.

Also, do we get to see more and learn a lot more of the Segulah? They are among my favorites so far, mainly because humans being inferior to other races/powers is a bit of a theme of this series and the Segulah can compete with just about anyone.

[Aptorian]

As it stands, yes, Mok outclassed Tool. You could argue that Tool was beat up but really, T'lan Imass are made to ignore damage and the Seguleh are just that good.

As for more Seguleh, yes, you will hear more. Mainly in the Esslemont books.

This post has been edited by Apt: 08 November 2015 - 11:24 AM

[Andorion]

Keysi, on 08 November 2015 - 11:13 AM, said:

Regarding the fight between Mok and Tool, was Mok just outright better than him or was Tool also pretty done in and busted up by then? I can remember that Tool had pretty much been through hell and high water by that point, but then again so has pretty much everyone.

Also, do we get to see more and learn a lot more of the Segulah? They are among my favorites so far, mainly because humans being inferior to other races/powers is a bit of a theme of this series and the Segulah can compete with just about anyone.

Yes, Mok was better than Tool. Tool is very hardwearing and can take a lot of punishment, but Mok was an order of magnitude better. Think back to when the Seguleh took out the k'ell hunter, and Tool told Toc he could not have done what Mok did

[Keysi]

I'm quite buzzin' to eventually learn more about the Segulah. Their culture seems very interesting plus I want to know how they all managed to get so good at fighting. As anyone who has ever learned martial arts, or indeed any skill whatsoever knows, the way you get better is practice over time. And Tool had 300 thousand years in which to train. If a 14 year old worried him and he was beaten by Mok who would have been a twenty or thirty something-presumably-, well there's bound to be an interesting reason behind it.

[Itwæs Nom]

Keysi, on 16 November 2015 - 06:25 PM, said:

I'm quite buzzin' to eventually learn more about the Segulah. Their culture seems very interesting plus I want to know how they all managed to get so good at fighting. As anyone who has ever learned martial arts, or indeed any skill whatsoever knows, the way you get better is practice over time. And Tool had 300 thousand years in which to train. If a 14 year old worried him and he was beaten by Mok who would have been a twenty or thirty something-presumably-, well there's bound to be an interesting reason behind it.

Thats seriously weird, I think youre first here who wants to know more about them


Maybe you should ask doctor for help

[Abyss]

I always took it that Tool didn't get better once he went undead. He was First Sword of the Imass before the Ritual and that's a huge deal, but he didn't get better skilled over the millennia, other than the basic benefit of not tiring and ignoring wounds.
The Seguleh otoh, you know as if the end of MoI, are basically a warrior cult who train from childhood, and it would appear their training is better than the Imass'.

[worry]

I think it might just be SE's pro-fencing bias. He prefers the nimble bladesman.

[Siergiej]

@worry: Now that you've mentioned that, an interesting idea came to my mind. It's not just SE but also ICE who has a 'pro-fencing bias'. So I'm wondering: maybe the bias comes from the mechanics of tabletop RPGs they played together? These games are designed to be balanced, so a fencer is as good as mage or archer, and well developed fencer with lots of experience (and there's no shortage in Malazan) is a dice roll away from slaying a god... or a dragon, or anything. Nothing that adds too much to the Mok/Tool discussion, but interesting to think to what extent the roleplaying experience affected character development in MBotF.

Also, welcome back after a long break. I usually spend here a couple of months after each new Malazan novel by SE, but I'm just so anxious for Fall of Light that I had to come back earlier

[worry]

As far as I know, ICE hasn't mentioned he fences IRL, but there may have been hobby osmosis from SE. And yes I agree that the RPG element of the story permeates the series, deliberately, even if mostly in winks and nods.

[Siergiej]

Event if he's not a fencer himself, they both seem to favor expert swordsmen

[Kanese S's]

Abyss, on 17 November 2015 - 03:50 AM, said:

I always took it that Tool didn't get better once he went undead. He was First Sword of the Imass before the Ritual and that's a huge deal, but he didn't get better skilled over the millennia, other than the basic benefit of not tiring and ignoring wounds.
The Seguleh otoh, you know as if the end of MoI, are basically a warrior cult who train from childhood, and it would appear their training is better than the Imass'.

Yeah, kinda my take as well. I think it's mentioned somewhere in the books that in terms of speed and agility, Tool or some Imass actually got slower after the ritual... though being able to shrug off sword blows that would kill anyone else is a big advantage in return.

It certainly seems like Tool didn't get better after the ritual, as that would mean progression... which is something that T'lan Imass kinda don't really do.