[worry]

http://www.dailybree...t-thomas-bridge

[Ulrik]

Pity, I liked him. A lot. RIP.

[Battalion]

he made some great movies. rip

[Tattersail_]

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

[Solidsnape]

Suicide is a selfish act.
I really feel for his family. I bet they're in hell right now.

[POOPOO MCBUMFACE]

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

A couple of sources are saying he was just diagnosed with terminal, inoperable brain cancer. Let's hold our judgement until we know all the facts.

[Tattersail_]

 POOPOO MCBUMFACE, on 20 August 2012 - 10:47 AM, said:

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

A couple of sources are saying he was just diagnosed with terminal, inoperable brain cancer. Let's hold our judgement until we know all the facts.

I was thinking he could have had news like this. If it was then that's a different discussion altogether. I hate suicide. I think it is a cop out. Miracles happen you know, but yeah I will hold out. The reason I said anything at all is because of all the responses to this news, they immediately feel sorry for him rather than those that he left behind.

[Solidsnape]

Yeah obviously if that is the case, then It was probably very hard time for him too.
Just saying, my view on suicide.

[Ulrik]

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

Never ever judge man who commits suicide in clear state of mind. You dont know him, you dont know his condition, you dont feel inside of his brain, you dont know his reasons... Simply dont.

[Tattersail_]

 Ulrik, on 20 August 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

Never ever judge man who commits suicide in clear state of mind. You dont know him, you dont know his condition, you dont feel inside of his brain, you dont know his reasons... Simply dont.

Clear state of mind? So you know he was in the right frame of mind when he decided to kill himself do you. You don't know him, you don't know his condition, you don't feel the inside of his brain, you don't know his reasons so you can't really come back at me with this bullshit.

I will wait to see what is said. Like I said it is a different discussion altogether if he is dying already and wants to save his family the grief of a long drawn out death.

MY opinion is that suicide is selfish. You condone it? That is up to you. What reasons do you have? Do you have an uncle that killed himself? I do. It's not pleasant, not when you got a huge family, cousins, wife etc that love you. There was no reason for my uncle to do what he did. No matter if he had money problems, or if someone accused him of something bad, he'll still get the support from his family and after a bit of time will realise life isn't that bad.

My grandad died of cancer. Really bad cancer, it took a while for him to go. He eventually died on his bed in the middle of his living room with us family there, crying and upset but we had prepared ourselves for his death we knew it was coming and we could deal with it in our own way.

If he went and jumped off a bridge it'd have been a harder pill to swallow for all of us, it would have been sudden and shocking and hard to forgive.

So shut it Ulrik unless you've got something better to say.

[Morgoth]

Might be, Tattersail, that you should take a deep breath and read Ulrik's post again.

[Ulrik]

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 11:47 AM, said:

 Ulrik, on 20 August 2012 - 11:38 AM, said:

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

Never ever judge man who commits suicide in clear state of mind. You dont know him, you dont know his condition, you dont feel inside of his brain, you dont know his reasons... Simply dont.

Clear state of mind? So you know he was in the right frame of mind when he decided to kill himself do you. You don't know him, you don't know his condition, you don't feel the inside of his brain, you don't know his reasons so you can't really come back at me with this bullshit.

I will wait to see what is said. Like I said it is a different discussion altogether if he is dying already and wants to save his family the grief of a long drawn out death.

MY opinion is that suicide is selfish. You condone it? That is up to you. What reasons do you have? Do you have an uncle that killed himself? I do. It's not pleasant, not when you got a huge family, cousins, wife etc that love you. There was no reason for my uncle to do what he did. No matter if he had money problems, or if someone accused him of something bad, he'll still get the support from his family and after a bit of time will realise life isn't that bad.

My grandad died of cancer. Really bad cancer, it took a while for him to go. He eventually died on his bed in the middle of his living room with us family there, crying and upset but we had prepared ourselves for his death we knew it was coming and we could deal with it in our own way.

If he went and jumped off a bridge it'd have been a harder pill to swallow for all of us, it would have been sudden and shocking and hard to forgive.

So shut it Ulrik unless you've got something better to say.

