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Do you know any WELL KNOWN Religious stories? Need input! As much as possible!

#21 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 05:44 PM

Yeah, the Left Behind series is to be avoided if you have any vestige of actual taste, there's a really good breakdown of why they suck armadillo balls by a devout Christian blogging guy out there and I can't remember the name of the guy's site, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah
Hello, soldiers, look at your mage, now back to me, now back at your mage, now back to me. Sadly, he isnít me, but if he stopped being an unascended mortal and switched to Sole Spice, he could smell like heís me. Look down, back up, where are you? Youíre in a warren with the High Mage your cadre mage could smell like. Whatís in your hand, back at me. I have it, itís an acorn with two gates to that realm you love. Look again, the acorn is now otataral. Anything is possible when your mage smells like Sole Spice and not a Bole brother. Iím on a quorl.
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#22 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 08:27 PM

Not to overstate this, but it sounds like you're writing the most transgressive, rebellious, faith-shattering, iconoclastic work of fiction ever written!
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#23 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:12 PM

View PostIlluyankas, on 06 February 2013 - 05:44 PM, said:

Yeah, the Left Behind series is to be avoided if you have any vestige of actual taste, there's a really good breakdown of why they suck armadillo balls by a devout Christian blogging guy out there and I can't remember the name of the guy's site, aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah


HaHa really? Fuck y'all have no idea how annoyed I used to get when these were coming out when I worked at Sams Club and BAM. I'd get asked 20 times a day where the books were located.
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#24 User is offline   Illuyankas 

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Posted 06 February 2013 - 09:14 PM

They're heavy handed enough to make Macros look like a tequila worm.
Hello, soldiers, look at your mage, now back to me, now back at your mage, now back to me. Sadly, he isnít me, but if he stopped being an unascended mortal and switched to Sole Spice, he could smell like heís me. Look down, back up, where are you? Youíre in a warren with the High Mage your cadre mage could smell like. Whatís in your hand, back at me. I have it, itís an acorn with two gates to that realm you love. Look again, the acorn is now otataral. Anything is possible when your mage smells like Sole Spice and not a Bole brother. Iím on a quorl.
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#25 User is offline   Acorn 

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 12:19 AM

View Postworrywort, on 06 February 2013 - 08:27 PM, said:

Not to overstate this, but it sounds like you're writing the most transgressive, rebellious, faith-shattering, iconoclastic work of fiction ever written!


I aim to please?

Honestly I hope it is. Because then it would at least be as well written and designed as I hope it to be... But who knows, it could just come off as a horrible attempt to reinvent the wheel as it were. I will be happy to share when I get something other than background written! I'm getting close to that point as it is - I can develop further history as I go, for my own or for the story's sake. I'm going to work on the setting next.

I'm thinking something in the realm of the Prince/King of Thorns - but with less dislocation from the present day. Which is to say Earth in the future, geologically different and post-technology. They didn't explain the reason behind the loss of technology and such, but there is still another book coming. The Book of the New Sun also dealt with an Earth far into the future with more potent as well as less technology (fliers but few electric lights and such). I think I've read another book recently with a similar setting.

I'm uncertain how much I wish to change, how much I want to remain the same nor exactly how far I want to spread across the world. I regret to say that I am not familiar with as many lands/cities/etc as I wish to be. A side effect of being broke =p... But in most scenarios of the world in the future, my city would be under water (east coast of Florida)... So I'll have to find somewhere else to center the story.
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#26 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:08 AM

Book of The New Sun was great. I love Gene Wofe.
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Posted 07 February 2013 - 01:41 PM

View PostAcorn, on 07 February 2013 - 12:19 AM, said:

I'm uncertain how much I wish to change, how much I want to remain the same nor exactly how far I want to spread across the world. I regret to say that I am not familiar with as many lands/cities/etc as I wish to be. A side effect of being broke =p... But in most scenarios of the world in the future, my city would be under water (east coast of Florida)... So I'll have to find somewhere else to center the story.
Could always turn it into some kind of Venice - building artificial islands and a sea wall's not too difficult. Plus if submersion was gradual, I've always envisaged that the lower stories of old apartments could be filled with concrete as a quick makeshift artificial island. Although I do acknowledge Venice doesn't have the problem with hurricanes that east Florida can, so is more ideally situated for a semi-aquatic city.
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#28 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 09 February 2013 - 06:08 AM

I imagine there erosion simulators out there on the net somewhere you could look at and get an idea. Worth a try anyway!
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#29 User is offline   Acorn 

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 06:44 PM

Ooh. I hadn't thought about that!

I'm thinking of a rather bleak "reset button pushed down twice" type of thing... One major disaster, then decades later a second, somewhat worse one.

Would be able to justify a lot of changes that way - but the erosion simulator idea is pretty cool, I'll give that a go 'round.

