Malazan Empire: Just Finished - Malazan Empire

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Just Finished

#21 User is offline   Gorefest 

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 03:37 PM

Well, you can argue about the implementation of course. I assume ICE went for the mystery angle to add some intrigue to the story. Who is this guy? Hang on, surely not Rake? Tease tease. Final reveal: ah, not Rake after all, it's Spinnock. Everyone rejoice. It could have been handled in all sorts of different ways and in the end that will also come down to personal preference and author's choice. But having a Tiste Andii thread in there and weaving them into the fabric of Wu with the inclusion into the Pact I personally don't have any problems with.

I do dislike how ICE often tries to make or keep things vague even when it doesn't serve a storyline purpose anymore, such as the persistent split in the reader base about whether or not Jethiss actually was Rake after all (I personally really don't think so, but that discussion plays out in a different thread), but in principle I do appreciate a little mystery chucked into the mix and don't find it particularly galling or misplaced. It serves a purpose, you can debate about the implementation of it. But as far as issues with Assail go, this was a minor one for me.
Yesterday, upon the stair, I saw a man who wasn't there. He wasn't there again today. Oh, how I wish he'd go away.
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#22 User is offline   Nevyn 

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 04:41 PM

I think Jethiss and the Tiste belong in the story, and the prior references to Spinnock and Rake discussing Assail indicate a level of interest in what goes on there.

But I agree that the introduction of Jethiss was shoddy and kind of lazy. You could argue it is SE's fault for moving on from Spinnock without mentioning how he comes out of the battle at the gate, I guess.

As for Spinnock vs Rake, I'm pretty sure its Spinnock, but thats another one of my pet peeves. Jethiss remembers who he was, and for no good reason at all still won't give Fisher a straight answer just because ICE and SE like leaving things ambiguous or hinting instead of flat out saying.

But the Seerdomin hint to me is pretty clearly Spinnock. He mentions spending evenings together, not just playing the game, so some sort of proxy game by Rake makes no sense. Plus, yeah, having it be Rake totally makes his grand sacrifice useless. Also, Jethiss nevers says he was dead, just that he wandered lost, Still sucky for him to go from wandering lost to (not) drowning.
Tatts early in SH game: Hmm, so if I'm liberal I should have voted Nein to make sure I'm president? I'm not that selfish

Tatts later in SAME game: I'm going to be a corrupt official. I have turned from my liberal ways, and now will vote against the pesky liberals. Viva la Fascism.
When Venge's turn comes, he will get a yes from Mess, Dolmen, Nevyn and Venge but a no from the 3 fascists and me. **** with my Government, and i'll **** with yours
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#23 User is offline   Shadow Knight 

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 06:11 PM

Ya as I said have no problem with an andii bein involved just how was done, Jethiss (as a character arc) just made no sense in my opinion, the hole mystery as you suggest didnt really happen atal Gorefest, was more like "oh god this better not be Rake, to just relief it wasnt Rake at the "reveal" which as Nevyn said was very poorly done, and left seemingly ambiguous for no reason, that said I agree with Nevyn that the seerdomin reference makes the rake/spinnock debate redundant, not sure how could be argued its rake after that.
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#24 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 02 April 2015 - 09:29 PM

I've said it before and I'll say it again. It was never ever ever going to be Rake. That is Fisher's issue, not the reader's. You might even say Rake chose Spinnock in the first place. Why else would he send him to scout Assail? Rake had an interest there. Spinnock is his his chosen successor, likely affirmed when Rake communed with Dark and by all inference influencing Mother Dark's choice. Rake's hand is in this covenant as much as MD's is, and it's his long game being played out to large degree.
They came with white hands and left with red hands.
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