My dear, I wont shut it, even if you want it.
He made suicide note, witnesses said he did it without hesistation. It wasnt some harsh decision, he was succesful, secured, yeah, with family...and believe me, I have some history with suicidal people. You think those people have some ... duty to family? Duty to hold as long thay can, suffer as long they can, just because of large family wants them to exist in their life pattern?


Honey, taking rights of human to end his life in time he wants to is one of worse things you can do. I dont really analyze your uncle case - I could say something that will hurt you and I dont want to. Just two things (OK, maybe more).

- Maybe Scott did it because of cancer, maybe because mental condition. And if it was the second cause...I hope it wasnt. I dont know if you can imagine worst thing your own brain can do to you. There wont be some pretty TV-like family meeting and getting to "we will make it" or so. Its torment. Torment where you dont need family anymore or worse, when you see you are hurting your loved ones. Its personal hell where you cant be helped. It cant be compared to physical suffering, there is nothing that gives you some tolerancy to pain. It can be insufferable, tormenting, your itself tearing. And who the hell are you to say that he must say something, man up a suffer it for sake of another beings?

- You judged him. You knew nothing, completely nothing and said that se made family suffer. THIS IS SELFISH. Self-preservation is most stron ethological order. To turn him off, you need extreme situations. Really extreme. If you say that he just made family suffer, you are dishonesting him.



So please, shut your line of death relatives - I have my count too - and I would gladly lower it. It proves nothing, only that we all see death in our lives. In many forms and causes.

For me, normal person feels that to grown succesful man commit suicide, it means something big, painful. If someone muses about selfishnes, because family can solve everything...its just person who knows nothing. And I pray that you dont have to feel what some suicidal cases had to...

@morgoth: Thanks...

This post has been edited by Ulrik: 20 August 2012 - 12:43 PM

[Solidsnape]

I just think suicide in 99% of cases is selfish. Even if you've no family and nobody cares. Some poor rail worker has got to come and scrape your body off the tracks, or some lowly dock labourer fishing a body out the water.
It's not my idea of fun, and yet for everyone who kills him/herself there some unlucky bastard having to clean up the mess.
Of course the reasons for taking ones life are complicated and probably couldn't be understood by anyone else other than the victim anyway.
But that doesn't change my opinion.
The answer? Jump into a volcano.

As a 18 year old apprentice, I walked into the toilets at my company whilst on nightshift, to be greeted with a room full of people trying to save a guy who thought that cutting his wrists in the work toilets would be an excellent way to go.
Go he did. Dead.
I wasn't the first to find him, and I certainly don't know why he did it, but the guy who found him was fucked up for months(probably years) afterwards. This is MY experience, and of course there will be exceptions, there always is, but this is how I see the act of suicide.
I still feel for that guys wife and his small(at the time) child that they had together. Like I said, it's not black and white, and god only knows why he done it,
but it was a horrible sight, not one I'm likely to forget. I just don't expect to see that shit at work.
Selfish.

[Tattersail_]

@Ulrik

How about a goodbye? Goodbye brother. Goodbye Wife. Goodbye Kids.

You cannot get a good goodbye in a letter. I did not understand all of what you were trying to say (sorry), yet I think you agree to someone taking there own life and that they do not have a duty to the people that love them, their kids, their wife, their family.

Yes they do. If they don't then that is selfish.

[Ulrik]

No, its selfish to need them and force them to hang on despite any pain they must suffer. Yeah, saying "goobye kids, daddy is going to jump" is really best way to make it...

Im sick of this opinion. That even if the person is suffering, much more than any physical pain can inflict, despite living in hell, in your family-for-ever world, they must suffer. Because they are not free people. Let him be in pain, lets play same fake optimistic "we can make it". To my experience, that person is ALWAYS ALONE. You dont need pat on shoulder or kiss on forehead. If you come so far to seriously, after considerning all ways, taking your life...do you really think that you must suffer more? You must play loving family despite howling inside? Maybe it will transform you to actually hurting family. But thats probably OK.

Dear Tattersail. Sometimes there is no solution, no cure. I ´ve met people who was so damn in hell that they were not able to speak. Move. Until bright day where they could told about things people in normal condition cant understand. And no love, no huggin, no speeches about "we will make it together" can solve it. Its inside and usually, in some moment, you or your family cant bear it anymore...