Also - I loved the Book of the New Sun, barring some obvious problems... I liked the Mirrors stuff, that was pretty intriguing... I'm generally not into Sci-Fi writing all that often, but the science in it made me start thinking about other stuff and possibilities etc.

I also liked the Empire of Thorns (? Is that what it's called?) - mainly the rediscovery of "old" technology and how effective it was (ie nuclear power)... I figure a mixture of that and the New Sun using-old-stuff-day-to-day-with-no-understanding... (ie living in sky scrapers that survived the destruction) would make the most sense logically. People would continue to use what they found, but after a time things would begin to be lost, forgotten or used the wrong way/for the wrong purpose/reason.

I've seen a lot of the Discovery/National Geographic channel stuff on Doomsday Preparing and Surviving the Apocalypse type stuff - and it all assumes that people will have the reasoning and mental fortitude to work toward positive goals... Aside from the Preppers who are preparing for invasion, assaults and sieges by frantic people.

Anyhow - I will be reworking a fresh religion into the mix "after the end" so to speak. It should be interesting.
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#30 User is offline   Gwynn ap Nudd 

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 04:54 AM

View PostBriar King, on 06 February 2013 - 04:15 AM, said:

I dont know the author but the 1st book in the series is called Left Behind I think? Ive never read them and have no interest in doing so but I know that they were VERY popular when they were coming out at the time in early 2000 or so. Its about the Apcolyspe.

Never read those. Ever. I haven't finished the thread yet, so I have no idea if anyone has told you so, but never read them. Unless you want a bit of a laugh about how overboard people can go when trying to sell things.

IIRC the entire point of the books was to encourage people to adopt the faith as defined by Evangelical Christians. I think even some of the book jackets carried an interview with the priest who wrote them, proclaiming that this was the intention (I know there are interviews and such that do).

In short, they are poorly written and unless you are a diehard Christian with low writing standards (I doubt you would be on these forums if you had low writing standards) or someone who wants to get a laugh out of poor writing, give them a miss. I did read the first couple books at one point, and it was worse than Goodkind.

There are great books out there that deal with some of the popular stories in the Bible, such as Joseph Heller's retelling of the story of David in "God Knows" or Gore Vidal's "Live from Golgotha", but the "Left Behind" series is not one of them.

Edit: I see that Acorn and others said the similar things about the Left behind series as I did in less words. Cool. I'll leave the post here anyway as there two books I mention at the end are worth reading for anyone who wants to go into that vien.

This post has been edited by Gwynn ap Nudd: 17 February 2013 - 05:01 AM

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#31 User is offline   D'iversify 

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 05:58 PM

View PostGwynn ap Nudd, on 17 February 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

There are great books out there that deal with some of the popular stories in the Bible, such as Joseph Heller's retelling of the story of David in "God Knows" or Gore Vidal's "Live from Golgotha"
Michael Moorcock's Behold the Man, a science fiction revisionist account of the crucifixion, is really worth checking out.
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#32 User is offline   Acorn 

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Posted 17 February 2013 - 09:29 PM

View PostGwynn ap Nudd, on 17 February 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

There are great books out there that deal with some of the popular stories in the Bible, such as Joseph Heller's retelling of the story of David in "God Knows" or Gore Vidal's "Live from Golgotha", but the "Left Behind" series is not one of them.


Alright, I'll add those to my research list! - Thanks

View PostD, on 17 February 2013 - 05:58 PM, said:

View PostGwynn ap Nudd, on 17 February 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

There are great books out there that deal with some of the popular stories in the Bible, such as Joseph Heller's retelling of the story of David in "God Knows" or Gore Vidal's "Live from Golgotha"
Michael Moorcock's Behold the Man, a science fiction revisionist account of the crucifixion, is really worth checking out.


Never heard of that either - I'll give it a go 'round. I was actually going to avoid the crucifixion scene all together for a while. Might be worth diving into farther down the line if it could explain or justify a twist or turn.

I'm getting excited about this - but I'm still reading the hell out of some of the books mentioned to me in my "Need more books to devour" thread - right now I'm reading (slowly) the Takeshi books, I'm generally not a Sci-fi fan in book form, but I REALLY liked Morgan's Land Fit for Heroes. I read those before the others because they had a more Fantasy feel to them rather than primarily Sci-Fi.

I've also got the Prince of Nothing books - I started to read that (I tend to read up to 12 different stories at a time, including audio to keep my mind sharp remembering all the minor details of plot and personality and such) but I am getting angry that he kills off so many people so quickly. It's one of the reasons I despised the Game of Thrones books. But Bakker has a lot of good religious splintering and design throughout so far, so it will be a good experience.


But now I have a couple more to add to the list - besides I can read those now too, if I can find a copy somewhere locally!


Oh! And I was curious if anybody knows about any really fascinating political or religious figure in the recent past? (Preferably dead, as blaspheming against live people seems to garner severe law suits in the US) I'd like to enfold some of them into this scheme. I've already linked a few people or occurrences to the story so far, but I'm always looking to expand into other figures and parts of history.