So, if it is selfish by your standards, OK. Its something like saying to crisp burned deformed people that they will find true love...society need it. Assuring that there is key to overcome everything. There isnt. And sometimes, suicide is for those people freedom from constant inner pain, where only good time is sleep.

But telling to man, who has all resources, probably all love and so that he hasnt his own, serious reason and is selfish. Its foolish, rude and lacking respect. Because many times, you just cant imagine what many of those people went are still going through. Worse than foolish, its bloody evil.

@solidsnape - well, its about choosing the way... but same selfish is being sick...nurses must clean human waste, sometimes dead bodies. I would condemn any sickness But yeah, at work its...not right. Its overextension of your problems... Its not right. Many ways simply cant get rid of human getting in contact with remains, but...this is simply wrong.

This post has been edited by Ulrik: 20 August 2012 - 01:52 PM

[QuickTidal]

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 01:18 PM, said:

@Ulrik

How about a goodbye? Goodbye brother. Goodbye Wife. Goodbye Kids.

You cannot get a good goodbye in a letter. I did not understand all of what you were trying to say (sorry), yet I think you agree to someone taking there own life and that they do not have a duty to the people that love them, their kids, their wife, their family.

Yes they do. If they don't then that is selfish.

I think that the notion of a "goodbye" (though helpful to the family members) could perhaps be called a selfishness on the families' part to an extent, or at least that argument can be made from the POV of the suicidal person. The choice to end one's life is up to that person alone, they aren't really beholden to anyone. I'm sure there are situations in which the suicidal individual sees allowing a goodbye to family as something that will only make things worse for his/her family. Whether that is a right assumption would be subjective to the specific family. I personally know of families in which the prolonged dying of an individual was seen as too much to bear by those who would "say goodbye" and they wished it had occurred quicker and less painfully, even at the expense of a goodbye. I'm sure everyone has their opinion, as it appears you do...but I really think it's subjective to each person(s), and quite frankly a person decides what to do with their body and life. As long as the loved ones are looked after, in this case he was a prolific director who had a lot of money (his wife and children won't want for much) so they will be.

Having a gf who works in the health care field, it is well known that the mental state of people contemplating suicide is not one that can feasibly imagine saying goodbye to loved ones....as that is counterproductive to their goal.

Is it always going to be considered selfish as you seem to posit? What if an person's family were awful to them throughout their life? In that case is he still selfish to off themselves without the family knowledge?

Now, I'm not supporting the act of suicide as I feel life is pretty precious, but I'm also not going to think I know what's going on in a suicidal person's head, nor am I going to think less of them for making the final decision they made. That was their choice and they made it. It's up to their family to decide what to do with that.

From my POV, I wasn't there when my great aunt passed away last year. I didn't get to say goodbye to her in person. But as tough a death as it was, I spoke at the funeral about how she loved Swiss Chalet for dinner and I cried. And I went to her graveside a few weeks later and put a harlequin romance novel I'd bought (she loved them) on the plaque...and I said my goodbyes then and I cried again. I doubt having been there to say goodbye to her in person would have been any harder than it was at her graveside. Goodbye is always hard when people are gone...but the act of saying it...doesn't have to be said in person. It's something that transcends that and you feel it in your heart.

[Abyss]

MODGOD NOTICE OF if you want to argue about your relative theories on suicide, move it to the Discussion Board.

Tattersail, we don't tell people to 'shut it' just because we disagree with them here.

And Ulrik... addressing someone as 'Honey' and 'Dear' when you're disagreeing with them is condescending. Don't.

[D'rek]

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

I don't get it... is it less sad if his kids/wife are ugly?

[Tattersail_]

 D, on 20 August 2012 - 02:32 PM, said:

 Tattersail, on 20 August 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

He had two good looking kids and a wife. It is so selfish for someone to take their own lives like that. I liked his movies. I like his brother's movies too. I feel sorry for all the people associated with him who love him and will miss him.

I don't get it... is it less sad if his kids/wife are ugly?

No not at all. I could have left that part out. I saw a picture of them all and thought "what a nice family".

It's a sad day whatever way you look at it.

[worry]

Newlyweds, am I right folks?? You'll get that out of your system soon enough, Tats...then it's the ol' "Take my wife for example....PLEASE!!" routine.