I don't plan on using any historic figure that caused massive deaths or destruction. There could be an argument to include a couple - and as history is not my best subject I'm open to suggestions as to who could be used. So feel free.

=)
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#33 User is offline   Macros 

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 03:44 PM

It could be argued surely that Christ and many other religious figures caused deaths in the millions due to religious wars and other such otherist nonsense
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#34 User is offline   Acorn 

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 08:54 PM

View PostMacros, on 18 February 2013 - 03:44 PM, said:

It could be argued surely that Christ and many other religious figures caused deaths in the millions due to religious wars and other such otherist nonsense


I'm not certain how much blame you can place on a religious figure that has been used and abused to JUSTIFY such acts.

I don't recall any information about Christ himself killing and maiming people, let alone millions. However, he has been the excuse of thousands to justify their hungry for theft, rape, murder and pillage... That doesn't even include their "Divine Right" to steal lands and cultures and beliefs from hundreds of races and peoples.


I do understand what you meant - but I can't blame the person Jesus Christ for the acts his "followers" perform in "his name"... To an extent some people do need to be blamed for things done in their name - but only when they directly encourage such things.

Christ was far from a warmongering teacher. He didn't exactly show much tolerance - but there is a large difference between not being tolerable of other ways and outright killing people over them... I'm not partial to stupidity, but I don't kill too many people here in Florida. =p

But again, I do get it - there are instances where said figure SHOULD be blamed for things followers do.
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#35 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 09:07 PM

How recent? David Koresh was very recent, Jim Jones a little less so -- they caused deaths, but not on the order of millions or anything. Joseph Smith & Brigham Young, L. Ron Hubbard, Sri Sathya Sai Baba (among several controversial gurus who may have abused their influence).
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#36 User is offline   Gnaw 

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Posted 18 February 2013 - 11:12 PM

View PostAcorn, on 11 February 2013 - 06:44 PM, said:

Ooh. I hadn't thought about that!

I'm thinking of a rather bleak "reset button pushed down twice" type of thing... One major disaster, then decades later a second, somewhat worse one.

Would be able to justify a lot of changes that way - but the erosion simulator idea is pretty cool, I'll give that a go 'round.

I've seen a lot of the Discovery/National Geographic channel stuff on Doomsday Preparing and Surviving the Apocalypse type stuff - and it all assumes that people will have the reasoning and mental fortitude to work toward positive goals... Aside from the Preppers who are preparing for invasion, assaults and sieges by frantic people.

Anyhow - I will be reworking a fresh religion into the mix "after the end" so to speak. It should be interesting.


Fermi Paradox

Carl Sagan pointed out that technological progress occurs faster than social progress. So X% of civilizations that reach the point of being able to escape their world will blow themselves up instead. Even postulating civilizations that have a social progress as advanced as technological will still off themselves by accident.



View PostGwynn ap Nudd, on 17 February 2013 - 04:54 AM, said:

View PostBriar King, on 06 February 2013 - 04:15 AM, said:

I dont know the author but the 1st book in the series is called Left Behind I think? Ive never read them and have no interest in doing so but I know that they were VERY popular when they were coming out at the time in early 2000 or so. Its about the Apcolyspe.

Never read those. Ever. I haven't finished the thread yet, so I have no idea if anyone has told you so, but never read them. Unless you want a bit of a laugh about how overboard people can go when trying to sell things.

IIRC the entire point of the books was to encourage people to adopt the faith as defined by Evangelical Christians. I think even some of the book jackets carried an interview with the priest who wrote them, proclaiming that this was the intention (I know there are interviews and such that do).

In short, they are poorly written and unless you are a diehard Christian with low writing standards (I doubt you would be on these forums if you had low writing standards) or someone who wants to get a laugh out of poor writing, give them a miss. I did read the first couple books at one point, and it was worse than Goodkind.



I have never cracked the cover on one of those. But I love them. Absolutely love them. They put dominion christianity on the fiction shelf in a big way. And they're going to be absurdly subversive. Just think of all those parents forcing their children to read that shite.
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#37 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 19 February 2013 - 05:15 AM

Shit theres tons of fasinating political people from the past to look up. George Washingtion, John Adams, Thomas Jefferson...since we re both from USA. What about Churchhill and his fight against evil in human forum? Even though he was pshyco murderous bastard that Id personally kill happily Hitler was very charsimatic in his early reign(I know you said no people who caused death but this is hard to come by for the most part in this cat I think). Very distant past: Jules Ceasar, Octavian/Augustus, Marc Antoney, Cleopatra, Alexander The Great. This should give you lots of research.
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#38 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 08:39 PM

How's this project still going?
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#39 User is offline   worry 

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Posted 12 March 2013 - 09:18 PM

Uh haven't you heard? The Pope resigned.
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#40 User is offline   BfuckinK 

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 03:17 AM

Haha. Im just at a loss for a response to this one.
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